Force 50 carb leaks out top

[ba_50]

Hello,<br /><br />I've got a 1987 Force 50hp outboard that leaks gas out of a jet on top of the carburator when idling. The motor has been sitting in the sun and only has about 15 hours on it. I'm guessing that the needle seat isn't sealing and gas is filling the carb and going out the jet. Is that correct? It looks like I should take a paper clip with a short bend and pull the seat out. Is that the way to do it? Is the coil spring necessary in the float bowl? This one is missing. Are parts hard to get for this motor. It usually takes 2 to 2 1/2 weeks to get them from Mercury Marine in Fon Du Lac. Is this a good motor or should I peddle it? Thanks. Bob

 

[eurolarva]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Please post your model number. I am not familiar with a spring for the float. Typically it is a taper pin that holds the float in position and gravity or fuel will cause the float to go up or down. A rebuild kit for that carb is 15 dollars from NAPA. The kit number is 18-7037. The kit comes with directions on how to adjust the float. It should not leak gss through the carb. Replace the needle valve and the seat and with the float adjusted correctly you should be okay.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

The model number is 507F7C SN# 2915.<br /><br />It is a coil spring that fits over the bolt that holds the float bowl on. I can't see any use for it.<br /><br />I noticed too that after replacing all the fuel lines, flushing out the fuel pump several times, putting an extra fuel filter on the fuel line, and cleaning the gas can and filtering the fuel, their is still a lot of dirt in the float bowl. <br /><br />Do you have any idea where it could be coming from? Thanks. Bob

 

[Docdoc]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

The coil spring is a new one on me. If it slides on the bolt before it is screwed in, it may be there to keep tension on the bolt like a lock washer would to prevent it backing out.<br />Take a good look at the "dirt". If it is black, it could be that your fuel line is so old that it is degrading inside and is winding up in the carburetor bowl. If that's the case, you need to replace all of your fuel lines<br />You may find some parts are hard to find. Force motors get a bad rap mainly because they use old technology. However, they are pretty darn easy to work on. Keep a good water pump in it, decarb the cylinders every now and then, and mix your oil and fuel properly and it will give you good service.

 

[rayiow]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

ba_50 i am reading your replies with interest as i understand about the spring as i am servicing my carb,as the engine has not been run for 3yrs mine starts without any choke but when i undid the bolt at the base of the fuel bowl aswell as a alot of bits being in the fuel bowl i also remember there being a springinside the housing where the bolt enters,after looking at a detailed diagram the spring holds the nozzle in but like yours(i think) when the spring is taken out the nozzle stays stuck in so i am also thinking as to what use the spring is doing,inside the nozzle is a thin pipe which presses against the nozzle and it is this which is preventing the nozzle from sliding out(is this what it is suppose to be doing?)your problem sounds like your float valve is not shutting off(prob bits in valve or adjust float maybe)and too much fuel is entering the float chamber causing excess fuel to flood out,i hope i am not stepping on anyones toes giving abit of advice but just trying to be helpful as i am looking at the same carb at the moment.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Ray,<br /><br />That's the only reason I can think of for the coil spring is that it keeps the bolt from coming loose. The $15 carb hit sounds like a great deal.<br /><br />I don't know where the dirt is coming from. With all new hoses and filters there shouldn't be any unless it got stuck in the fuel pump somehow. I don't like taking those apart as some are really complicated.

 

[eurolarva]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

The fuel pump on that motor is simple. Only a few parts. It could be the diaphram has blown apart or has been eaten away and that would explain your black chunks. Puel pump from NAPA is 9 bucks and can be done in about an hour. Pretty much a no brainer. Part number is 18-7806. Just replace the diaphram and the gasket. Dont mess with the three small gaskets for the fuel valves.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Eurolarva,<br /><br />Thanks for the advice. The diaphragm was hard as a rock and deteriated. The rough idle wasn't all the carbs fault I guess. I might have a motor that will last a long time.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Eurolava,<br /><br />I got a carb and fuel pump kit and got the pump taken care of. <br /><br />There is a problem with the carb kit (18-7037) though. I haven't opened it but I can see that there is only a needle and no seat. The brass seat that came in the kit is too big and doesn't have a fiber seat in it either. If fact, there is no fiber type seat in my carburator even though the parts catalog shows one. I was suprised that they didn't include a float support or needle spring either. <br /><br />I guess I will have to take it back. It might be that the dirt from the fuel pump was keeping the needle open even though I cleaned it several times. About the only thing might I need out of this kit would be the needle.<br /><br />What do you think?<br />Thanks.

 

[eurolarva]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

I have purchased 2 of those same kits and they came with a seat. You are talking about the seat for the needle valve? If memory serves me correctly it should be orange and made of rubber. It has a diameter of about 1/8 inch and is flat on one side and has a ridge on the other side.<br />Here is a link showing what the kit should have. Looks like the seat is on the right side<br /> 18-7037

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Eurolarva,<br /><br />I'm talking about the float needle seat.<br /><br />There is a very thin orange type gasket with a hole in it that is 1/4" across and I don't believe it goes in the needle hole but possibly underneith the brass seat that screws into the body. Mine has a pressed in seat. Isn't there a fiber type seat that goes in under the needle to seat against? There isn't a a fiber type seat under my needle, just brass. Is the rubber tip on the needle supposed to seal it? I have replaced tecumseh seats and they are thicker than this one if that tells you anything.<br /><br />Another thing that doesn't make sense is that if I adjust the float the way they say, the outside of the float will be right on the carb body, so it won't be anywhere near level.<br /><br />By the way, can you use ears to flush the motor or does it have to be submerged? Thanks again.

 

[eurolarva]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

The float needle and the seat were changed in about 2001. The old needles did not have a rubber tip and the nylon seat was replaced I believe with a rubber one as well. It has been over a year since I last did this so my memory of it is kind of vauge. Seems to me there were three different carbs described on the instructions and you had to identify your carb by the picture. Each one had a different setting for the float When you hold the carb upright and measure the distance between the casting and the float it should be 1/16 inch to 1/32 inch. Inverted is 13/32 inch. Seems to me I had to make this 1/2 inch or i could not get the needle to shut the fuel supply off when priming. Concerning the seat my manual says Remove the inlet seat retaining clip with an oring remover and remove the seat as well.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Eurolarva,<br /><br />I called NAPA and they ordered another kit so I will see what kind of seat they send. There wasn't any o-ring in the kit either. <br /><br />Since I found that little coil spring laying out by the motor after I bought it I will assume somebody tried to work on it and took out the seat and lost it.

 

[ba_50]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Eurolarva,<br /><br />I tried running the motor without a carb kit thinking it was dirt under the float needle that was letting too much gas in. <br /><br />It has stopped leaking fuel and runs smoother with the fuel pump kit put in. I guess the needle tip is what seals the fuel, not an insert below it. <br /><br /><br />Thanks for the help. Bob

 

[eurolarva]

Re: Force 50 carb leaks out top

Glad to hear you got it running. Carb kit is cheap and it dont hurt to have spare parts around. With all the ethonal gas now a days probably would not hurt to have a spare pump kit. When I replaced my fuel lines they were as hard as rock. I can only imagine the damage done to the rubber parts in the carb and fuel pump.