Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Xcusme

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

I think this is where's he's going.....<br /><br />
opennet.jpg
 

--GQ--

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Originally posted by Xcusme:<br /> I think this is where's he's going.....<br /><br />
opennet.jpg
you read my mind. Thanks <br /><br />Note: House panels are single phased. "A" and "B" are the same phase. I use the word "side" to differentiate the two.
 

Xcusme

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

I just knew I'd catch flack on the term Phase, I used it here only to differentiate between polarity, as one line rises the other line falls. :D
 

--GQ--

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Originally posted by Xcusme:<br /> I just knew I'd catch flack on the term Phase, I used it here only to differentiate between polarity, as one line rises the other line falls. :D
could've fooled me....<br /><br />dunaruna...i can save it in any format. point the way please...
 

Dunaruna

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Well, if the pic above doesn't help you - <br /><br />Save it as a JPG or GIF, register with photobucket.com, you will be given an online photo album (on their server). Upload your pics to your new photo album, each pic will be assigned an address called a 'URL' > right click the URL and 'copy'.<br /><br />start a new post on this thread > at the bottom of the screen is 'full reply form', click it > select 'image' > right click & 'paste'.<br /><br />Done.
 

Xcusme

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Originally posted by --GQ--:<br />
Originally posted by Xcusme:<br /> I just knew I'd catch flack on the term Phase, I used it here only to differentiate between polarity, as one line rises the other line falls. :D
could've fooled me....<br /><br />dunaruna...i can save it in any format. point the way please...
??? How So??
 

Ron G

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

I went to house that the main nutral got broke,she had 220 running trough some things and 110 through others fried her tv and a bunch of other things.
 

18rabbit

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

That’s a diag for a shared neutral. That will NOT put 240v thru a light bulb. Like I said above, take out the neutral/(ground) and you don’t have an active circuit regardless of the voltage, neither light bulb is going to shine, let alone one of them burn out from over-voltage.<br /><br />So, still not seeing it. How can a faulty neutral cause 240v to whip thru a light bulb??? Need better, more detailed diagram.
 

Paul Moir

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

The light bulb on the left is 60w and the light bulb on the right is 1500w. ;) <br />Oh, and the phases on most houses are 180° apart. When you have +170 on phase A you have -170 on phase B.<br />If you suspect an intermittant problem, call up the local utility. Usually they'll come in and put in a strip recorder for a couple of days as a free service.
 

ST

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

From the sketch above, this is how the 240Volts can occur(if Phase A circuit is opposite to Phase B)<br /><br />Phase A to Neutral=120V<br />Phase B to Neutral=120V (but opposite to phase A).<br /><br />If the the Neutral wires of Phase A and Phase B circuits are shared, and this shared wire is open to the Neutral bus; only then you'll have 240 Volts across the points indicated at "Phase A" and "Phase B". Result: one light bulb burn... then circuit opened... Replacing the light bulb at this point will certainly burnt it again.<br /><br />I am not an Electrician, and have not seen a scenario depicted above ever occured around my house, though.
 

levittownnick

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

This is how it works, looking at the diagram posted by Xcusme, The voltage drop across each lamp will be in inverse proportion to the wattage of the lamps. Therefore the lamp with the lowest wattage will receive the highest voltage, ie: if one lamp is 50 Watts and the other is 100 Watts the 50 Watt lamp will have 2/3 of the available voltage and the 100 Watt will have 1/3 the available voltage. For a 240 Volt Line to Line Voltage, the 50W will see about 160 V, and the 100W will see about 80 V. At that rate the 50W will blow out quickly and the 100W will last 10 years or more!<br /><br />If both lines are from the same "Phase" then the Line to Line voltage is Zero and neither lamp will light (or burn out).
 

--GQ--

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Originally posted by 18rabbit:<br /> That’s a diag for a shared neutral. That will NOT put 240v thru a light bulb. Like I said above, take out the neutral/(ground) and you don’t have an active circuit regardless of the voltage, neither light bulb is going to shine, let alone one of them burn out from over-voltage.<br /><br />So, still not seeing it. How can a faulty neutral cause 240v to whip thru a light bulb??? Need better, more detailed diagram.
I don't know how to explain it to you. The drawing is clear and direct. The transformer siting on the utility pole in your back yard is a single phase 240v. It has ONE winding(coil of continuous wire wraped around a magnetic iron core to produce electricy/voltage) naturaly have two ends being "A" and "B" . The voltage between the two points is 240v. To get 120v, a center tap (neutral) is added(smack in the middle of the winding). From the center tap (neutral) to "A" or "B" is 120v.<br /><br />Refer to the drawing again for reference. I noted two lights in my explaination for simplicity. In real life there may be more than just two wired in series and parallel to each other. In this situation the circuit will never be broken as long as you keep replacing the bulbs on at a time. <br /><br />Go to the drawing and trace the current flow from point "A" pass the first light to the "spliced" (three wires junction). At that point if the neutral is lost, the current has no where to go but thru the second light to point "B". As noted earlier, the voltage between point "A" and "B" is 240v. The two bulbs are now subjected to 240v. Since they are in series, the voltage will be divided fairly even if they have the same wattage ratings thus will not burn out prematurely. On the flip side if the two bulbs are of different wattage ratings, the higher wattage will get a bigger share of the votage beyond the 120v bulb rating and will brn out sooner.<br /><br />I think your problem maybe that you "think" the only way to get voltage is from "A" to neutral or "B" to neutral. Inaddition, voltage may also be obtained from "A" to groung, "B" to groung or "A" to "B". This ( "A" to "B" ) is the case scenorio in question. From the infos given; leads to this conclusion although rare.<br /><br />Note: House panels are single "phased" with only one winding thus doe not have any "phase" shift as suppose to 3 "phase" power which has 3 set of windings with 120 degrees of electrical seperation.<br /><br /><br />credit: EE USC class of 97
 

rodbolt

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

having watched a scene similar to the above described circuit and observing kirchoffs laws of current and voltage if you hook up a pair of 120 V bulbs and hit them with 240 not only will both go out when one pops one will pop rather rapidly.<br /> but thats why modern circuit breakers are divided into single or double pole breakers to help prevent that. the problems start when folks try to start piggy backing at the panel.
 

--GQ--

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

Originally posted by technoquiet:<br />
Originally posted by Ron G:<br /> Thats a very well written post GQ.
Thank the maker for cut and paste. ;) ;) :D
Professor Technoquiet, I feel so much love from you. I guess this is a chat forum where we may never find out about the person on the other end. I maybe a "bot" just caughing out infos. relating to the subject of discusion.Or I maybe just copying and pasting from somewhere. In either case you would have to have a complete understanding of the question/infos. given to be able to find an article to copy and paste from . Sometime a negative can be used to solidify a positive. But you know sometime, ther are real people out there looking to give and recieve aswell teach and learn. I used to look at my glass as half empty. Having been on this forum, it's now half full "er". As you were.
 

PAkev

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

The power company came the other day and looked everything over. They didn't find anything apparent but indicated they will be back next week to put a voltage monitor on the wires which will indicate if there is indeed any spike in voltage from the main service.
 

Richard Petersen

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Re: Help..light bulbs keep burning out

I think you said if you removed 1 bulb from a light fixture the others lasted much longer? That is a loose connection in the circuit. Could be a Neutral or the Hot, or both if the house is + 10 years old OR HAS Aluminum wiring. Someone is going to have to check each outlet, switch, and ceiling box for loose connections. Check them ALL. The wiring is looseing up. Can be very dangerous. Time to find it NOW.
 
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