Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

[tmh]

OK, I've read, posted, read and posted for months and learned a ton - thanks. NOW I'm getting ready to actually DO! My first project this fall is fixing the soft spots in my floor. It's a 19' Open bow I/O wood floor. and the only soft spots i feel are back by the jump seats.

I may want to just do the job as quickly and cheaply as i can to get OK results....maybe last 5 years or so, which is likely longer than I'll own it. It's a 20 yr old boat of minimal value ($3k purchase price, engine still good) so here's what I'd like to do. (I KNOW the "right" way to do it for the best job, because I've read tons of posts on this).

First, I'll remove the seats in the area i need to work on. Then I'll use a circular saw to cut away the soft area maybe out 2 ft, from the rotted area then across the width, leaving a 2" perimiter of original floor in that area. Then I'll use some epoxy coating like CPES (Rot Doctor) to strengthen the 2" perimiter and treat the "new" section of 5/8 (or 1/2 if that's what is in there now) plywood I cut to fit. Next, I'll screw the new section in place if the stringers are OK, which I think they likely are). Then i'll use the CPES or something like it to coat the top - one or two coats, especially where the old and new sections join.

Please comment on what material you'd use for the sealant (epoxy?) and also if you think it's just a bad idea to not do the entire floor the correct way. Personally, i don't see the need to lay fiberglass and all that for a fix that doesn't have to be perfect.

Just to add, EASY is more important to me than cheap. However, the boat isn't worth enough to have someone else do the job, or else i likely would go that route.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

cheap & easy, take the seats out, cut some ply to fit, screw down, caulk the edges and paint. thats cheap and easy, not right. but done all the time. you should see some of the boats i get.

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

Is paint much easier than epoxy or some other sealer? Would the epoxy also be easy enough>

I DO plan to dry all the underneath out before installing the new section, btw. May have some wet foam and the like in there. I'll tear it out if need be and replace it somehow. I've read lots on floatation foam and there are many opinions, but I'd be inclined to rough-cut some cheap sytrofoam or the like and put it in before the follr goes on.

 

[Mark42]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

Soft spots in the back? Its an I/O? Bet you will find the motor is bolted into a big pile of mush. Don't be too surprised that after removing the bad floor, you discover that the structural stringers are all rotted and need replacing too.

In other words, you may have to fix it right just to put it back together.

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

OK, Thanks so far. any other ideas?

What resin/epoxy/etc. would you use to coat the plywood once laid down?

Thx.

 

[crunch]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

I'd coat the plywood on both sides.... lasts longer that way.

I use epoxy.

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

Well, not too many seem to have input on this - maybe the question was to general. I'll try to get more specific.

1. CPES from Rot Doctor....is this stuff worth the $$$ ? It can be used to restore some rotted areaa as a penatrating epoxy - any other similar products i can buy local (Home Depot, Lowes, etc.) that also can strengthen the existing wood with a bit of rot?

2. What should I use to fill the gap between old floor and new floor? What caulk or whatever?

 

[stevieray]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

tmh - have you checked out the stringers yet? If you have an I/O & the engine is mounted to them or to the floor, as Mark42 stated above, those are the first things to fix. If not, the engine will shift on the softening wood & get out of alignment with the drive - then you will have serious mechanical issues to deal with as well. Post back with what you find.

 

[strizzy]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

Yeah make sure to check out you check out the stringers and motor mounts as well. My floor wasnt that rotted, but the mounts and stringers were shot.

You really want to tie in the good floor into the sides of the boat. That gives the boat a lot of strength and if you just tie into the old floor, you will loose a lot of that the more that wood rots. So that is why you should fiberglass the floor into the boat. Poly resin is fine, two nice coats on everything will seal it up real nice. In most cases 1/2" plywood is enough.

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

OK, resurecting this older thread because i ripped out some of the floor yesterday. Rot went about 3 ft. from the stern then the wood was perfect. So, I'm replacing the back 4 ft or so. Some stringer rot, not too bad. I'll probably replace two sections. Haven't fully checked the transon yet - will today.

My current question pertains to the floatation foam. How do I know if it needs to come out due to water trapped inside? I hack off chunks of it which are not waterlogged because the foam is non-obsorbent it seems (good thing). However, there are some pockets of pooled water on the foam and within the layers, I think.

I haven't hacked down more than a few inches because I don't know if I need to take it out. Is there usually lots of watertrapped down in there? Would drilling a few 1" holes 6" down tell me anything?

My original plan was to not use the same type of poured-in foam because it's a pain. However, now that I see it in there, I realize it definately adds structurally to the floor of the boat. But, it also seems to trap water from getting to the bilge and out. What to do?

Thanks

 

[andy6374]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

I like pour foam, many don't and suggest using empty plastic bottles instead.

You are right that the foam adds a structural component and hence should be replaced. As I said you'll get many different opinions on the pour foam, and my opinion is to keep it and use more if it was taken out.

FWIW: I would put a layer of at least 6 oz cloth on the topside and underside of the new section of deck to keep it waterproof. Epoxy is great at waterproof but a simple layer of 6oz coth/epoxy is MUCH more waterproof than epoxy alone.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

what i use is a piece of 1" pvc, notch some teeth into the end, and twist it down in the foam. no fear of damaging the hull.

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

Thanks. I started hacking at the foam and yes, the bottom few inches are water-logged - so out it came. I have the floor off up to the ski locker (about 9 ft) and all the foam out. Maybe I got lucky - it came out in nice clean chunks after I got the hang of chipping at it with the pick-ax. I'm not sure how wet it is towards the front of the boat. The floor isn't rotted past where I took up and the foam seemed much dryer as I went forward.

The good news is that my boat will perform much better having removed several 100 lbs of foam and soaked carpet, etc. In a way I was glad it was soaked because the boat seemed sluggish for the engine size.

As for new foam, I don't know what I'm going to do. I see no way poured in foam can allow the areas between stringers to drain properly, thus trapping water and eventually water-logging the foam. Big soda bottles would work for floatation purposes, but what about structure? Does the foam improve the "cushioning" in the ride? Any noise dampening from foam?

Opinions welcome.

btw, try explaining to your wife why you are swinging a PICK-AX on the "great" boat you bought two months ago! Actually, I was just chipping and prying with the pick-ax, but she doesn't care.

 

[crunch]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

btw, try explaining to your wife why you are swinging a PICK-AX on the "great" boat you bought two months ago! Actually, I was just chipping and prying with the pick-ax, but she doesn't care.

You could always tell her you are working out your frustrations from people asking dumb questions. 8)

Big soda bottles would work for floatation purposes, but what about structure? Does the foam improve the "cushioning" in the ride? Any noise dampening from foam?

Soda bottles will do nothing for structure, that's what the foam is for besides just floatation. It will stiffen the hull, make the floor solid, and quiet the sound of water slapping the bottom.

 

[stevieray]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

I see no way poured in foam can allow the areas between stringers to drain properly, thus trapping water and eventually water-logging the foam.

This seems to be a common problem from all the threads I've read on this subject. I guess the original builders figured there was no way any water would ever work its way under the foam, what with the excellent job they do sealing everything up (right!). If you could install some sort of channeling system between the hull & the foam - maybe some PVC pipe or even that wavy fiberglass sheeting they use for shed roofing would do the trick. Just throwing out some ideas.....

 

[tmh]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

OK. Update... and another question.

Cut the back 11 ft. of floor out leaving a 1-2" rim around the edges. I cut my new plywood to fit up against the old floor, asmany here say to do. Went OK until I cut through my hull! (Seperate thread for THAt, it's a biggie).

Here's my new question. Once I had all the cutting done i was checking the 1-2" old floor for the condition of the wood - pretty rotten in the back 6-8'. It was quite easy to just pull it out leaving the 1/8" fiberglass (very heavy around the edges), so i did. Some took a bit of work, but it was rotten and wet so it came out clean.

Now, I'm glad i got all that crappy wood out but I have a small issue. When I go to put the new floor in I was planning to attach a board under the rim where the old and new floor meet, as has been explained in this form many times. Problem is, i'll have 1/2" plywood yp against 1/8" fiberglass. the tops will be at the same height, but the bottoms won't. If I were to attach them both to the underneath board, then the plywood would be picked up 1/4" or so leaing a channel around the perimiter.

Any suggestions?

Please See my hole in hull thread if you think you can help with THAT one!

 

[scoutabout]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

...Some stringer rot, not too bad. I'll probably replace two sections...

tmh -- your comment above brought a question to my mind. Should you be replacing sections of stringer, or should the entire thing go even if you've found rot in only one part of it?

Seems to me it would be difficult to maintain structural integrity trying to tie in a new section of a stringer.

Apologies, o' course if this isn't what you meant d

 

[chris cross]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

i need to no something about floors please.i have read all of the postings and don't have an answer to my problem,and need help with a floor question please.i have a 16.5ft glassmaster I/O, the floor area where the jump seats are is soft. only where the seats are in the very back.i can stand in the area and it has some strength.can i use something to give the old floor strenght or will the bad area keep moving up and make the whole floor bad.

 

[KRS]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

i need to no something about floors please.i have read all of the postings and don't have an answer to my problem,and need help with a floor question please.i have a 16.5ft glassmaster I/O, the floor area where the jump seats are is soft. only where the seats are in the very back.i can stand in the area and it has some strength.can i use something to give the old floor strenght or will the bad area keep moving up and make the whole floor bad.

Try asking the question in your own thread, rather than "hijacking" one as it's called... you'll get better results.

The only way to stop floor rot is to replace the floor.

If you need to just relaminate the fiberglass to the wood, then it's a different story. Have you checked the wood for rot?

I won't be back to this thread looking for your response, go ahead and start another one and you'll get plenty of help.

 

[swimmin' for shore]

Re: Floor repair on the cheap/easy.

TMH, you sound identical to how I did when I first started, right down to the boat you bought. My first boat was a Mark Twain with a decent mercruiser in it. I got it home, found a little rot, got to digging, cut through my hull, and the rest is history. Here's some very basic advice. You're in the right place to get the specifics on every aspect of your repair, so I'll leave individual problems and solutions to some of the experts here.
One: Resolve in your mind(and your wifes mind) to rebuild this right. There's no way around your family's safety. The floor, stringers, transom, motor mounts, etc...are structural items in your boat. They keep it stable in any kind of water. You need dry foam. You need solid stringers and floor. Your mounts under the motor have to be strong. If these areas are weak in any place, you're putting undue stresses on other parts of the boat, gimble housing(for the motor), fiberglass, gelcoat, transom, etc...Take your time and do this right, at least within reason. If you use your head and the heads of the people here, it won't be nearly so expensive or hard as it seems now.
Two: Don't forget to check those motor mounts and the transom. If you have rotten floor and stringers, you've a better than average chance of having rotten mounts and transom. The transom and stringers are all the structure that your boat has. They're far and away, the most important part of the boat's stability.
Three: You were right to pull the foam. Replace it. Not hard. Not overly expensive. And your wife seems to enjoy giving you a hard time anyway, so wait until she sees your first overflow of pourable foam.
Good luck. Fix that boat up and keep it forever. We can build them better, stronger, faster, and safer than they ever came out of the factory.