Mandatory health insurance for employees....

[Boomyal]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

oldspud.............not all of the tax is passed on to the consumer.

That is one of the dumbest statements I have ever heard. Just who in the h*** do you think pays for the first penny of corporate/business tax? Better send you back to Jr High Econ 101!

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Ok ok. I am a republican and I wasn't sure about it. Now I know, bad idea! LOL

It's a great idea if left to Market forces... and the employee market force almost requires it to be competitive. It's just a bad idea if mandated by Big Brother... that let's in the idea the insurance Co's can charge all they want for that coverage because it is mandated... see the difference?

Yes, I can, but big brother already mandates auto insurance for drivers, thats a reason I feel I'm paying out of my teeth in insurance. In 7 years I payed enough money to insure my truck than it's was worth new. Now every 4 years or so I pay for my truck over and over in insurance I have never used.

My idea sucks, but mandatory insurance for drivers sucks as well! LOL

Huge difference WITF. The government has mandated that YOU pay for auto insurance for yourself, not for someone else to pay it for you.

 

[waterinthefuel]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Well Boom, I agree, but at least I'd prefer my employer to foot the mandatory insurance bill than lil ol' me!

 

[stevieray]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Well Boom, I agree, but at least I'd prefer my employer to foot the mandatory insurance bill than lil ol' me!

Well, this gets back to my original point (expressed in other threads) that it has to be made affordable. If health care was priced at a reasonable level, the cost of insurance would be within reach of many more people, easing the burden on employers. How do we get health care costs under control? Legislation, maybe? It may be the only way out.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Well Boom, I agree, but at least I'd prefer my employer to foot the mandatory insurance bill than lil ol' me!

Well, this gets back to my original point (expressed in other threads) that it has to be made affordable. If health care was priced at a reasonable level, the cost of insurance would be within reach of many more people, easing the burden on employers. How do we get health care costs under control? Legislation, maybe? It may be the only way out.

Actually SR, it is just the opposite. Get the Government out of healthcare and get rid of the third party payees. Insurance companies incourage the increased cost of healthcare, all the while, decrying it. If you could afford to pay for the routine things that my parents did, you wouldn't need insurance companies.

How do you think that fact settles with insurance companies? If you had to pay for basic healthcare, out of your pocket, you would see a realignment of the whole industry.

 

[stevieray]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Boom - how is the govt in health care now? I see outrageous malpractice insurance fees & huge shareholder-driven profits from mega-care providers & drug mfrs as the lion's share of costs. What do you think?

 

[rogerwa]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Boom has it with the third party payers. When I show up for my physical, I have no idea how much that costs. Theres no competitive pressure to brining that down..

Imagine if the health care costs were done on an ala cart way in which you decided what services you wanted, much like auto insurance. I don't want psych services or a provision for alcohol treatment.

Your employer would kick in a certain amount or give you the option to take it as compensation. Also, what if you could pay for your own plan pre-tax and make your money go farther.

I thinkfundamental changes like this would help to improve the situation.

When my wife was pregnant with #3, they didn't give her a ultrasound as it wasn't prescribed in our health plan and her conditions did not warrant it.

My question is, how much does it actually cost to use the machine they just have sittting on a cart. However, they have put a large price on this 'test' which should be common practice with very little incremental cost. I think there are a lot of those examples..

 

[Pony]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

oldspud.............not all of the tax is passed on to the consumer.

That is one of the dumbest statements I have ever heard. Just who in the h*** do you think pays for the first penny of corporate/business tax? Better send you back to Jr High Econ 101!

If you think that all tax is passed on to the consumer........YOU can go back to econ 101. Does most of it go to the consumer............Yeah it sure as hell does. Does all of it.......Nope. If you went to 101 you might understand that cost DOES NOT always mean money. Did I specifically say money???? I don't recall doing so.

 

[crunch]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Pony, go back to my post and take it a bit farther.

Company A can't charge $4.50 for the twiget but only the $1.00 tax increase... profits drop, dividends fall... share price falls because investors sell because of low return on their investment.

Capital drys up and the plant has to close due to low profit and low sales due to price increase.

People riot because they no longer can buy twigets.

Congress starts an investigation into the "Twiget Shortage" and determines it's all Dubya's fault.

2008 elections are a Landslide for the Republican Party. 8)

 

[Boomyal]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

oldspud.............not all of the tax is passed on to the consumer.

That is one of the dumbest statements I have ever heard. Just who in the h*** do you think pays for the first penny of corporate/business tax? Better send you back to Jr High Econ 101!

If you think that all tax is passed on to the consumer........YOU can go back to econ 101. Does most of it go to the consumer............Yeah it sure as hell does. Does all of it.......Nope. If you went to 101 you might understand that cost DOES NOT always mean money. Did I specifically say money???? I don't recall doing so.

Well Pony, sadly, it is this kind of ignorance that is responsible for so many Americans jumping on the Democrat evil business bandwagon.

Business determines how much profit they have to make to justify the effort to stay in business. EVERY expense that a business incurs goes into that calculation. Corporate/Business tax or mandated fees, in any form, are one of those expenses. They amortize out the cost of their expenses and add them to the price of their products.

It is that simple. There is no Corporate/Business tax Fairy that simply makes any part of a tax or fee go poof into thin air. YOU PAY 100% of EVERY PENNY of TAX that a business pays. Period.

End of Jr Hi Econ 101 class. Ding Ding.

 

[Pony]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Hey Boom.........I am NOT a Democrat. I am just not as far right as you.


Now that that is out of the way. I think this argument is based on the term "cost". If I take customs example, the "cost" to the business of taxation is loss of profits.

Business A increases the price of their good to overcome an imposed tax. As a result they will sell fewer goods. They sell fewer goods and will lose some revenue. I would say that is a "cost" of taxation to them. Its just not as big of a deal to them because they will cut labor until they are operating at the pre tax profit. Its STILL a cost. Thats all I am saying. I don't deny the consumer will pay most of the tax, even all of the actual monetary value of it. Simple fact is the business still has a "cost" of the Tax. They, unlike the consumer can cut their variable costs to offset that.

 

[crunch]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Simple fact is the business still has a "cost" of the Tax. They, unlike the consumer can cut their variable costs to offset that.

What variable cost? Any business that is still in business after the first year has already cut everything right down to the bone... and has gnawed all the gristle off as well.

No mater how you try to off set costs, it all comes down to consumer price and the Market share you win or lose... and that's the really simple example.

If you get into the cost of R+D, advertising, plant expansion and renovation, and all of the little things that add up, then lost market share because of added costs adds up big time... it can become a downward spiral to a recession... at least in your/my marginal business....How would you like to do without “Twigets”?

 

[Pony]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

I was using Labor as the variable cost in that example. In the long run that could be plants and factories etc.

I'm sure a business has cut everything down to the bone after the first year or so, but when the demand for their product goes down because they increases price to offset a tax........they have to cut a little deeper.

 

[roscoe]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

My idea sucks, but mandatory insurance for drivers sucks as well! LOL

In most states, drivers don't need insurance, but automobiles do.

How much are you paying for Gov't mandated auto insurance?

Sounds like you are paying $2000-$3000 a year for liability insurance?

You must have an awful driving record; I only pay $350 for a half mill of liability coverage.

Please explain.

 

[crunch]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Or lay off.... and go out of business... or take the money and run to insure their own retirement.

No one goes into their own business with the idea of making things better for the "people", we do it for our own selfish reasons........ money.

If you have any other idea of our reasons besides that.... 8)

 

[crunch]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Of course the off shoot of Businesses making money is.................?

 

[tommays]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

Around here you cant hire LEGAL help without offering benefits people will just not take the job

So the free market did decide in this area

The problem starts when big company's make and end run around this hospitals being the best example in this area they use VISA loopholes to bring in staff to take the lower skill jobs at a lower pay rate

Which is how most of are current mess started buy bringing in cheaper farm workers to do the dirty work

Tommays

 

[treedancer]

Re: Mandatory health insurance for employees....

It seems that a lot of the companies are sending their work offshore to cut cost. Of course even the companies offshore have health insurance for their employees.