A World Without America

crunch

Commander
Joined
Aug 1, 2006
Messages
2,844
Re: A World Without America

LOL TG, let's get back to talking beer, barbecue and good times with fellow boaters here in the Great North West! :p

Back flips and hand springs.... I can hardly wait!
 

Tail_Gunner

Admiral
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Jan 13, 2006
Messages
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Re: A World Without America

Yes it could be great fun ............but i dunno why Boom brought up our Euro beaches...............8)
 

RPJS

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jul 29, 2002
Messages
1,572
Re: A World Without America

crunch said:
Now there is a measure of Civilization and entry into the 21st century.... do you have refrigeration? :p

Funny you should ask, the refrigerator was invented by an Australian
8)8)
 

Skinnywater

Commander
Joined
Mar 7, 2002
Messages
2,065
Re: A World Without America

Kiwi said:
...........
If America had never existed, believe me we would be in an identical situation to the one we are in now...............
Cheers
Phillip

We don't understand Japanese.
 

Pony

Rear Admiral
Joined
Jun 27, 2004
Messages
4,355
Re: A World Without America

I think of it this way.......

To say the world would be in the identical situation it is now without the USA is absolutely absured, just as absurd as it is to say that it woul be identical without Austrailia, England, Germany, et al. Every country plays a role, some larger than others, in shaping the world environment.
 

Kiwi Phil

Commander
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Jun 23, 2003
Messages
2,182
Re: A World Without America

Wow....never thought I would provoke this mayhem. Obviously my written word comes over quite differently to my actual feelings and thoughts.
There is no jealousy, nor hate, certainly not envy, and as for respect, well everybody is entitled to that no matter where they come from.
I apologise to anyone I have offended. You too Crunch....I couldn't imagine your winter, nor staying inside for more than an hour.

I wonder if some of you may not be getting a little paranoid.....re comment over a US Passport....well no need. The peoples of this world are quite broad minded and where you come from has little to do with how you are accepted. You have a lot of friends out there.
I am sure QC finds that where-ever he travels.
That is a fact of life in the real world.

I think some have to get over this belief they were instrumental in bringing peace and freedom to everyone.
It is something all western nations strive for.
The issue of Wars came up.
So here is some history.

Europe
1. The greatest deciding factor in WW2 was the Battle of Britain. It was short, but at the end,
a.)the British and its Commonwealth knew Germany would never occupy the British Isles
b.)Germany Navy (surface) would never be able to operate effectively (closure of English Channel).
2. Capture of the Enigma Code machine in 1941 by HMS Bulldog from U 001 (or something strange like that)
U Boat was taken en-tow, and stripped, but sunk on its own accord before reaching Scapa Flow. The U Boat Fleet would diminish over the years due to that.
3. Hitler's operation 'Barbarossa'. All knew no invading Army's ever leaves Russia intact, and more than 1 Army is required to cover the Russian front.
4. Malta. German and Italian forces could not take Malta, thereby never being able to control the Mediterranean, Nth Africa,Middle East thru to Southern Russia and denying access to the Indian Ocean.
5. Breaking of German Airforce code system. I recall (hope I'm correct) the English actually sacrificed a city, Coventry. They knew when/size (every detail) of pending attack but had they prepared for it, the German would have realised immediately the Brits were on to them).

American concern became acute after Barbarrosa. A Russian win: they knew Russia would invade all Europe and place it under Communism. A very concerning issue. Stalin wanted re-supply and Brits/USA to open a Western Front to alleviate pressure on him.

These are the linch-pins to the European theatre. All Battles/Campaigns/Squirmishes that followed were the mechanics. American forces did not make up a very high percentage of the Allied Force in this theatre, overall. But all Europeans and Commonwealth Nations considered ever soldier, no matter where he originated, to be vitally important to the cause irrespective of wether he was an American/Indian/Polish/French or other. It was that sort of situation.


Pacific.
1. British Commonwealth was unable to hold Singapore. Singapore is the cross-roads to the world....absolutely critical loss.
2. Australian Infantry battle at Kakoda Trail in PNG. Japs knew they had to win, otherwise their advanced on land was stopped. Aussies knew if they lost, so was Australia and the land base it would provide for McArthur. Jap expeditionary force had no where to go after their loss, no chance of re-supply or evacuation.
3. Battle of Coral Sea. American Navy.It was a draw, but Japs were never able to patrol their large fleets that far South again.
4. Battle of Midway. American Navy. Destroyed Japs navy to extent it was never a effective/operational Battle Fleet again.
5. Burma. Mountbatten halts Jap Western advance.
6. Americans won the Pacific War; it contributed majority of forces, but don't forget, there were a lot of other Forces there too. Everybody it thankful to the Americans for that. No issue over the Pacific War. It was an American led victory.

For Inventions and Medical advance...well....I think you have to be a little careful on that one, but that's OK.

(personally I wonder if Hollywood has a lot to answer for. I went to see a film a few years back on the Enigma Code machine. Having read quite a lot about it in past, I was rather surprise to see Hollywood had an American Sub capturing the U-Boat concerned and stealing the Enigma machine for the Americans with all sorts of drama and heroics. Wonder how many saw the film and accepted it as fact...

For those of you that doubt you have friends and allies in this world......forget it....you'r wrong......you have plenty.

Cheers
Phillip
 

Tail_Gunner

Admiral
Joined
Jan 13, 2006
Messages
6,237
Re: A World Without America

You know Kiwi, i just finished a 20 minute post tying ot explain the last 100 yr's. I do not beleive no one person can put it into the proper context.
 

Kiwi Phil

Commander
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
2,182
Re: A World Without America

Yes, very difficult to summarise so much. I started on this yesterday. Much better in a verbal discussion, as the written word can be interpreted in many ways.
Cheers
Phillip
 

Kiwi Phil

Commander
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
2,182
Re: A World Without America

Nope, not this time Techno....this is history....facts...what did happen.
Cheers
Phillip
 

Tail_Gunner

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Jan 13, 2006
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Re: A World Without America

technostingray said:
(spoken like thumpers mother) kiwi, what did your mother say? ;)

technostingray............
nono.gif


Sometime's ya just have to let it go, sometime's bro
 

Dunaruna

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Joined
May 2, 2003
Messages
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Re: A World Without America

[colour=blue]While I sit here munchin' the popcorn I'd like to correct a few misconceptions -

Australia received approximately 50,000 British convicts.
America received 60,000. (Kevin & Boom - :p )

RPJS doesn't let the beer touch his taste buds, so how does he KNOW how our beer tastes??

A few notable aussie inventions - Combine harvester, the automotive differential, the Ute (what you heathens call a 'pickup' d:) ), Black Box flight recorder, Rack & Pinion steering, the Electric drill, Jedi Light Sabre, photocopy machine, REFRIDGERATOR, Pacemaker, Penicillin (The head doctor on the team was an Aussie), Bionic ear.....................to name but a few.
 

RPJS

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
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Messages
1,572
Re: A World Without America

Dunaruna said:
[colour=blue]

RPJS doesn't let the beer touch his taste buds, so how does he KNOW how our beer tastes??

LOLd:)

Drinking Aussie beer is like taking medicine, if you leave it in your mouth long enough to taste+o( , get it down your throat quick while holding your nose and it will do the job for which it was taken.d:):love:d:)
 

QC

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
22,783
Re: A World Without America

Phil,

My only concern, and the one I still don't think has been addressed, is that you said without America nothing would be different. I think Pony probably summed it up best. That's a pretty weird statement regardless of what country you put in the sentence. In the case of America, again, I believe our mix of peoples does result in a unique contribution to the planet . . . Also, specifically as a legitimate example, Israel would be a different or non-existent place . . .

No harm no foul, as you said, should be a verbal discussion over a tall one. And that is what I think DC kinda is . . .

Kevin
 

JB

Honorary Moderator Emeritus
Joined
Mar 25, 2001
Messages
45,907
Re: A World Without America

Well, I have a thought or two about this.

I see the UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and USA as a sort of family. We all sprang from Celtic, Anglo-Saxon and Norman culture and though we have individualized our national characteristics and absorbed parts of many other cultures, we are basically sons and daughters of old England.

The wealth of natural resources and industrial capacity of the USA have allowed the English speaking family of nations to intervene and prevail in many events since the late 19th Century and thus have largely shaped the world we live in.

To say that this is all because of the USA, I think, is a bit of an exaggeration; nor is it all because of the heritage of law, ethics and values we have inherited from Mother England and, to a smaller degree, France, Spain, Germany and the rest of the so-called "western" world.

Don't know how we can blame that heritage on my President and PM Tony Blair, but someone will find a way. 8)8)
 

QC

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Mar 22, 2005
Messages
22,783
Re: A World Without America

Ooops. I was still on page 1 . . .

Hi Aldo, nice inventing you did there. How come your Ute invention still has the cargo hold connected to the passenger cabin? We just started making those stupid things again . . .

outtahere.gif
 

OldMercsRule

Captain
Joined
Nov 30, 2006
Messages
3,340
Re: A World Without America

Very Good Phil, Many American's cornsider FDR to be the greatest person in the 20th Century. In my not so humble opinion that person was Winston Churchill, (and it isn't even close)! JR
 

JB

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Re: A World Without America

OMR, we agree completely on that.
 

Dunaruna

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May 2, 2003
Messages
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Re: A World Without America

[colour=blue]
QC said:
Ooops. I was still on page 1 . . .

Hi Aldo, nice inventing you did there. How come your Ute invention still has the cargo hold connected to the passenger cabin? We just started making those stupid things again . . .

outtahere.gif

We got both, connected and not connected. In fact, most 'utes' are sold as a bare chassis and the type of body fitted is up to the buyer.
 

Boomyal

Supreme Mariner
Joined
Aug 16, 2003
Messages
12,072
Re: A World Without America

Dunaruna said:
[colour=blue]Australia received approximately 50,000 British convicts.
America received 60,000. (Kevin & Boom - :p )

You remind me of Mrs Boomyal, Aldo. A memory like an elephant. She never fails to forget anything I ever said or contended.:p
 
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