Since we have not discussed it enough recently

[POINTER94]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

If distortion is illegal, why is Hillary, Kerry, Kennedy, Pelosi, Reid, Durbin, and similiar ilk still walking free?

Since collusion is illegal, there are litterly hundreds of thousands/millions of people who could profit from proving it. And since "big" oil is so "big" the conspiracy would involve a "big" number of people, it wouldn't take a "big" amount of research or pressure to expose it. And the profits for "big" lawyers, would be "big" by even "big" standards, giving them a "big" incentive to uncover it. In fact, there are "big" organizations who do nothing but monitor such profits of "big" oil. No "big" lawsuits in the "big" media yet for us to discuss. That might present a "big" problem for those who think "big" oil, has a "big" conspiracy going on in a "big" way.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

When you're slidin' into two and your pants are filled with goo....

 

[CJY]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

If distortion is illegal, why is Hillary, Kerry, Kennedy, Pelosi, Reid, Durbin, and similiar ilk still walking free?

Since collusion is illegal, there are litterly hundreds of thousands/millions of people who could profit from proving it. And since "big" oil is so "big" the conspiracy would involve a "big" number of people, it wouldn't take a "big" amount of research or pressure to expose it. And the profits for "big" lawyers, would be "big" by even "big" standards, giving them a "big" incentive to uncover it. In fact, there are "big" organizations who do nothing but monitor such profits of "big" oil. No "big" lawsuits in the "big" media yet for us to discuss. That might present a "big" problem for those who think "big" oil, has a "big" conspiracy going on in a "big" way.

No, it would not involve a "Big" number of people on the behalf of oil. BTW, I am not surprised you have decided to bring others into the discussion as a way to side-track it.

It would literally cost billions for a law-firm to attack Big oil with the money big oil has. It would then be dragged out for years and years. Name one law firm that has that much money and can afford to have it tied up for, I don't know, 10, 20, maybe 30 years. Economically it's not feasable. That's the reason it has not happened, not because there is nothing illegal taking place.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

RF,

Can I politely ask that you change that avatar immediately.

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

CJY,

I beleive this is where the disconnect between our points of view occur. There is not a wizard of oz type sitting at the top punching out the price of gas as he feels. There are suppliers, refiners, wholesalers, brokers, transportation services, liability concerns, political situations, infrastructure, all figuring in to the price of a gallon of gas. A simplistic view of a greedy dictator dispensing from on high, the price of a gallon of gas is just uninformed. You would need accountants, (hundreds of them), a meeting of the minds of ALL corporations, big and even the little ones. Not one honest person on these board of directors? Not one honest CFO, CEO, comptroller, broker, anywhere.

And yes, as publically traded companies these organizations have to disclose all their information to anyone including the government who asks. A conspiracy as you discribe would require some secret bank stash, which would show up as an anomoly within the accounting procedures. And your belief that there are not thousands of people monitoring this information on a daily basis is just wrong. See "big" government. And not just our governemnt, ALL governments of emerging and advanced nations.

Your conspiracy would cover 50+ countries, all continents, dozens of corporations, and yet, you still believe there is some kind of conspiracy? Your conspiracy mandates that there is not one honest person in the entire world who would blow the whistle. Celebrity prevents this from being a reality. POINTER94 saves the world by blowing the whistle on corrupt "big" oil. I would make far more money on Leno, and Letterman than I would ever make pushing papers full of lies. And imagine the grateful mass's who would hold me up like a god. I could be the next AlGore.......

 

[CJY]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

CJY,

I beleive this is where the disconnect between our points of view occur. There is not a wizard of oz type sitting at the top punching out the price of gas as he feels. There are suppliers, refiners, wholesalers, brokers, transportation services, liability concerns, political situations, infrastructure, all figuring in to the price of a gallon of gas. A simplistic view of a greedy dictator dispensing from on high, the price of a gallon of gas is just uninformed. You would need accountants, (hundreds of them), a meeting of the minds of ALL corporations, big and even the little ones. Not one honest person on these board of directors? Not one honest CFO, CEO, comptroller, broker, anywhere.

And yes, as publically traded companies these organizations have to disclose all their information to anyone including the government who asks. A conspiracy as you discribe would require some secret bank stash, which would show up as an anomoly within the accounting procedures. And your belief that there are not thousands of people monitoring this information on a daily basis is just wrong. See "big" government. And not just our governemnt, ALL governments of emerging and advanced nations.

Your conspiracy would cover 50+ countries, all continents, dozens of corporations, and yet, you still believe there is some kind of conspiracy? Your conspiracy mandates that there is not one honest person in the entire world who would blow the whistle. Celebrity prevents this from being a reality. POINTER94 saves the world by blowing the whistle on corrupt "big" oil. I would make far more money on Leno, and Letterman than I would ever make pushing papers full of lies. And imagine the grateful mass's who would hold me up like a god. I could be the next AlGore.......

If you read my first post, I think I said the opportunity for collusion exists. After all that has been said, I still believe it.

Remember, all of this started about two weeks ago when I posted a story regarding the state of Wisconsin forcing a gas station to raise its prices to the state minimum. Did you hear that? The state minimum. In other words, no one station can undercut another. I guess as long as the gov is setting the minimums, all is ok. I believe that one FACT says a great deal in support of my arguement.


Yes, I know I have changed gears a bit, but when the mandates are coming from the top, the others simply fall in line. Thgey continue the less than honest practice, and collect their money.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

.. Not one honest CFO, CEO, comptroller, broker, anywhere.

You're catching on

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

I just love these "Big Oil" threads.

1. We blame the environmentalists for the lack of new refinery capacity, or the Nimby croud for blocking them, while we should know that building a new refinery requires being located with access to a gas pipeline and access to offshore crude tankers, which virtually precludes new ones over expanding existing ones.

2. We know that global warming, or worldwide political upheaval, at some point in time is going to force us to reduce our consumption of oil, yet we expect big oil to invest billions in added production capacity that they know will be rendered obsolete sooner or later.

3. We know that by our purchases of foreign oil, we are financing our enemies, yet we expect big oil to add capacity to purchase more.

4. We are also depending on private industry and investment to invent the technology miraculously for alternate energy sources in order to render "Big Oils" current multi billion dollar infrastructure investment obsolete. That "big oil" would do anything but squash any new technology that comes along is the only mystery involved.

Makes sense to me!

Not a half bad post PW2. Respectfully JR

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

CJY,

I beleive this is where the disconnect between our points of view occur. There is not a wizard of oz type sitting at the top punching out the price of gas as he feels. There are suppliers, refiners, wholesalers, brokers, transportation services, liability concerns, political situations, infrastructure, all figuring in to the price of a gallon of gas. A simplistic view of a greedy dictator dispensing from on high, the price of a gallon of gas is just uninformed. You would need accountants, (hundreds of them), a meeting of the minds of ALL corporations, big and even the little ones. Not one honest person on these board of directors? Not one honest CFO, CEO, comptroller, broker, anywhere.

And yes, as publically traded companies these organizations have to disclose all their information to anyone including the government who asks. A conspiracy as you discribe would require some secret bank stash, which would show up as an anomoly within the accounting procedures. And your belief that there are not thousands of people monitoring this information on a daily basis is just wrong. See "big" government. And not just our governemnt, ALL governments of emerging and advanced nations.

Your conspiracy would cover 50+ countries, all continents, dozens of corporations, and yet, you still believe there is some kind of conspiracy? Your conspiracy mandates that there is not one honest person in the entire world who would blow the whistle. Celebrity prevents this from being a reality. POINTER94 saves the world by blowing the whistle on corrupt "big" oil. I would make far more money on Leno, and Letterman than I would ever make pushing papers full of lies. And imagine the grateful mass's who would hold me up like a god. I could be the next AlGore.......

Very Good Pointer! JR

 

[ricksrster]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

RF,

Can I politely ask that you change that avatar immediately.

I agree. It's just not natural.

 

[RubberFrog]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

I would, but JR cries whenever I threaten to change it. Seems it reminds him of his first love

 

[POINTER94]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

JR may cry, but I'm about to puke.

 

[bouttime007]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

but when the mandates are coming from the top, the others simply fall in line. Thgey continue the less than honest practice, and collect their money.

Any one remember Enron?

 

[CJY]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

Hey all, RF probably worked hard to get in that shape and is proud to look like that at hiieerrrs age. Cut him some slack. Carry on RF.

 

[QC]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

Any one remember Enron?

Yes, and people went to jail and the Company is bust and that wasn't oil and they didnt' collude. They lied, sold to themselves to inflate their revenues and the got caught . . .

 

[QC]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

CJY,

The answer to your question is that business is always reluctant to reduce hard fought for pricing. It is a struggle to raise prices. Everybody with a stake on the selling side benefits when prices are up. The fact is competition forces them to lower prices and it is proof once again that this business is shaped by natural market forces . . .

There is no bogey man as Pointer has so correctly pointed out and backed up.

 

[CJY]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

CJY,

The answer to your question is that business is always reluctant to reduce hard fought for pricing. It is a struggle to raise prices. Everybody with a stake on the selling side benefits when prices are up. The fact is competition forces them to lower prices and it is proof once again that this business is shaped by natural market forces . . .

There is no bogey man as Pointer has so correctly pointed out and backed up.

I understand what you are saying, and agree with the fact they are reluctant to reduce prices. However, I don't see any struggle at all in rasing them, nor do I see the increase in price being a fight, which may be the reason they all(in an area) go up in a matter of minutes. The competition you speak of consists of the same few players day in and day out. If new competition could easily enter the arena, I may be more inclined to agree.

For now though, I can agree to disagree.

 

[QC]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

For now though, I can agree to disagree.

Well that's mighty big of you . . .

 

[OldMercsRule]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

I would, but JR cries whenever I threaten to change it. Seems it reminds him of his first love

I would not cry about that one, (never cared for cross dressers, see em' in: "Gay Bay North", all the time) I just liked yer machine gun totin' cat. Every time I showed it to one of my friends they agreed that was one of the funniest things they had ever seen!!!!!!! JR

 

[oddjob]

Re: Since we have not discussed it enough recently

All I know is I lost the race to 20 red lights on my way to work this morning. I quess if you make excess profits at your job one can afford the lead foot luxury. Or maybe most of those good folks are offsetting their carbon footprint buying carbon credits from Algore. yeah...life is good if your a human.