Helper Springs

[buckstop108]

I need to take the sag out of my truck when the boat is connected. I am looking at two options in the helper spring category. The first is a Hellwig progressive spring. It is additional leaf springs attached by "U" bolts on top of the existing leaf springs and has a rating of 2500 lbs. The second option is by Timbren, this is a rubber spring that replaces the factory rubber stop and has a 6000 lb rating and a limited life time warranty. Does anyone have any experience with either one? The price difference isn't that much and really isn't the concern I would spend the extra money for the better set up. I have no experience with any of them and do not know anyone that has either. Any help would be appreciated.

 

[rndn]

Re: Helper Springs

I had used a similar added leaf spring setup and was very pleased with the performance. It really didn't affect the ride without the trailer and kept the back of the truck up when the trailer was attached.

 

[rndn]

Re: Helper Springs

I should have mentioned that ideally you would have a vehicle designed to carry the weight without adding extra springs. If your vehicle is sagging it's telling you you are placing more weight than it was designed to handle on the hitch. Adding a spring helps with only one aspect of towing a boat. You still need a vehicle capable of towing and stopping the boat and one that is not going to get pushed around by a boat that is more substantial than the tow vehicle.

 

[Have Fun Today]

Re: Helper Springs

What type of tow vehicle do you have and how much does your boat/trailer weigh? Have you checked the tongue weight to make sure it's not too much (generally about 10% of trailer weight)? I'd suggest checking the owner's manual and trailer hitch for tow ratings, it probably recommends a weight distributing hitch above a certain tongue weight...which you may be over. Never exceed max trailer weights. The weight distributing hitch will spread the tongue weight over the front wheels of your truck. This will raise the rear end and make it more stable on the road. Unless you have an older vehicle with worn suspension, stiffer springs will only mask the overloaded rear axel.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

I agree and technically my truck which is a 2001 Dodge Quad cab 4x4 with the 5.9 V8 longbed and tow package should easily tow my 18.9 ft lund on a tandum axle trailer w/ brakes on both axles. The power is not an issue and the boat does not push the truck around. She just needs a little help in the sagging department. If I was to do it again I would step up to a 2500. Unfortunately that is not an option on the table right now.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

HFT,

I did check everything. My tongue weight is at 350 lbs which is about 8.5% of the 4000 lbs of the total package boat, trailer and equipment. The manual for the Dodge 1500 has a max tongue weight at 700 lbs and calls for Trailer sway control and equalizing hitch for class II or III with tongue weights over 350 lbs. The class IV frame mounted hitch that I have is rated to tow a trailer up to 10,000 lbs. GCWR for the truck is 12,500 lbs and the max trailer weight is at 7,000 lbs.
So on paper I look good, but I still get a slight sag. I will look into an equalizing hitch though. This maybe another option. A new truck right now isn't and I want to be safe.

 

[Bigprairie1]

Re: Helper Springs

With respect to the extra spring systems you mentioned.
I added a set of the leaf style helper springs in one of my trucks and it worked very well for keeping things on an 'even keel'. This was for carrying a small camper on a Heavy 1/2 ton. However, my ride got a little harsh (when the truck was 'unloaded') with the extra tension put upon the back end. It rides great loaded tho'.
The air system is nice in that if you aren't using it you can reduce the pressure to keep your original ride quality and then charge it up as needed. You can option up the air system to include an onboard compressor w/ dash guages to charge/discharge at will and as needed which is kind of cool.
Both are useful and capable systems.
It probably comes down to cost/budget at that point. The air system is definitely a few more bucks than the helper spring system.
Note: I also tow (18' Bayliner) with an 01 Dodge quad cab 1500 (5.2litre/318ci) with no problems whatsoever with back end sag so I find your issue interesting. Maybe check for a broken spring or mount? A tongue weight as you mentioned should not cause any discernable back end sag.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

That is interesting, I did take a look and did not see anything to indicate that a spring is broken. I although have no clue what I am looking for other then the obvious crack in the spring itself. Any ideas where to start and any methods to use to check and eliminate a problem with the leaf springs?

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Helper Springs

How many miles do you have on the truck. With age and mileage, springs will normally sag a bit. Most times it is not too noticeable. I had a nice 72 satellite I used as a tow vehicle before my wife "customized" it -- but that's another story. I had 200K on it and the springs had lost their curve. I went to the junkyard and bought an old set of springs, ground off the eyes and disassembled them. I put the main leaf -now sans eyes- under the existing main leaf and re-assembled the package. Center bolt was long enough to take the extra leaf. Car rode a little rougher, but had no squat and actually handled better. I don't think you would notice the rougher ride in the truck.

But another question. Don't you have load springs just above the ride springs? These are stiff leaves below the main spring and only come into use when a load is in the truck. My S10 has them factory equipped and it rides better with about 3-400 pounds in the bed. I use it to tow a 21 footer and single axle trailer at about 3800 gross and 350 tongue weight. It does it quite nicely with no appreciable squat but uses a lot more gas with this load that with 1,000 pounds less.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

No, it doesn't have any factory helper type spring on the truck. The truck only has 67K on it. The sag isn't a lot maybe a two inch drop from the unloaded level. It is just enough where I can notice it. I have to point it out to most people. I bet most people wouldn't even think twice about the sag, it doesn't effect the handling of the truck. But it's not perfect, and seems like it could be better. You know it is like when you realize one of the trailer lights are out when you get home late one night and the first thing the next morning your out there fixing it because you lost sleep thinking about the light not working. The sag is the same thing, it can be better.

 

[jeeperman]

Re: Helper Springs

Todays modern pickup truck has morphed from the rugged vehicle of the late 60's from a workhorse to the modern daily driven comfort transporter.

In order to get that comfort you gotta incorporate an intially soft suspension. Which when loaded will sqwat or sag as the suspension is compressed.
You can't have a soft ride and no sag unless you have some computer or manually adjustable airbag suspension system to maintain the prefered level ride.

The carrying and towing capacity of the vehicle is not maxed out whenever the load starts to cause sag.

I don't think there is anything wrong with your truck. My guess is you just don't like the cosmetic appearence of your truck "dragging butt"??

That Timbren rubber bumper suspension helper might not "activate" soon enough to do the job you desire. It may also cause irritating slapping sounds as the axle slaps the rubber bumper i.e. on wash board dirt roads, etc.
The Hellwig helper leaf spring can be adjusted to not do the thumping.

 

[bassboy1]

Re: Helper Springs

We put air shocks on our tahoe. World of difference. They bolt right on, where your stock shocks are right now, and have an air hose, to a filler tube that you can bolt to the back of your bumper or receiver. They fill with an air compressor, so when riding to work, you can have a smoother ride, but when hitching up the boat, add 15 PSI, and it will tow that better.
Our tahoe started sagging, even with no trailer. It has helped a lot with that, and the few times that we tow larger trailers with it (we have larger tow vehicles - it hardly ever tows more than our 12er) they have really helped it out a lot.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

Thanks to all for the help and the input. I appreciate it.

 

[Ezrider_92356]

Re: Helper Springs

full length add a leafs best option imo

 

[jenoble01]

Re: Helper Springs

No, it doesn't have any factory helper type spring on the truck. The truck only has 67K on it. The sag isn't a lot maybe a two inch drop from the unloaded level. It is just enough where I can notice it. I have to point it out to most people. I bet most people wouldn't even think twice about the sag, it doesn't effect the handling of the truck. But it's not perfect, and seems like it could be better. You know it is like when you realize one of the trailer lights are out when you get home late one night and the first thing the next morning your out there fixing it because you lost sleep thinking about the light not working. The sag is the same thing, it can be better.

I may be wrong but aren't most helper springs designed to work when you get towards the upper limits of weight capacity when the stock springs are close to level? I'm not so sure helper springs will solve you problem. Someone mentioned full length helper springs which are probably your only option other than air bags, but the full length springs will probably make the ride very harsh. I don't think I would be to concerned about 2 inches of sag under load, it's what the springs are designed to do. Keep in mind it only sags under load, if it were sagging when empty then worry about it, but for now 2 inches under load should not be a cause for concern.

 

[jeeperman]

Re: Helper Springs

There are helper springs and there are overload springs.

jenoble1 describes overload springs which don't start doing anything until the upper limits of the load capacity is reached.

helper springs tend to do their thing from the get-go all the way to max. capacity.

generally speaking, regional definitions must be considered.

 

[buckstop108]

Re: Helper Springs

I never did crawl under to check out the spring while under load. I will do that. I was told that the Timbren works with the existing springs to keep the truck level. It doesn't add to the pay load capacity. I was also under the opinion that it was always a good idea to keep the truck level as possible. During my research I spoke with a few people that stated that the full length helper springs in this case I was looking at the Hellwig model #2520 will do the same thing as the Timbren . The Hellwigs have been reported to be noisey when not in use. The thing that caught my eye with the Timbren is that it replaces the stock rubber stop and puts the weight on the rear axle, but you do not get the abrupt stop as you do with the stock stop. I don't think that I am overloaded, I think as stated in a previous post that today's trucks are going for the car like ride and it gives up a little bit of the ability to stay level with I guess would be a softer leaf spring.

All this in put is great, it really has given me some things to think about. Thanks again.

 

[bassboy1]

Re: Helper Springs

Air shocks should not be mistaken with air bags.
http://www.monroe.com/products/mp_detail.asp?cat=0&detail=Max Air

Copy and paste that link. Not that I am recommending a brand, and I don't even think that is the brand we used, but it was the first one to come up with info on a google search.

Air shocks do not change the ride, or add any capacity. When you have no trailer, they should be inflated to a normal level, and with a couple test runs around the block, you will be able to get it exactly where the stock shocks were. That means, there will be zero difference in the car like ride with them. But, when hooking up the trailer, add a few PSI. Then, your truck won't sag as much, and the ride won't be quite so soft, as normal shocks would under load. When you unhook the trailer, let a few PSI out, and you have that car like ride again. You really aren't sacrificing anything, with or without the trailer.

 

[180shabah]

Re: Helper Springs

I agree, air shocks and air bags should not be confused, they are two different beasts. Air shocks do not offer the capacity or long term durability of air bags.

IMHO there is no better solution to add part time load capacity than air bags. Mine were cheap, I have coil springs. Yours will cost around $200 because with leaf springs you will also need the brackets to mount them. They should last as long as your truck, Air shocks will not. You can still select shocks to taylor your ride. Rancho's for off-road durability, KYB's for on-road handling etc.... Air shocks are a one size fits all solution, and are a compromise on all levels. I have had air shocks on two different vehicles, in both cases, after a couple of years they started leaking. On one car it was not really a big deal, it had auto load leveling so the onboard compressor kept them full, the other one I had to top off ever 2-3 days. My current set of air bags has been in use for 5 years now and is still leak free, and I expect it will go another 5, with no problems.