Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

[45Auto]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

I figure it costs less than $50 a year to run the synthetic in my B3 (about 3 quarts) and change it every year. If that saves one outdrive repair over 20 years, the synthetic will look cheap compared to the "cheap stuff"!

 

[bruceb58]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Well, locally, merc HP runs $14 per qt. The same store has regular 90 gear oil on sale under a buck. Tempted to do some home tests to compare (like water mixing, etc) and start using the cheap stuff.

penny wise...pound foolish

 

[Lou C]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

to save $5 bucks.....
You have to be kidding
this is something that you buy 2 qts of....once a year!

 

[friendly_jacek]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

penny wise...pound foolish

to save $5 bucks.....
You have to be kidding
this is something that you buy 2 qts of....once a year!

Thank you all for the friendly remarks.

I did some more digging and appears that the High Performance miracle green fluid is nothing more or nothing less than overpriced pseudosynthetic, group 3, GL-5 gear oil.

Proof:

1. MSDS states that the base oil is Refined Petroleum. This is just dino oil. The CAS number provided (64742-01-4) is for the solvent treated and/or hydrocracked oil also know as pseudosynthetic (and known in Europe as semisynthetic) or group 3.
http://www.brunswicktechteam.com/uploads/1652/1798/041-4704.pdf

2. The high HP boat enthusiasts found themselves that fully synthetic gear oils provide lower outdrive temps and less wear material.
For example from a poster jafo:
?One thing for sure, Merc will only recommend their own lubes and oils, and won't give any recommendations outside of that spectrum. When I switched to RedLine with my old Formula (this is a twin Alpha equipped boat with built SBC's) I no longer saw any fuzz on the plug like I had using the green hi-per lube from Merc. I have heard others say the same when switching to other synthetics as well. Same held true with my Bravo-equipped AT. It also reduced (didn't completely get rid of) the chalking on the side of the drives. I think it is a fairly well-known fact that the only hotter running drive out there than the Alpha is the Bravo III, so every little bit of temp reduction helps, and all synthetics are better with heat than conventional oil. The addition of drive showers and external reservoirs got rid of the chalking completely. I do think some metallurgical failures to shafts and gears in these outdrives could be heat-stress/fatigue related over time.
IMHO, any Amsoil, RedLine, or Royal Purple oil in the drives would be an improvement over the Merc.?
http://www.offshoreonly.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-39602.html

3. Some oil manufacturers specify their GL-5 oils for alpha and bravo where HP is ?required? by Mercruiser.
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/agm.aspx
http://www.penrite.com.au/files/34GIZR0W0E/Marine Gear Oil.pdf

4. I saw overseas Marcruiser dealers recommending GL-5 for alpha and bravo (sorry, can?t find a link.

5. When I changed the water pump impeller in my alpha after 3 years, I remember that the HP green fluid was never replaced in the overflow reservoir as it doesn?t drain with the routine winterizing gear oil changes. I was surprised that the oil was sludged severly in only 3 years of exposure to air and not much heat as the boat is lightly used. Anyone knows that quality synthetic oil (group 4 or 5) doesn?t sludge like that.


Another thing that bothers me about Mercruiser that it bullies na?ve customers into buying only Merc/Quicksilver fluids and it is quite deceptive. Refusing to disclose the GL-5 rating of the gear oils is one of the examples. Requiring 25W40 engine oil while any heavy duty 15W40 oil would do the job is another. Selling the overpriced ?synthetic blend? 25W40 oil containing mostly ?solvent-refined heavy paraffinic? oil (group 1 or 2), 70-90 % and only <10% of true synthetic oil is another telling example (although probably true for most synthetic blend oils).

You can compare yourself:
http://wwwarchive.mercurymarine.com/uploads/1653/1966/168-6078C-16pt.pdf
http://wwwarchive.mercurymarine.com/uploads/1653/1801/003-1647Q-16pt.pdf

 

[Lou C]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

I can't argue some of the technical data...but I trust my mechanic...who has rebuilt many many drives....and he puts the Merc Hi Perf stuff in the ones he services because he sees less wear with it.....I switched to it about 4 years ago and my 20 year old Cobra is still shifting fine....

And if you want to talk overpriced, check out the Mopar synthetic 75W-140 gear oil, required for towing applications in Jeeps and Dodge trucks. Used to be 20/qt, now up to 25 or so. I have used it and my diffs with 110,000 miles on em are completely quiet....of course then you could not find syn 75w-140, only 75w-90...now you can get the 140 from Mobil and Valvoline but it's not widely available....

 

[CharlieB]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

It's difficult to compare apples with oranges to tangerenes, which is just what's happening when comparing petro oils to petro/synth blends too pure synth.

Each has its applications, yes many can be substituted, but mostly it all comes down to maintenance schedules vs costs vs benefits.

Everyone has to make their own decision which is going to be most cost effective for their individual applications.

Someones tag line reads 'Any grease is better than none'

Same can be said for oil changes, and maintenance in general, it HAS TO BE DONE.

That old adage, pay me now or pay me later. Is VERY true.

 

[friendly_jacek]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Update:
I found more info on CAS 64742-01-4 and guess what. It's not group 3. The High-Performance is a plain dino oil with probably solid additive package (Molybden?). Shouldn't be surprising though as Merc never claimed it being synthetic.
The plot thickens.

Reference on CAS 64742-01-4:
http://iaspub.epa.gov/srs/srs_proc_qry.navigate?P_SUB_ID=341305

 

[Don S]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Another oil thread and another oil expert ...............

(Sigh)

 

[FreeBeeTony]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Don't look at me...........I just wanted to know if the green stuff was synthetic.........

 

[Don S]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

I know it isn't Tony.

 

[friendly_jacek]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Another oil thread and another oil expert ...............

(Sigh)

So, Don, you are basically saying that people with some understanding of lubrication are not welcomed here?
I got it.

 

[tommays]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

Specs may be Specs

BUT your talking with people that have seen the results of THOUSANDS of drive oil changes and how the many different oils have looked and what lasted in long term use



What turned black ,what made a cone clutch slip , ect

 

[erikgreen]

Re: Synthetic Outdrive Fluid

So, Don, you are basically saying that people with some understanding of lubrication are not welcomed here?
I got it.

You're putting words in his mouth that he never said.

However, it's probably quite accurate to say that people with closed minds, thin skins, and no patience are not welcomed here, that's true enough.

If you have an "understanding of lubrication" please continue, but be warned that there are a lot of people here with many, many years of experience fixing boats that will poke holes in any old wives' tales, "stuff everybody knows" and outright fabrications if they're wrong

Erik