Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

[Russ5444]

Hey Guys just dropped my gear case on my 98 130hp Evinrude and replaced my water pump but noticed it didn't seal correctly. I proved it by dumping some water down the top of the pump and it leaked out the bottom past the gasket not a lot but enough. I took it apart again to make sure the rubber O-ring wasn't out of place and the gasket was ok but all looked good.
I compared the metal ware plate and the bottom of the housing to see what's going on.
There is a pretty large gap when you put them together without the gasket and I'm wondering do I need to go get a thicker gasket?
I'm also wondering does it really matter is a little leaks out of the water pump? I think it will just drain out of the exhaust but not sure?

Thanks

 

[Benny1963]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

use some 3m aviation from your local auto parts store on the plate to lowerunit .and nothing on the houseing o ring did you replace houseing it may be warped

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Hey Benny the housing is new and I hope not warped.
I picked up a new gasket as I kinda messed up the old one. But I don't think I'm worried about it after sleeping on it last night I feel that if it leaks into the gearcase it will simlpy blow out the wholes either below through the prop. The job of that pump is to push water and this little leak wont stop that from happening. I however feel the ware on that gasket will be more if the water leaks through it but I'll keep an eye on it.

Any one have any comments ? an I way off ?

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

If it's leaking at the junction of the wear plate and pump housing, I'd be worried, since the volume of water pumped will be way down. Are you sure you got the right kit?

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

The diagram here on the BRP parts website shows how all the components should be assembled.

It is important that the seal #73 makes a water tight joint between the housing #62 and the bottom plate #81. the pump will not be pumping correctly if it does not. There should be no gap there at all.

The plate #81 should pull down onto the top of the gearcase with gasket 79 between them. There should be no gap but I don't think a watertight joint there is essential.

(Water is kept out of the gearcase itself by the drive shaft seal #50 in the top of the bearing housing #49 )

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Hey Vic thanks for the detailed info.
I actually have been researching this a lot before posting and did use this exact diag to make sure it's all correct. I'm 99% sure I have the right kit as everything is going together perfectly except this part. I also cross ref'ed the part number to be accurate, it is a OMC part and not an after market too.
I'll give it a third attempt tonight and see if it comes together better but I can almost tell right away that I'll have issues because the plate and the housing don't come together tightly in my hands off the gear case.
I also feel if I use a thicker gasket the #73 seal will not be working because it's not squished.

I'm at a lose ...

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

If you have the right parts, there's no way the housing won't seal tightly against the wear plate. BTW, the impeller MUST be tight against the top of the housing AND the wear plate, or it will pump very poorly. At low RPM's it's a positive displacement pump and won't work very well w/o the sealing. Even relatively minor scoring of the wear plate is enough to make a pump perform poorly. Something, either in the assembly or the parts is not right. Note that #80, the SS cup is keyed and can only make up to the wear plate in one position rotationally. I would guess you've got something wrong in the assembly. If you bought a complete BRP pump kit, there is almost zero likelihood the parts aren't right.

A thicker gasket or sealant will not help a bit, and actually make the pump worse from the start. Are you absolutely certain the impeller is tight against the top of the cup and not pinched in any way. If you have not done a water pump before, I would get someone with experience to give you a hand.

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

As wilde1j says if you have the correct kit its almost 100% certain that all the bits are correct. unless of course its been tampered with before you got it!

I am looking at those O rings 63 and 78. No chance that you have left the old #63 in there?

What is preventing the bottom plate closing tightly on to the body? An old O ring 63, the cup not fitted correctly or as a long shot the wrong impeller.

When its put together there must be the correct clearance for the impeller ie none but without it being gripped so tight that it wont turn.

The thickness of the gasket wont make any difference to the fit of the bottom plate onto the pump body and within reason probably wont make any difference to the overall assembly.

Look carefully at the things wilde1 is suggesting especially the rotational positioning of the cup.

It really should be so simple.


I note there are two different kits for TL and TX models. Dunno what the difference is there though. Something external with the body I reckon. something to check on perhaps?

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Thanks for all the info guys. Your asking all the right questions and I have looked into them all previously and will explain them out here one at a time to make sure I didn't miss anything.
The kit has all the housing etc in it therefore has a complete water pump, impeller etc so I hope the impeller is correct and hasn't been replaced from the dealer incorrectly.
Besides that if a just take the housing and the ware plate in my hand and line up the bolts wholes there is a gap. This is the same gap i see when assembled. It looks like a inside lip on the housing is extending down past the outside edge thus making the edge have a gap.

I put it all back together last night and same thing. I double checked everything again and I have it all correct. I turned the shaft clockwise to see if the impeller was hanging or anything inside and it all performed correctly.
I assume the side 0 ring (the big pain in the ***** one) is getting compressed and seated correctly but can't tell.

I'm about to put the gear case back on the run the engine to see how the water flows as I don't want to go messing with the kit.
Bottom line is if the water is flowing properly out the pee whole and the pump leaks inside the gear case which is submerged anyways I think I'll be ok? thoughts

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Your terminology is confusing me ... the impeller goes in the SS cup #80, which in turn goes in the housing #62. The whole deal then goes on top of the wear plate #81. I've ignored the soft parts and the key, but there's just no way the pump housing won't seat tightly against the wear plate if you have the correct parts assembled correctly. I've done hundred's and never had a problem. BTW, you don't have the wear plate upside down , do you?

Are you absolutely sure the soft parts are in the correct order as shown in the parts list? I can assure you if there's a gap between the pump housing and the wear plate, it's not going to work right, period. One important comment: some of the kits include stuff used on other motors and may not be right for yours, since the pump kits cover a range of motors and model years.

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Thanks Wild, your getting personal with this issue like I am. If I was in the shop with you we'd be setting back throughing beer caps at it right now.

Your comments are exactly what I'm saying I can even take the cup (part 80) out of the equation along with the soft parts and use only the ware plate 81 and the housing 62. These two should come together tightly as the cup seats inside along with everything else.
But it's not and it only goes on one way there is no upside down due to the bolt pattern.
Let me try and discribe it a little more on these parts only.

The bottom of the housing seals to the ware plate in a sort of "e" not an "o" shape. (Hope your with me)
The middle part of the e shape is actually lower and I can tell when I put it on a flat surface and it tedders back and forth on it.
I'm sure this is the problem and was hoping by tighting the bolts up it would push up and seal nicely but it's not happening.

Hope that explains it

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Russ, can you post a picture? You need to use a photo hosting service such as Photobucket (free) to do this. You know, a picture is worth a thousand words. From your description, it sounds like the housing may be defective, If it's placed on any flat surface, it should not rock, but sit perfectly flat. The wear plate is flat, right?

BTW. the old housing is probably fine (I didn't think the kit included the housing, since it's not a wear part).

 

[Vic.S]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

I am seriously beginning to think that one or more of the parts in the kit is wrong.

Carefully compare the new parts with the old. If you find one thats not an exact match its wrong.

BTW I though a kit included a housing

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Well boys I put it back together again with nothing different and it worked. I took my time and used gease to hold all the 0 rings on perfect place. It didn't seal nicely until I got pretty physical with the bolts and figured I must have squeezed it all together.
Want to thank you all for your help and letting me know I was doing everything right.

Next question is I have an extra O ring in this kit. yes yes all the parts in the diag are in the water pump so don't even go there. This O ring is a brown color and not black like the others. In the kit it shows it on the top of the drive shaft but that doesn't make sence.
I have a feeling it slides over the top of the shaft just past the gear part on the little divit. Maybe to stop slashing water from pushing up into where the drive shaft and engine connect.
There was no O ring there when I took it apart but you never know, the engine is 10 years old and the last time the gearcase was dropped it could have been forgotten.
thoughts ?

And thanks again guys (wahoo)

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

You did grease the splines on the driveshaft (but not the top end) before assembly, right? The O ring is there as you suspected to keep the crankshaft from rusting itself to the driveshaft, and you could can probably get by w/o it, especially if you only operate in fresh water. If the driveshaft had a groove machined near the bottom of the splines, that's where the O ring should go (not all older motors have the groove).

Everything will work w/o the O ring (and the grease) ... the pain will come next time you need to drop the LU.

Why didn't the instructions make sense???

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Thanks Jim just about to bolt it on right now and glad to see I'm on the right track with that brown O ring.
The instuctions show this brown O ring hoovering above the top of the shaft and I had no idea if i was to slid it right down the shaft to the water pump or what. Because there was nothing there in the first place I was a little lost.

The molly grease is on the splines and all I need to do is grow 2 extra arms to hold the gear case while i bolt it back together.

Cheers Jim thanks for the help bud !

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Get a bud to help get the LU back on ... it helps to rock the flywheel to get the splines engaged. Just try to get one bolt well started, then you can let go.

You should be all set to do it next time, and hopefully a little smoother!

 

[Russ5444]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

LU is on and tested this morning. Everything is working perfectly. Time to get back on the water ! cheers

 

[CatTwentyTwo]

Re: Help New Water pump gasket leaking do I need to worry

Russ, I installed a new BRP pump kit about 4 years ago and noticed the same thing. Looking down at the top of the pump it was between the 7 and 8:00 position, you could easily slide a .030 feeler gauge in there. I must have had that pump on and off a half dozen times trying to find something wrong. I finally convinced myself that it must be normal and ran it that way with no problem. I just installed another new BRP kit a few months ago and it clamped right down with no gap.