1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

[bigpoppakdog]

Heres the story. Bought this boat with the understanding that the previous owner had reversed battery terminal wires.

1. Took it out, ran ok except surged at high speed.
2. Thought that was fuel, changed all fuel components(cleaned carbs)
3. Boat ran fine again, except at high speed.
4. Boat suddenly lost spark.
5. Replaced starter selenoid, stator.
6. Boat ran again, except high speed
7. Bought new retainers(red) so I could adjust slow idle screws.
8. Boat suddenly had no spark(all cyclinders)
9. Replaced pulse pack. Still no spark.
10. Rectifier tested as dead. Bypassed ignition safety circuit.
(lost spark regained spark now 4 times. This motor at 3/4 throttle still flew and had awesome hole shot. Just made a major "hiccup" at full throttle attempt). This has never died on me while using it. Get home, park it, go out the following day and won't start.

Any thoughts. I'm going insane, it seems like this thing "jars" something loose and causes spark to quit. I didn't change ignition coil. Spark plugs are new and correct for engine. Ignition shows power to terminals where it's suppose to. Seems to me the only things thats left is changing ignition coil, starter safety switch performs properly as it will shut down ignition when I throttle it up. The stator-rectifier are for charging the battery for this motor correct? Thus not related to ignition??? Sensor, distributor, pulse pack, ignition coil, ignition switch are the ignition components right? The ignition coil does not create a spark when I have lead pulled off coil and stick a screwdriver in end. That's about it without writing a book. HELP!!!

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

stator creates ac electricity to run the motor. recitifier, converts ac to dc, to charge the battery. rectifier, would be dead, from crossing the battery cables, and more could be wrong if he tried to start the motor with the cables crossed.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

what else should I change? I suppose I should change the ignition coil, replace rectifier, but what else? Could the stator I bought(from Iboats.co ) be faulty? Can I check that with a volt/ohm tester? There isn't a lot of parts left to change on this motor.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

it's been too long since i worked on one of those. here are 6 pages of test,
http://www.boatpartstore.com/page28.asp

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

one thing that could be the main culprit, when I tested the coil for spark jump I get no spark. When I turned the key in the on position, my meter showed over 300 voltz at terminal 5 which is where the powerpack and coil connect to. When I turned the motor over, my meter showed 1.5 voltz at terminal 5. Also, my pulse pack after trying to turn engine over and then keeping key in on position i noticed a "clicking" noise coming from the pulse pack. Is that normal? When I turn the key off then the noise stops, when I turn key back on it doesn't make the noise, only after trying to turn engine over and leaving key in on position.

 

[F_R]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

First the bad news: Those motors had a problem of suddenly losing spark and quitting, but running just fine by the time you got towed in. Even when new. It was a problem within the pulse pack.

But that doesn't mean you should condemn the pulse pack without checking everything else. I get the feeling that you are having a problem with the 12V input to the pulse pack. Possibly a bad key switch or bad wire or connection. It won't work with low voltage input.

You could also have a problem with the sensor wiring or sensor itself or sensor air gap.

Finally, those were famous for the distributor rotor arcing through to the distributor shaft. But you say you don't have fire directly off the coil so the rotor is not involved there....but just something to keep in mind.

Now as for that alternator/rectifier/ignition relationship. The safety circuit was to prevent accidental starting. It wouldn't have spark until the motor was cranking and the alternator putting out juice to turn the safety circuit on, which then powered up the pulse pack. All of this of course doesn't mean much because you said you bypassed the safety circuit.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

i have voltage to terminals going to pack. Actually had ignition checked by mech. he said it must be the stator. I replaced the stator and it shut down after two days of use. I don't have a dva meter to check stator. I guess could have a bad stator, but I wouldn't think so. Also when I do the ohms check and the short to ground check my old stator and new one check out fine according to manual. Is there a way I can check with a regular volt tester to see if I have power going to the pack other than checking the terminals with the key switch on? I don't have spark coming out of ignition coil( I have not replaced that yet.)

 

[BillP]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

This is a friggin rant because the memories are still branded deeply into my memory banks...

Without a doubt one of the worst OMCs was the early 115. It was the first era of electrical "black box" engines. I bought one of those 115 beasts new in 1969 and it was plagued with problems...starting in gear, not starting, easy starting, automatically jumping into reverse from neutral, only starting in gear, running perfectly one minute and dead the next. No dealer ever got it running right for more than a few days at a time. They changed every possible component, swapped wires, did everything known to man. It was just a malfunctioning defect called an outboard that consumed human energy and ruined many days on the water. I fought it for about 2 yrs and finally gave it away for pennies on the dollar.

Get rid of it and never look back!

bp

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

your rant doesn't help me other than make me depressed. I don't have gear issues(knock on wood). But the electrical components seem simple enough. Stator to pulse pack to ignition coil to distributor to spark plugs. Hard for me to stomach the thought that this motor cannot be fixed.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

another thing, my manual says that you can use a volt tester to check pulse pack by connecting to blue wire and cranking over. How much voltage should show up when doing this process?

 

[R.Johnson]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

This is a battery, capacitor discharge ignition system. You are jumping all over the place with stator changes, rectifiers, etc. First! start with the proper service information, it would take forever to discibe this whole system. Starting at the top, check the ohm reading on the sensor. The sensor wires are constantly being flexed where they come out of the stator plate, are they broken at the flex point? There is a anti-reverse spring around the crankshaft, under the stator plate, is it broken, grounding out the whole system. What is the voltage reading at the pak with the key on? While cranking? If you put in a new pak from Rapair, and retain the clipper, or safety switch, you void the warranty on the pak. Did you remove this switch. We could go, on, and on here. I could tell you to go to a dealer, but they propably would'nt even look at it, and if they did, you would probably get some kid half the age of that system. My advice is to get the proper service information, and study it. Is this engine sound to start with, as you could be spending lot's of money? Don't spend it grooming a dead horse.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

well i've done readings concerning volts, but was told that unless I use a DVA meter my readings are invalid.

 

[R.Johnson]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

This is just some more of the confusion regarding this system. You need the proper service information, and you will need to study it till you understand it. You are somewhat on your own, as I doudt if many dealerships' will even look at an engine of this age. The last one I worked for whould not. You can trouble shoot this system with a standard volt, ohm meter, and just a single filiment 12 volt light bulb. Find a factory service manual for this engine, and it will take you through all the steps', believe me, you are going to need it. I have seen trained mechanics' stumble around this engine.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

I have the manual and have studied it. I am no mechanic, but to me the basic mechanics of this motor is simple. I do not have the ignition switch installed, I just removed it. I was told that the stator only is used to charge the battery if this switch is removed, so the main power source is the 12 volt battery. I checked the reading with the key switch to "on" and have volts in terminals except the terminals coming out of power pack, they don't show any power. Now should they with the key in "on" or not until the engine is cranked? I have a new powerpack and the ignition coil shows resistence under ohm check. I was told that I need to look under the flywheel since the sensor is located there. Does this sensor provided the juice to the powerpack? I believe it does. The manual also states erratic high speed could result in these wires being bad. Which by the way happens when it ran. Got to full throttle and it cut out like power suddenly shut down then came back on again. Once down to 3/4 throttle ran great.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

Ok just got home and did some tests according to the manual. When I did an ohms test between sensor leads the manual says you should show 4-6 ohms. I have ZERO. Also when checking for ground shorts you are suppose to attach one lead to sensor wire other lead to ground and work throttle linkage. Manual says you should have 100,000 ohms resistance. I have that until I work throttle, when I do my meter needle jumps from high to zero as I adjust the throttle. Also when I wiggle where the wires attack to my meter jumps. I don't move the throttle forward or back, just move where the wires are my meter jumps. Have new pulse pack, coil shows resistance during ohms check, spark plugs new, wires new, distibutor looks new also but ????? When I throttle to full would these wires cause motor to cut out real quick?

 

[dansr]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

yeah hi i also have 1970 115 hp outboard johnson it will start in my driveway with hose hooked up to it but when i put it on the lake it loses all spark and will not start if anyone has any answers i would really apreciate it im pretty frustrated i just replaced the coil and stator and have the manual ran all voltage tests got good spark on land not in the water though.

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

i got mine running...long story, but ended up being a wire that cost no $$$. I'll send you the scenario in a private message.

 

[dansr]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

thx man i got it runnin went and bombed it on the lake she purrin like a kitten thx for the reply

 

[bigpoppakdog]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

what was wrong with it?

 

[dansr]

Re: 1970 Evinrude 115 HP Loses spark-gains spark etc..

dont really know went over it tightened all electrical connectors. throttle cable has to be precicely set on neutral try disconnecting the throttle cable and setting the start arrow by hand then reconnect the throttle cable being sure not to move the start arrow secure throttle cable with tape so it doesnt move. thats wut i did hope this can help you.