No power going to my ignition

[winner owner]

I inherited a 1986 Winnercraft 1850 Sea Quest C.C.with a 120h.p. Evinrude V4
VRO ,motor serial # E120TXCUR
G1442751

At home I changed the gas primer and hose then tried to start the motor .. it cranked very slow.I then purchased a 150 amps battery charger with engine start feature.With charger selector on engine start
the motor cranked very good several times but did not start.I had supper and tried again afterwards. this time no crank ? I found there is no power to the ignition key.There is power to the distributor.There is a big plug on the port side of the motor ,one side of this plug goes directly to the ignition key,I found there is no power going from this plug to the ignition key.

Is this plug defective?I was cleaning inside this plug right after I encountered no crank.. and i caused a big spark?Did I create a second problem?

What year is my motor?

PLEASE! Help...sorry for the long post.

P.S.I also later found that I had put the gas primer and hose on backwards!

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: No power going to my ignition

There is a 20 ampere power fuse inline on one of the smaller red wires leading from/to the starter solenoid, a couple inches away from the solenoid. I suspect you blew it which would prevent voltage from being applied to the ignition switch.

A service manual would be a big help to you.

Year of the engine? What is the model number?

 

[ezeke]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Disconnect the battery when you work on the engine wiring. The starter circuit and the ignition system are separate, but if you allow voltage to reach the ignition system you will damage expensive components.

It is a risky practice to charge the battery while connected to the engine.

Look between the cylinder heads for a nickel sized aluminum disk; the model and serial numbers may be stamped there.

 

[wulf311]

Re: No power going to my ignition

You have a 1987 motor. As earlier stated check the inline fuse. When you were cleaning you might have shorted accross one of the poles. ALLWAYS DISCONNECT THE BATTERY WHEN DOING ANY ELECTRICAL WORK.
99% of the time nothing bad happens but that other 1% is a pain in the arse. Good luck

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Thanks for the info guys!

Regarding model and serial numbers,top # is E120TXCUR ,bottom# is G1442751

I will keep you posted with any progress.I love this boat..this site is great too!

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Hey guys.

About that ignition problem..I certainly will be on the lookout for a service manual... as it turned out ..it was the 20 amp fuse adjacent to the starter solenoid that got the motor cranking again!
So now with the purchase of a new marine battery shes cranking very good ..the motor started up ..but very hesitant ..also quick to stall upon release of ignition key.I increased motor running time by proper use of choke feature..also by adjusting lever at bow side of motor ..not sure if this lever controls gas or oxygen mix. however still can,t maintain independent idle.There is a screw at the end of pen sized shaft to left of above lever when facing the stern..I eventually turned this screw 4 full turns clockwise and managed independent engine rpm at 3000 by also shifting acceleration lever from neutral to forward.

Well ,after finally running independent a minute or two I hear a buzzer sounding on and off around the acceleration lever .
I put gas mixed with 2 stroke oil at 50 to 1 ratio before initially attempting to start the motor. I thought the vro was disconnected since I saw no oil tank?

Also I had the garden water hose connected to the motor.Is there another buzzer perhaps for motor temperature? temperature gage was just below red.

Will proper motor adjustments be sufficient or does it sound like a rough running motor in need of additional maintenance?

I would very much appreciate it if you guys moved me forward from here!

 

[ezeke]

Re: No power going to my ignition

The buzzer is the overheat horn telling you that the engine has overheated and that you should shut it off immediately and fix the cooling system.

As you probably noticed, the temperature gauge only reads one side of the motor; the switches for the horn are in both banks of cylinders.

The linkage and synchronization of the control system is a step by step process that must be followed in an orderly fashion in order to avoid serious damage to the engine.

It would be smart to get the manual first. Here's a link to a used one for less than half price:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1987...0Q2el1116QQitemZ250294315242#ebayphotohosting

 

[wulf311]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Since you say that you inherited the engine brings another question. How long has it set? If it has sat over 1 year without use I would recommend that you have the carbs overhauled and replace the waterpump impeller. The quality of fuel that we use now leaves alphaultines "tar like subatance" as a residue when the fuel evaporates. Any restriction in the carb sytem will cause a lean run condition which will raise cylinder temp and prevent proper oiling. You say the buzzer goes on and off. There are 4 different alarm sounds that can occur, the overhear is a constant sound, the other three deal with low oil, no oil, and fuel restriction. I will have to look it up at the shopin the morning.

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Thanks for the concerns ezeke!
I am in the process of getting this manual.
In the meantime i am wondering why she did not idle independently?
My brother (previous owner) dealt with water in the gas tank.He advised I install a gas water filter (have not yet).Another bro says ..carb needs to be cleaned due to previous water problem.Any relation to why she did not idle independently?Also a link to cooling system maintenance would be greatly appreciated ...since I wont be fishing for a wile to come ..it seems!

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Hey wulf..hope all is well!

The buzzer definitely sounded on then off !

My brother had the boat sit 2 maybe even three years.He had the following maintanance done ..though no date on the invoice..could be prior one year?He ran it once on water ..she flew he said..then stauled. He got towed back I think..I suspect service below came after.

1. Replaced starter and solenoid
2. Replaced water pump and thermostats
3. rebuilt all 4 carborators
4. Killed about 50 wasps in boat
5. drained out over 40 gallons of old gas and replaced with fresh
6. cleaned the fuel system - filter
7. charged battery
8. started and adjusted linkages
9. runs great (7 hrs labour at $60/hr)

Parts:
3 cans wasp spray $15 http://forums.iboats.com/images/smilies/eek.gif

1 used starter $75
1 starter solenoid $28
2 thermostats $58
water pump kit #3142 $51
carb kits $48
1 inline fuel filter $3.95
replaced bearing $50

Grand total $792

Ps. First time i had a good look at this invoice!Must check my garden hose water supply for kinks..though no independent idle is still a mystery to me.I have not touched it since advised to get service manual first!

 

[CharlieB]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Sitting for two years has aged the water pump impeller, it is moving water, but most of us VERY HIGHLY RECOMMEND that you again replace the impeller, for the simple fact that it is very cheap insurance to prevent a seized engine from low cooling flow overheating your motor. Get in the habit of replacing your impeller every two years or less, they age and die just from exposer to the air.

Now, as for the motor not idling, two items, first, old fuel in the tank, drain it and replace with fresh fuel, second, those (recently) cleaned carbs, well, two years isn't recent, the fuel that WAS in them has dried and left deposits that have restricted either the idlel fuel passages or the idle air passages enough that the motor will not idle correctly, and they MUST BE cleaned again.

Idle speed and ignition timing settings are critical to this engine running properly once put to work on the water. Changing any adjustments in attempt to get it running better on the garden hose is not really accomplishing much. Purchase a manual, clean your carbs, be sure the float settings are perfectly the same on all carbs, link and synch the carbs and timing, and it is going to run correctly.

Is there an remote oil tank mounted under one of the rear seats?

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Hey CharlieB..I appreciate all your help considering its my fist boat and all.I can,t see an oil tank anywhere that I can access..though am quite certain all cables going to the motor are either electric or mechanical.

Again my motor is a evinrude 120 hp v4 vro..is gas oil mixture at 50-1 good for me? I see recent posts mixing 25-1 ratio on smaller motors.

Hope to find a manual today.. so i can locate all the parts you suggested I service. I tried to purchase one on e bay but the seller won,t ship to Canada.Take care all!

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: No power going to my ignition

A mixture of 50/1 is correct for that engine IF the VRO system has been disconnected. You can use the following procedure to double check to see if the VRO gas indeed been disconnected.

(VRO Pump Conversion To Straight Fuel Pump)
(J. Reeves)

You can convert the VRO pump into a straight fuel pump, eliminating the oil tank and VRO pump warning system, but retain the overheat warning setup (and fuel restriction warning if so equipped) by doing the following:

1 - Cut and plug the oil line at the engine so that the oil side of the VRO pump will not draw air into its system. Trace the wires from the back of the VRO to its rubber plug (electrical plug) and disconnect it.

2 - Trace the two wires from the oil tank to the engine, disconnect those two wires, then remove them and the oil tank.

3 - Mix the 50/1 oil in the proper amount with whatever quantity fuel you have. Disconnect the fuel line at the engine. Pump the fuel primer bulb until fuel exits that hose with the tint of whatever oil you used. Reconnect the fuel hose.

That's it. If you want to test the heat warning system to ease your mind, have the key in the on position, then ground out the tan heat sensor wire that you'll find protruding from the cylinder head. The warning horn should sound off.

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Thanks, how do I ground out the tan heat sensor wire ?

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Hi all. Ok, I took a standard electric wire.. connected one side to the tan heat sensor wire that is protruding from the cylinder head and the other side to a terminal where the negative wire from the battery is connected to..adjacent to the starter..no warning buzzer sounded?

I couldn't find a manual to purchase today..but one is on order. I was encouraged to purchase not the original..instead a simulate..apparently more user friendly.They promised for Thursday.

I also purchased a water pump impeller..proceeded to install it by removing 4 same and one bigger bolt from lowest member which houses the propeller.The lower section won't disengage.Do I need to pry it open or? I don't think i will harm the motor proceeding with this while I wait for the manual.

Please help!

 

[Joe Reeves]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Simply ground the TAN wire directly to the powerhead (anywhere). You did have the key in the ON position when you grounded that wire?

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Yes..so far so the starter does not engage.Should I have put the power lever to drive and turn the key all the way?What about disengaging the lower part of motor that houses the propeller? I removed 5 bolts from the bottom and it wont budge with hand pressure? I wanted to install a new water pump impeller.

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Hi all! Here is an update. After receiving a service manual .. I changed the Impeller .Also I installed a water separator fuel filter between gas tank and primer.I found bad gas that I did not detect in the fuel hose when I earlier siphoned the gas tank. Bad gas between gas tank and primer in the gas hose caused the hard cold start and an inability to maintain independent idle.Joe Reeves suggestion to remove gas hose from vro pump then prime until I saw a good gas and oil mixture before connecting the gas hose back to vro pump ..was the remedy! Now she starts up first crank.. barely any choke ! However I am still getting a 1/2 second buzzer followed by a 1 second pause when the temperature gauge is between green and red. Its peeing noticeably better, but In order to dismiss a overheated motor,I am still unable to create a constant buzzer warning when I tested the temperature warning buzzer by grounding temp wire to the head? I can't figure ..
when the vro was disconected by one of the 2 previous owners, how likely was the no oil warning buzzer NOT disconnected. There is 1 wire out of 4 or 5 disconected from the back of the vro.Any thoughts?

 

[ezeke]

Re: No power going to my ignition

The three or four wire harness from the VRO pump to the main engine harness has an amphenol connector that is usually tucked behind the tilt trim relay box. The amphenol has to be disconnected if the engine is running on premix or the alarms will continue. You should tape up the ends of the plug in case someone should decide to use the system again.

The engine end of the amphenol shows in the wiring diagram in the back of your service manual as the original three wire plug with tan, black and gray wires.

You need to ground the control part of the disconnected temp switch wire to ground the alarm and test the circuit. The ignition switch must be in the run position.

 

[winner owner]

Re: No power going to my ignition

Thanks! I will look into it hopefully tomorrow.