Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

[QC]

My youngest, Brian, got a ticket at the local skate park. He was cited for no knee pads; he did have on his helmet and elbow pads. The mandatory appearance was on Monday. He had to miss school and I had to accompany him of course. First offense and we had to see a Juvenile traffic court Judge. We were given the option to go to trial, and I suggested to him that he could come back and have a chance at beating it if the officer didn't show. I had second thoughts about that. Fact is he didn't have on his knee pads. He didn't want to come back, so he is paying . . . $77 . . .

This is a City ordinance. State law on Bicycle helmets requires a warning. This Judge could not do anything as this was a preliminary hearing to make a plea. I should also note that the Notice of Mandatory Appearance had an automatic seven day delay due to overcrowding of the court . . . Ya think?

When he got the ticket he was sat down with about 20 other kids. There were around six or seven officers. One kid was kicked when he didn't put down his cell phone quickly enough, he was calling his mom . . . Skate parks are known for some riff raff and even drugs, so we are reluctant to let him go. On the other hand I hate succumbing to bullies or riff raff when it should be a good wholesome place for kids to play in their town. It is actually one town over which is a little less safe than our town, but they have a better skate park.

I was originally mega PO'd. Mostly that the city would apply that much force and that the kid was kicked. I teach my kids to repsect the police, but they are not helping much . . . What are your thoughts on this?

 

[MrBossman]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

If your child broke the rules he needs to go and explain it which is a simple matter. As far as someone being "kicked" thats a matter of hear say if you didnt see it and has no bearing on what your kid did or did not do. Solution=just obey the law. sorry Im sure he has learned his lesson about the law.

 

[Drowned Rat]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Wow, I believe it's okay to enforce the rules, but dang. The court appearance seems excessive, but perhaps the kids they're trying to round up in that net need to experience that. $77 also seems excessive. Either way, it is what it is and it sounds like you made it a constructive learning experience for your kid. What're ya gonna do, ya know.

 

[QC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

As far as someone being "kicked" thats a matter of hear say if you didnt see it and has no bearing on what your kid did or did not do.

Well I expected that someone would say that, but I didn't waiver in how I posted it because I believe him. There was another kid there with him who also got a ticket and said exactly the same thing. There was no reason for them to rehearse this part. My kid knew that he would not get any reaction other than he would have to pay any fine. With that said, I think it has a huge "bearing" on my ultimate biotch and concern which is that a situation like this may reduce their respect for the law and police, not the reverse . . .

 

[oops!]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

i am sooo sorry.....

my blood is starting to boil, the fact that a child .....out playing.....just being a kid....is faced with harassment by the cops....

quote...."in a room with 20 other kids"....

the police have stooped to charging kids for being kids.....


instead of keeping the drugs and thugs.....(and weirdos) away from the skate board park.....(esentially a older kids playground)......the cops actually are trying to make money off the children......a 77 dollar fine to a 12 year old at $10 a week in allowance is darn near a years salary for him.

yes he broke the rules.......but "ell when we were skate boarding....they hadnt even invented knee pads for skate boarding.....

as far as going to court for the appearance....it could be a good experiance for brian......about truth....duty....and consenquences......

but out side of that.......i am just pizzed !

 

[Windykid]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Qc, I'm with you on this. I believe law enforcment has gotten way out of hand. When my Children were young, they were playing with there BB guns down at the creek. They shouldnt have been there but another leason learned. Any way a neighbor call the police and reported shots fired. Next thing the SWAT team showed up and pulled real guns on the kids. The kids were tramatized to say the least. They were 8and 9 years old. If a law enforcement official cant tell the difference between a 9 year old with a red rider and a true gang member, then I dont trust the police anymore.

I feel for your son, this is bull $%#T to say the least.

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Geeze! Like the cops have nothing better to do? As many thugs that are on the streets they pick on kids!
I know rules are rules but thats just BS.
Total waste of the courts time and taxpayer dollars!

Meanwhile the dope dealers are going strong while the cops harass kids!

 

[freddyray21]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I don't know the reason behind the law. Apparently it was thought needed. Complain to your alderman or councilman to get the law changed, but in the meantime your son broke the law and it seems there are not mitigating factors. The child that got kicked is a seperate issue and that needs to be complained about to the chief or the council ect as it should not happen. A police officer who cannot control children in a situation like this needs some additional training or they are in the wrong field. this is from a former law enforcement officer.

 

[rogerwa]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Two words.. Nanny State. Waste of taxpayer dollars.

 

[NelsonQ]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I'm just thinking of when I was a kid. They would have been tickled pink to find us wearing a helmet or any padding. Instead, we just went out in shorts and banged ourselves up.

I'm all for the safety equipment, but policing it beyond a helmet is a little overkill on the side of the police/state. I guess being city or state run property is one thing, but a fine for lack of knee pads. What's next? $100 for not wearing a mouth guard and a jock.

I agree that the kids need to respect the law and learned a lesson. If the cop kicked at a kid, then they need to learn that respect is something you earn and that's not the way to teach kids to learn to respect them. It does the opposite and needs to go both ways.

I just think the legal system could find better things to do than prosecuting pre-teen children for lack of knee pads.

 

[JB]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Lay off the cops, Oops and QC. They didn't make the law, they just enforce it. Failing to do so would be negligence. There are all sorts of liability issues here that our litigation crazy modern society would jump on. Those activities and some of the people who hang out there are dangerous. You need concientious cops there.

One cop kicking (??) a (defiant and mouthy?) kid is not a demonstration of law enforcement ethics and should not be blamed on all cops. It should be investigated and that one cop held accountable for what really happened.

If you think a (nanny state?) law is bad and should not be enforced, go after the people who made the law, not the underpaid, under appreciated public servants who are charged with enforcing it.

I am so thankful that I grew up in a different society where we were allowed greater freedom to take risks and the cops were our friends. I don't think injury attorneys were, even then.

 

[rubiksolved]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

wow... honestly, i'm all for being respectful to cops... but when they abuse their power and use excessive force... it reallllly ticks me off -_-

but this is true with anything... there are good and bad people in every occupation.

 

[SS MAYFLOAT]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

At least in your state your kids can enjoy parks like you have. They have tried them in Ohio, but liability insurance and the threats of big lawsuits prevent fun things like that in many areas.

I would think that the court system would have you show proof of purchasing knee pads in order to make things legal. Sorta like getting cited for a broken windshield, but no fine if it is repaired.

Two different places and occasions within the state of Ohio, teens made a BMX bike track. They only used shovels and did the work after school. The track was a real attraction and even drew kids in from out of the area. Two boys collided and one got hurt, but not serious. That track was then bulldozed down within days. Later the officials found out about the other track and did the same. Now where and what are these kids at and doing? I liked the old days when things were called accidents.

I believe the treatment was over the top a bit. The system is actually looking out for the safety of your son so that he and others can enjoy the recreational facilities built for them. Lots of kids are not so lucky in having places to have fun...........SS

 

[AZMinyard]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Growing up we ran around doing all sorts of unsafe things. Riding bikes without pads, skateboarding in an abandoned water treatment plant, dating redheads, firing off bottle rocks and black cats, etc. We were never hassled by the local PD and if anyone ever did do something "criminal" and was caught, it always amounted to a ride home in the back of a squad car and having to face the music at home.

Of course, there was music back home to be faced for us. A spanking with a belt was a form of punishment and not a child abuse violation. You had rules and expectations in a family and you knew that the worst punishment was the look of disappointment on your parents faces.

Most of the time the local PD would give us rides for fun, letting us turn on the sirens and lights, help us scare our other friends, etc. We were (mostly) good kids and they were good cops. At least one of my friends contributes his career in law enforcement to Deputy Powers; another gives him credit for getting him off of drugs. Even when we did get ?busted? for something, we understood that what we were doing was wrong and we got caught. The next day when we saw an officer, we were chatting and buddies again ? he?d make sure that everything was okay at home and we would apologize for our actions. We were never profiled as little ruffians or ticketed for minor things when a stern warning would suffice.

Enough of my lamenting a different time ? I?ll get on to my 2 cents worth.

Take this as a learning experience for your son. Go to the hearing, state your case in the Gods honest truth and see how it turns out. Then talk to your son about it. If you win, it is a lesson in justice ? ?you are a good kid, you keep your nose clean, so you came out alright this time; follow the rules next time or you will be mowing a lot of lawns to pay off the fine.? If you loose, it is a lesson in the letter of the law ? ?we know what you did was minor, we know that this seems like an excessive punishment, but the law was broken and when that happens, there are consequences to face; if this happens again, you are going to be held responsible.? Who knows, this experience might just help protect your insurance rates when he is old enough to drive (?I wasn?t speeding that much!?)

As far as the statement from the other kid about being kicked ? I would be surprised to find out that it was more than a slight swing of the foot ? a pay attention tap. When you are in court, ask for the name of the officer?s Sgt or CO. Give him a call and inquire. You get an answer and they (if it was something serious) get to know that it is not alright.

Well, I feel like I should get back to whittling on the back porch with my dogs and dreaming of the good ol? days . . . good luck with your situation.

 

[jbjennings]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I'm shocked that folks in your area have laws requiring kids to wear kneepads while riding skateboards. But then I saw you're from California. I guess on the average, folks there must like having lots of laws. It seems to me these days that police, game wardens, etc. are just out to make the state or city some easy dough. A 77 dollar fine for no kneepads just reinforces that idea. I suspect the boating laws are just as crazy. I would think the police would give your son a warning for this at worst. It's not like they can't come back the next day and see if he was "flaunting the law", knowing if he likes to ride skateboards and hang out in that park he would be back. It also makes me wonder why they have "6 or 7 cops" at a darned park. Is that where the "bad guys" like to hang out?
Curious,
JBJ

 

[MrBossman]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

My experience with cops that give warnings and the ones who give tickets on the first violation depends alot on "intent" . If the play area has signs in plain view that everyone HAS TO SEE before they enter, there is no question as to if the kids had true intent to break the law. In this case they dont deserve a warning, the sign was the warning. It will take some real hard evidence to deal with the cop that "assaulted" the kid. The lesson is the cops dont have to be fair, dont have to be nice, and dont have to give warnings. A local skate board park near by was just in the news last week for the same problem of kids refusing to obey the signs..Part of the problem is in the public schools teachers have little power to "make" children obey and this carries on to after school. The cops dont have to worry about the politics of the school system which will often fire a teacher for just touching a child.

 

[jbjennings]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

Your're probably right, Bossman. they probably did have signs and the kid should have had his stuff or stayed off the skateboard there. I just hate the idea of a kid getting hassled by the law and FINED just for riding a skateboard.
JBJ

 

[i386]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

We were given the option to go to trial, and I suggested to him that he could come back and have a chance at beating it if the officer didn't show.

I'm sure this isn't going to be a popular response. Is that what you want your 12 year old to learn about the consequences of breaking rules? Look for an opportunity to beat it?

 

[mickjetblue]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I think the question needs to be asked about how the law was
put on notice for the kids. Are signs posted that state explicitly what safety equipment
is mandatory? Are the fines for breaking the laws posted?

Do the kids know about the laws for wearing safety equipment?
Do the kids break the safety laws on purpose, and willfully?

No matter what the emotions are about this scenario, it's a no win scenario.
Pay the fine, and make sure the safety laws are obeyed in the future.
Kids are better off respecting the law, especially when they grow into adults.

Then you can forget about it, and don't let anger or stress eat up your insides.

 

[JustJason]

Re: Mandatory court appearance for my 12 year old . . .

I'd refuse to pay it and let them throw your kid in jail. While your kids in jail call all the news staions.
It shouldn't be YOUR fault because the KID broke a law. (which is a dumb law at that)
If you refuse to pay it... what happens??? are they going to throw you in jail for something YOU didn't do???? Are they going to throw you in jail, which probably cost taxpayers more than 77 bucks a day per inmate... over a 77 dollar ticket?? Its not like it's a speeding ticket... they can't take the kids imaginary drivers license away.
What if you were a single parent family, and you as the breadwinner had to work 10+ hours a day. A 12 year old is perfectly capable of getting himself to and from school. I did it, in a major city. What if you told your kid "don't hang out at the skate park". And he chooses to go anyways. How as a parent can you be responsible for everything the kid does. You did no gross negligence. So let them throw the kid in jail. And sick the news media on them. That will get that dumb law changed in no time.
You said it was a skate park.... was your kid on a bike or on skates or a skateboard?
What kind of weenies made this law in the first place??? They want every kid in a helmet, kneepads, and elbowpads???????? What comes next??? body armor like pro dirtbikers wear???
Come up to new hampshire some time and feel free to ride a motorcycle without a helmet. Smart idea???? that's up to you.... And that's the beauty of it. Kids don't think like adults... clearly. How can you hold them to the same standards as adult? Kids are young and impressionable..... It sounds like a fabulous idea for police to harrass children over kneepads.... if you want your kids to hate cops by the time they are old enough to drive.


The whole cop kicking a kid thing is a completely different story... and needs to be addressed individually.
kneepads........ seriously...... bunch of weenies out there.