New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

[alesserfate]

Hey fellow boat owners'

I've researched on the internet but I'm still not 100% sure on some things before my first boating experience.

It's my first ever boat so I need to be sure of some things before I can take it out for the first time.

I bought a Larson 1500 Sabre, its a 15 foot fiberglass hull with a steering wheel, throttle and a Mercury 650 65hp outboard.

The engine looks like the one in this picture:

It has an external fuel canister that plugs into the engine via a hose and a battery.

I've replaced the battery with one that works since that one was dead.

Here are a couple of questions I have:

1. Is it a 2-stroke or a 4-stroke engine ?

2. Is there oil in the engine I can change ?

3. What kind of fuel do I put into the tanks ? Do I have to premix motor oil into the fuel tanks like a lawnmover ? If so, what kind of oil and what ratio ?

4. I have paddles, life jackets, first aid kit, anchor, flag in the boat, is there anything else I need to bring with me on the boat onto the water ?

If somebody could give me some tips regarding these questions, help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[haulnazz15]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

You have a 2-stroke which means you most likely will need to just add 2-cylce outboard oil to the gas tank when you fill up. No oil to change. Fuel is normally okay for 87 octane, but you can run 91 if it makes a difference in performance. Pull up the US Coast Guard site and find the required items for safe boating. Flares are always a good investment, and a sound device like an air horn or whistle in case your horn doesn't work due to being on fire or shorted out.

 

[QC]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Welcome aboard lesserguy!! You have come to the right place and I bet you'll find that we're eager to share and usually pretty nice . . .

You might try poking around the Outboard and Mercury section below (Dive captain, dive, oooohgaaaah) for more info on the OB

The first thing that came to mind for me on your list was a spare prop (and tools to change it). Oh, throwable cushion (required).

 

[Capt'n Chris]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Check your local State boating laws for onboard requirements. Also, if you do not have a mechanic, look around your neighborhood for someone who has a Mercury outboard and strike up a conversation about his mechanic. Since your boat has a bit of age on it, the first thing I'd do would be to pull the boat over to the friendly mechanic that your new-found boating buddy told you about, and tell him your story...you're going to have to trust someone at this juncture. He'd be flattered and could most likely divert you from a disastrous boating experience or breakdown on the water. I'll bet the first thing he does is check the lube in your lower unit, the water pump and your trailer hubs. First time,or any time for that matter, a malfunction on the water is something you will never want to relive. You literally are stranded. Many of us have a million years of boating experience and could write books...and we don;t know it all either! Do all of this right and you will become a happy boater and fall in love with the sport.

Safe boating....
Captain Chris

OH!!! Coast Guard certification classes are a must and may even be a requirement where you are.

 

[Jeep Man]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Welcome to iboats forum. When you have a question, you will most likely get an answer, probably several answers. And, by the way, there are no dumb questions here, just dumb answers.
All I see missing after seeing other replies is a tow line. There are only two kinds of boaters, those that have broken down, and those that are going to. I will also advise you to take a safe boating course. Finally, update your info to include where you are and where you boat. Some of us may be your neighbor.

 

[MikDee]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

I don't think that motor is oil injection, but I could be wrong? look for a tank under the cover with oil in it, or where oil may go first. Chances are you need a 50 to 1 (premix) oil to gas ratio, although some early 2cycles needed a 25 to 1 ratio. It depends on the year of your motor? Also, you must check the gear oil level in the lower unit of that motor, on the lower part of the leg, there is an (upper level/vent screw), and at the bottom somewhere (a drain/then fill screw). The gear oil level should be up to the upper vent screw, and dripping out if you remove it, and it should look dark, not light! That would be trouble, it could be a water/oil mix! Finally if that motor hasn't been run in over a year, the rubber raw water pump impeller, is probably shot, dried out, & broken. It would need to be replaced right away. Good Luck, Mike

 

[JoLin]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

EDUCATION!

Boating is as fun as it gets, but you have a responsibility to yourself, your passengers and every other boater out there. Go to USPS.org, find your local Power Squadron chapter and take a safe boating course.

Stay safe- then have a great time!

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

50:1 mix should be fine.
Quicksilver gear lube for the lower unit oil change.
New washers for the drain and fill screws....about 80 cents at any Merc dealer..
That will get you started...

 

[alesserfate]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Thanks a lot for all the help. I will get on with checking the motor on Friday and making sure I have everything ready first. I will post pictures of the progress and ask in this thread if I have any more questions.

Everyone's contribution to this thread is greatly appreciated!

 

[doug glass]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

welcome i have found nothing but great people and very helpful advice--don't forget new plugs and fire extinguisher

 

[alesserfate]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

So here is some progress, I've taken pics but lent out my card reader so I can't upload pics till tomorrow..

1. I checked the oil in the lower unit and there wasn't any in it and a tiny bit of oily water, I tightened up the fill drain and vent plugs and lowered the lower unit into a bin of water overnight, and in the morning, when i pulled it back out and opened the drain plug, some water drained out, does this mean the oil/water seal on the prop output shaft from the lower unit is gone ?

2. So the motor wouldn't crank, the starter was just making a whining noise. Upon further investigation, the battery polarity was reversed (battery was hooked up backwards by previous owner). Once I switched the +/- terminals, the motor was able to crank over fine. Could the reverse polarity have damaged anything ? Perhaps that electric module in the motor ?

3. My mercury engine is an outboard 2-cycle/stroke 65hp engine. The boat is from 1972 but I am not sure if this engine is native to this boat. Anyway; I've read many threads on oil to fuel ratio mixtures and have come to conclusions that 20:1, 25:1, 50:1 fuelil mixtures are used. What is the right/safe one to run for my motor ? It seems to be a pretty old engine.

Any help is appreciated in advance, thanks! I'll try to get some pics up for tomorrow

 

[CaptOchs]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

So here is some progress, I've taken pics but lent out my card reader so I can't upload pics till tomorrow..

1. I checked the oil in the lower unit and there wasn't any in it and a tiny bit of oily water, I tightened up the fill drain and vent plugs and lowered the lower unit into a bin of water overnight, and in the morning, when i pulled it back out and opened the drain plug, some water drained out, does this mean the oil/water seal on the prop output shaft from the lower unit is gone ?

2. So the motor wouldn't crank, the starter was just making a whining noise. Upon further investigation, the battery polarity was reversed (battery was hooked up backwards by previous owner). Once I switched the +/- terminals, the motor was able to crank over fine. Could the reverse polarity have damaged anything ? Perhaps that electric module in the motor ?

3. My mercury engine is an outboard 2-cycle/stroke 65hp engine. The boat is from 1972 but I am not sure if this engine is native to this boat. Anyway; I've read many threads on oil to fuel ratio mixtures and have come to conclusions that 20:1, 25:1, 50:1 fuelil mixtures are used. What is the right/safe one to run for my motor ? It seems to be a pretty old engine.

Any help is appreciated in advance, thanks! I'll try to get some pics up for tomorrow

1) Put some oil in it and check it after a month of use. If the oil is very milky, you'll likely have to replace the lower seals. www.ishopmarine.com is a good site to order parts from. They have exploding parts view to help you do it yourself if you want to.
2) I doubt it. There is usually safety features to prevent damage.
3) I had a 1969 Merc 65 HP 4 cyl and I always used 50:1. Without the model number and knowing if it was a 3 cly or 4 cly it's hard to look up. It's better to have too much oil than too little.

Advice? What do you have for fuel tanks? My very first trip I didn't realize how quickly a 65 could suck gas. My buddy was driving and after checking on the fuel I told him to "head for shore." He shouted back "which shore?" and I quickly replied "the CLOSEST shore." About 30 seconds later we ran out of gas. We limped back to the shore on the trolling motor. LOL. The coast guard recommends the 1/3 rule. Plan 1/3 of a tank to get you where you're going, 1/3rd to get you back, and 1/3 for reserve. Another fuel suggestion is to invest in a decent fuel filter/water separator. Fuel is not what it was back in the 70's. Some older outboards are having trouble with Ethanol. Read: http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/westadvisor/10001/-1/10001/Gasoline-EthanolYourBoat.htm

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

"... is there anything else I need to bring with me on the boat onto the water ?" Yes, bring a friend who is an experienced boater.
Be sure your engine runs before you launch. start it on muffs or in a large tank. Mercuries, especially those old ones, are very cranky.
The engine looks like a 1972 vintage.
Get a fuel water seperator and never let your gas sit 45 days. Keep your tanks out of the sun when not in use. Tanks. That's 2 6-gallons. And I'd carry a one gallon for a reserve. On a boat that size I wouldn't get 2 batteries but I'd carry jumper cables, but that depends on whether you boat where there are others nearby.

 

[alesserfate]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Worked on the boat for a bit today. The floor underneath the carpet was rotten so I decided to gut the hull of the rotten wood. Once all the rotten wood is gone, I'm going to let the hull rest in the sun for a couple of days, than spray-on some resin, fill whatever gaps with foam (great stuff) and lay a new floorboard. When the new floor is in, I will truck-bedliner it so it doesn't absorb the moisture anymore.

Back to working on the motor while the hull dries. I compression tested her and she got a good 120psi on all 3 cylinders. Got some fresh gas and outboard oil, drained out the bad gas from the fuel line too. I cleaned up the distributor cap and rotor and checked all the grounds. The starter works and cranks over, the choke flapper works too. For some reason, there seems to be no spark. I checked the wires, spark plugs, and tried putting the spark plug leads in front of a ground and seeing if a spark would arc to it, but that didn't happen. I checked the voltage at the ignition coil with the key in the 'ignition' position, and got 0volts. Then I decided to check the continuity between the CONN and GRND terminals on the ignition coil and it read that there is continuity. That didn't make sense to me, so I took off the wires from the ignition coil and checked again, there is continuity through the terminals of the ignition coil, so does this mean my ignition coil is finished ?

Anyway, here is some pictures!

 

[CaptOchs]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Time to break out that multimeter and do some testing! It could also be the points.

http://assets.fluke.com/appnotes/electricalpower/B0271b_u.pdf

Also I wouldn't use Great Stuff. Use Marine flotation foam. It's resistant to gas and water absorption.

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=315560

 

[dwhite1031]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

...than spray-on some resin, fill whatever gaps with foam (great stuff) and lay a new floorboard.

Hey welcome aboard! This is a great place and the folks here are extremely helpful! Doesn't matter if you have a worn out 10 foot jon boat or shiney new cabin crusier, the comraderie is fantastic!​

Check the restoring and rebuild forums for tips on replacing the floor. You will want to check the stringers as well to be sure they aren't rotted out. If any of the existing foam is wet, then you'd be doing yourself a big favor by removing it while the floor is out. The foam used in those old boats was not closed cell and worked like a sponge. Believe me, I've been there, done that dance...... I had a 20 year old bass boat I was redoing that hadn't been on the water for 5 years. It had been covered and under a carport since and when I removed the old floor, the foam was still soaked with the lake water.....and smelled wonderful too.​

Great Stuff is great.....for your house but not for boats. You can buy a two part mixture of expanding foam but it can be tuff to work with and get the right amount where you want it. A lot of folks use the pink or blue foam sheets you can get at the big box stores like Home Depot or Lowes. You can cut it to fit and put it in the voids. It is closed cell and doesn't soak up water. That's why it's used in construction between the concrete walls of a basement and the earth fill. The link below is a great example of the use of the pink construction foam.​

http://picasaweb.google.com/pacerdude/EntireDeckReplacement89Celebrity224se#5305852018165355202​

You'll find a ton of info on the retoration forums. I learned a lot there especially about using poly and epoxy resins, do's and don'ts, and the right way to do things that saved a lot of re-doing later.​

 

[Home Cookin']

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

I don't know a whole lot about Mercury motors but after I got a 1972 Merc I did some reading and tinkering, and talked a lot with my mechanic. One thing I read is that Merc can have some funky ways about its electric systems and groundings, with switches working backwards as to ground/not ground. Also, a problem I has was older wiring arcing to the block esp. up under the flywheel, so if yours is old like mine, inspect the insulation. I ahd one issue that was just that but it acted 100% like a fuel problem.

 

[alesserfate]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

thanks for the tips on repairing the hull, I got some proper marine foam and once it dries a few more days I'll get at it

well.. spent the last 4 days trying to get the motor running...... and........... success!

there was no spark for three reasons:

1. spark plug wire terminals were loose
2. distributor rotor and cap was worn out, cleaned the rotor and cap terminals from carbon, and bent the cap terminals in towards the center a little bit to make it contact again
3. the ignition coil was dead, so i rigged up a nissan 240sx ignition coil (from the ka24e engine)

heres a pair of pics

before:


after:


next I have to get the main seal out from near the prop, i took the prop off and slid the round plate that the prop pushes up against off the shaft

now I have to take off the round ring with teeth along the inside, It looks like it threads in there but I can only get it to turn about 3/4 inch along the circumfurence, am i supposed to only turn it that much in order to pull out the part that holds the seal or am i supposed to get it to spin all the way out ?

heres a pic



=D

 

[P 0 P E Y E]

Re: New boat owner, some simple questions ? =]

Hold on....

Should take the gear case to your dealer to re seal

It takes a special tool to remove the bearing carrier.

There are shims and some pretty high tech stuff...

I would suggest doing some reading of your manual....Remove the lower unit bring it to the dealer....buy parts and rebuild the water pump your self. Buy the right multi purpose grease and coat all the bolts and shaft splines upper and lower.