Drive angle during trailer power up

[jmarty10]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

ABJ87 - I have in/out service with marina. Marina guy who own marina drops me in and lets me power up to get out. I'm not going to worry about ruining ramp if hes ok with it!

 

[QC]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

Depends on the ramp . . . For example the ramp at Lake Mead when the water is higher extends for a half mile under water to account for varying water levels. I could load at WOT and it would only hurt me and my boat I idle up with the trailer fairly deep just to get her to stick, and I only trim up to where I know she won't hit when I am in a parking lot. The skeg is not going to magically extend further down because I can't see it I then winch the rest of the way but from inside of my bow. Works awesome, but can't do that with a closed bow for sure.

Oh and a large boat, on a bunk trailer, is a biotch to winch up unless you have someone slowly backing the trailer deeper while you give hand signals. Pretty dangerous if you are standing on the ramp between truck and trailer . . .

 

[skargo]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I winch my old 21' Wellcraft Nova which is 4000 lbs plus loaded onto my bunk trailer with no problem.

 

[Billdc]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I am new to owning a boat this year. And I didn't know there was any other way to load a boat than power loading. Most of my boating was a at a small river with private ramps. Imagine my surprise the first time at the public ramp when it said "No Power Loading". I got the boat on the trailer, but it took awhile. Just Sunday I was at my buddies ramp loading solo, with 5 guys sitting 10 feet away telling me to gun it more to get all the way on the trailer. So now I know, and I'll try to behave.

 

[scoutabout]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I must admit I don't get the power loading. Hard on the boat, hard on the drive, hard on the ramp, more force on the trailer than necessary in my humble opinion.

I've been trailering for decades (OK, just two decades...) and I think I did a float on at idle (in neutral) once. The floating dock next to the ramp was gone at end of season plus I had a pretty good cross wind.

Generally, if the trailer is set deep enough the boat can be easily pulled on til it's just a few cranks the last bit to the stop.

I'm ready to be convinced otherwise, but so far, don't see it.

It's extreme, it's inelegant, and just plain flies in the face of graceful boat handling.

 

[Billdc]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

It's extreme, it's inelegant, and just plain flies in the face of graceful boat handling.

You probably missed the part where I said this is what I've seen for 15 years. And so far nothing about me and boating is elegant. I call it a good day when nobody gets hurt and I get the boat back on the trailer and back in the driveway. In that order.

 

[Gary H NC]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I watched a guy a few weeks ago at the ramp power load his pontoon with a 90 horse Merc..
His wife was driving the F-150 rear wheel drive and was spinning and not going up the ramp.
The guy in the boat yelled to her to floor it and he would push her up the ramp..
He had that Merc screaming at WOT! The truck caught traction and up the ramp they went. No winch strap hooked or anything! The toon was only about 2/3rds on the trailer...engine revving full speed and not in the water!
Then he blocked the ramp for 30 minutes while he tried to crank the boat all the way up..
I cut through the grass,backed the trailer in,untied from the dock and just pulled mine on by the rope.Hooked the winch and cranked the last 3 feet,hooked the safety chain and pulled out around him again.
All of 3 minutes....they just stared at me like i was crazy...

Some people need some major loading advice!

 

[QC]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I don't power load, I idle load. I guarantee you we are off the ramp faster than 99% of the people there, and 9x out of 10 I would call it elegant . . .

I don't usually admit this here, but here goes . . . I leave it in gear, idling while I crank the winch. There it is, said it. Done. I've broke a winch strap before and I didn't like it . . .

I guess there are those who only use lines, no power whatsoever, there are those who idle up and then shut off, there are those who idle up and then leave it in gear like I do (never seen it other than me), and then there are those who just sit there and power all of the way to the bow stop. The latter is probably what most refer to as Power Loading.

BTW, question for scoutabout. How is even extreme power loading hard on the drive? I guarantee the loads on the drive and transom are hardest when making a WOT run. All of that horsepower is still being developed and still being transferred to the transom and through the gear train, it just seems harsh because you aren't going anywhere. Anybody that exceeds 2000 RPM or so needs their head examined anyway. I keep waiting for somebody to punch his bow right through the back window of a Suburban or similar. Now, that would be cool!!! Definitely hard on the bunks. No question about that.

 

[skargo]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I have read a tip in a book that mentioned using a boat to help push the trailer/towrig up the ramp

I also read in another book QC's method, which doesn't sound anywhere near as scary as the first scenario.

 

[jsturkie]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

The people that I see power loading at the ramp are generally lazy people or fools that want to show what they have in HP while all eyes are on them.

Every ramp in this country needs to have "No Power Loading" signs. It really isn't hard to load with out powering. I get on a straight course and cut all power 20' out. This dosen't work with the coastal tides of SC so I have to adjust just a bit and stil don't have to power load.

 

[scoutabout]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

...I don't usually admit this here, but here goes . . . I leave it in gear, idling while I crank the winch. There it is, said it....

LOL, QC - ain't confession good for the soul?

Personally that gives me the willies, unless you have a very long kill switch lanyard in your hand. You just never know...

...
BTW, question for scoutabout. How is even extreme power loading hard on the drive? I guarantee the loads on the drive and transom are hardest when making a WOT run. All of that horsepower is still being developed and still being transferred to the transom and through the gear train, it just seems harsh because you aren't going anywhere. ...

Well, seems to me those who lift the drive then power on heavily are stressing mounting points and ujoint gear far more than a WOT run where the drive is trimmed properly. Plus, in open water case, the only resistence to the driveline is the weight of the boat, drag of water, and maybe some wind resistance and maybe the drag of the odd tube rider...Using 2000+ RPM to push your way up a solid surface that isn't directly in line with the direction of thrust is forcing the drive (and therefore the entire stern) downward against an immovable object. Sounds like stress to me...certainly to a far greater degree than out in the open pushing against water).

Finally, I humbly submit that the turbulence and muck stirred up along with the lack of forward direction is definitely detrimental to efficient engine and driveline cooling.

Now, at this point I need to admit I'm no engineer but I've watched it done and it jes don't seem like good sense.

(Actually we have a running joke at work..."There isn't a terminal gate in the world that sufficient application of thrust won't get the airplane into..."

I suppose that goes for the marine world as well...)

 

[QC]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

My loading system gives me the slight willies too, but still not as much as true power loading. My biggest concern is a sudden wake that floats me off the trailer. Imagine a ramp that gets tidal surge or a rogue wake. So the guy is power loading with a lot of throttle and the wake or surge is enough to float what was previously stuck to the bunks. Throttle is on (mine is at idle) in gear, boat floats for a second, and I think it is now stored in either the truck bed or the rear storage area of his SUV. Man, I want to see this someday as long as nobody gets hurt At idle I kinda think that the worst thing that can happen is my hull and the winch stand fall in love . . . Remember I am usually still in the boat, but in the bow, so I am probably not gonna get squished.

I agree, if you are trimmed too high, excessive throttle is always bad. But within the proper trim range I don't see a difference between on the bunks or open water as far as the drive is concerned. The engine develops horsepower, and if you are at WOT (in gear) that horsepower is being transferred ultimately to the transom whether the resistance is mass + air + water or whether it is the bunks . . . The power is still pushing directly on the transom to result in the movement. It's that old equal and opposite reaction thing.

I could easily be wrong, but that's my spin on the whole physics part of this. Out on the water, the resistance is less, so it goes faster, but the power is still being applied . . .

 

[CaptainKev]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I 100% agree with scoutabout. I do have a question that doesn't seem to been raised. Do the same people that power load also power unload?
I don't think I've ever witnessed somebody zooming off the trailer. Maybe I've led a sheltered life, though.
Kev.

 

[Billdc]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

Yes Kev, I was also taught to power unload. I back in until the fenders are just underwater, jump in and make sure it starts, then unhook the bow strap. Just a little nudge in reverse and it drops right in. Like I said this is my first boat and this is what I've seen for years. So bear with me as I learn the ropes.

 

[QC]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

How I unload:

The wife or son backs down the trailer until I am deep enough to start. You just need the water intake grates under water (I/O or OB). Then I motion to back down some more slowly (they can see me with this setup) and as soon as I feel her start to float I clench my fist. They know to hit the brakes firmly and she slides right off. I don't put her in gear until I am completely off. Then I wave at them so they know they can pull forward and park the rig. Dead simple for us. Can use little FRS radios for this too.

 

[ShaneCarroll]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I wouldn't necessarily call what I do "power" unloading, but I do use the engine to get off. I just put the boat in the slowest reverse speed, and back right off, I don't even think I break a grand on the tachometer. There are a number of reasons why I do it this way: the local ramp I use is very tiny, with space for only one boat on each side, so when there are already two boats on each side I just go out the channel and wait there, or sit in the water away from the traffic. Also, I can see while the boat is still on the trailer whether or not it is going to start and cooperate that day, so if not, just have the fiancee pull right out in stead of waiting in line again.

The ones that kill me the most are the pontooners that are scared to get the tires on the trailer wet, and wonder why in WOT reverse the boat won't come off the trailer. There is one guy that I have seen do this a number of times. We try to help, and the only response I get is "dumb kid thinks he knows better than me. ." Let me just say for the record, you cannot always base someone's intelligence due to their age. I may be 25, but I can drive a boat / car / truck / whatever better than most older people. I have quite a bit of common sense, though sometimes I don't use it. I guess some people just don't have it though. .

 

[Billdc]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

Just had to let you knowUnloading and loading without power today, and didn't even have to get wet. Learned something new today and hopefully that will be one less thing that I do to P*** people off.

 

[Rodneys]

Re: Drive angle during trailer power up

I seen a guy power load one day at my sisters campground. I was heading down to the ramp to yeal at him for doing so. Before I could get to the ramp he left. I tried chasing him on foot but couldn't catch him. On my way back to the ramp to see what kind of damage he did, a guy was backing in the water and he broke an axle on his trailer. YOU TALK ABOUT BEING MAD !!! If I ever see someone power loading, I give him H__L !!!