Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

erikpn

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Aug 23, 2009
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In a 20 year old car, I just put the key in, turn the key and hold it there, and it starts everytime warm or cold on.

On the 20 or so year old outboards I've seen, the guys trying to sell the boat to me brag about it starting on the 2nd crank. The key needs to be bumped just right with just the right amount of pressure, and if it doesn't start then the idle lever needs to be adjusted, etc. Is that normal, is there supposed to be a delicate and careful process of coaxing a motor to life? Or should it start up as easily and reliably as a car motor? I'm afraid of being left in the middle of a lake without being able to get back because I couldn't get the process just right.
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Depends on how well maintained the motor is, just like a car. Most outboard motors that are 20 years old have caburetors, 20 yr old cars (most) were injected. You are comparing apples to oranges. You are also comparing two completely different engines, 2 stroke vs 4. Have you ever tried starting a not so tuned weed wacker??? They are a nightmare to start. My weedeater came from the factory with non standard adjustable jets, needed a special screw driver to start adjusting it. The thing was a nightmare for 2 years to get running, would take 20 pulls to start, once it was running it would bog like crazy, never really ran right out of the box. I took the needles out with needlenose pliers and cut notches into them with a hacksaw so I could adjust them with a straight screwdriver. First pull it starts now and revs like a nascar engine. Moral of the story, most motors will start with the first second or third pull/crankover, they just need to be in great condition to do so. With the gas of today certain things can happen, read about ethanol poisoning. Carbs can be finicky as well, the ignition technology is completely different than a car, more similar to a modern lawnmower depending on the year. Newer motors are electronics nightmares if something goes wrong, plug in diagnostics and software. My 83 90 starts after 3 seconds, pump the bulb, lift the fast idle lever, push in the key and turn, but I maintain the crap out of it, same goes for my 9.9, my snowblower, weedwacker, lawnmower. If it doesn't start pretty much right away something is wrong and can usually be corrected with some advice time and research.
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Oh ya and car engines are very automated compared to marine engines, the old one's that is, there is just no comparing the two once you wrap your head around the two technologies, very similar yet very different.
 

jbjennings

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I think your question is a super good one! One that I wish I coudl have had answered many years ago. I think the best thing for you would be a simple explanation of how an "old" 2 stroke carbureted engine works and I'll attempt to explain it so you can crank it if it gets "finicky".

Here goes:

A 2 stroke outboard gets fuel into the cylinders by sucking it around the side of the crankcase. To get to the side of the crankcase, the fuel has to pass through a tiny hole in the carburetor. By passing through the tiny hole the fuel/oil becomes an aerosol (tiny droplets) just like spray paint does in a spray can. Old two strokes use a choke ( a plate that cuts off air from the carb throat into the crankcase) to force the motor to suck harder on the carb's tiny hole that the fuel comes out of because it can't get air from the carb throat anymore since it's "choked" off. This causes more fuel than normal to pass out of the carb and into the crankcase, richening the mixture with more fuel for it to get started off of the first time. Once the engine gets started you can usually let off the choke, however, the engine may like to have a little choke for a few seconds while it's still warming up. If it gets too much choke it will suck in too much fuel and load the cylinders up and kill the spark by getting the plugs wet with fuel. Fuel/oil is nonconductive and acts as an insulator, keeping the spark from jumping and therefore stalling the motor. So, if it dies while your choking it, then STOP choking it and turn the motor over OFF choke so the compression of the pistons coming up to the top of the cylinder will produce enough pressure to blow out the fuel from the cylinder and hopefully dry out the spark plugs a little.
One more thing-- the carb float bowl needs to be full of fuel, so pump the primer bulb on the hose to fill the float bowl. If the carb float and needle valve are working properly, you should feel the primer bulb get firm and STOP priming it. If you keep priming, you could overcome the float and put too much fuel in the carb, flooding the engine. Just be gentle.:)

SOme 2-stroke carbed motors have a primer on the carb which squirts fuel into the crankcase to richen the fuel/air mixture with fuel for intitial cold starts, rather than have a choke.
If you prime the engine after it's warmed up, it will flood the cylinders with too much fuel and kill it, just like overchoking an engine that has a choke.

So, for my OMC motors, I pump the primer bulb on the hose and choke the engine before initially turning it over with the starter. Once it cranks, I let off the choke and it should smooth out and run perfectly. If it falters, I rechoke and try again, listening/feeling to tell if it wants more choke, judging so by how smooth it's running. Once it's running smoothly I let off the choke. If it dies you need more choke. If you keep the choke on too long and it dies, turn the choke OFF to clear the cylinders of excess fuel and turn the starter on with the fast idle lever in the up position until it cranks up.

If you post what engine you're talking about, we could be a lot more specific as to the start-up procedure.
BTW, this is just my feeble understanding of the motor (I'm not a mechanic) so hopefully some of the real experts will fix any of my current misconceptions, fixing me at the same time as you.:redface:
Hope this helps,
JBJ
 

erikpn

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Aug 23, 2009
Messages
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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I think your question is a super good one! One that I wish I coudl have had answered many years ago. I think the best thing for you would be a simple explanation of how an "old" 2 stroke carbureted engine works and I'll attempt to explain it so you can crank it if it gets "finicky".

Here goes:

A 2 stroke outboard gets fuel into the cylinders by sucking it around the side of the crankcase. To get to the side of the crankcase, the fuel has to pass through a tiny hole in the carburetor. By passing through the tiny hole the fuel/oil becomes an aerosol (tiny droplets) just like spray paint does in a spray can. Old two strokes use a choke ( a plate that cuts off air from the carb throat into the crankcase) to force the motor to suck harder on the carb's tiny hole that the fuel comes out of because it can't get air from the carb throat anymore since it's "choked" off. This causes more fuel than normal to pass out of the carb and into the crankcase, richening the mixture with more fuel for it to get started off of the first time. Once the engine gets started you can usually let off the choke, however, the engine may like to have a little choke for a few seconds while it's still warming up. If it gets too much choke it will suck in too much fuel and load the cylinders up and kill the spark by getting the plugs wet with fuel. Fuel/oil is nonconductive and acts as an insulator, keeping the spark from jumping and therefore stalling the motor. So, if it dies while your choking it, then STOP choking it and turn the motor over OFF choke so the compression of the pistons coming up to the top of the cylinder will produce enough pressure to blow out the fuel from the cylinder and hopefully dry out the spark plugs a little.
One more thing-- the carb float bowl needs to be full of fuel, so pump the primer bulb on the hose to fill the float bowl. If the carb float and needle valve are working properly, you should feel the primer bulb get firm and STOP priming it. If you keep priming, you could overcome the float and put too much fuel in the carb, flooding the engine. Just be gentle.:)

SOme 2-stroke carbed motors have a primer on the carb which squirts fuel into the crankcase to richen the fuel/air mixture with fuel for intitial cold starts, rather than have a choke.
If you prime the engine after it's warmed up, it will flood the cylinders with too much fuel and kill it, just like overchoking an engine that has a choke.

So, for my OMC motors, I pump the primer bulb on the hose and choke the engine before initially turning it over with the starter. Once it cranks, I let off the choke and it should smooth out and run perfectly. If it falters, I rechoke and try again, listening/feeling to tell if it wants more choke, judging so by how smooth it's running. Once it's running smoothly I let off the choke. If it dies you need more choke. If you keep the choke on too long and it dies, turn the choke OFF to clear the cylinders of excess fuel and turn the starter on with the fast idle lever in the up position until it cranks up.

If you post what engine you're talking about, we could be a lot more specific as to the start-up procedure.
BTW, this is just my feeble understanding of the motor (I'm not a mechanic) so hopefully some of the real experts will fix any of my current misconceptions, fixing me at the same time as you.:redface:
Hope this helps,
JBJ

Wow, thanks a lot. Do 4 stroke outboards start as easily as a car motor? Is the lever the choke? I just notice it makes the engine run at a higher rpm.

If they are all so finicky, do you guys feel safe going out into the ocean on a two stroke?
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

4 strokes, don't know never owned one. I know they are way more maintenance , timing belts and valves and oil changes and all that good stuff. The warm up lever advances the spark timing for cold start. I'd only feel safe going out in the ocean with a dual engine setup of equal size or a aux kicker motor sized for the boat.
 

jbjennings

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Messages
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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Like BK, I wouldn't go out in the ocean without a dual engine setup. That said, I would trust dual '57 35hp motors as well as modern motors if not more, if the '57 motors were gone through and well maintained.
If I didn't trust myself to start my motors reliably, I indeed would stay out of the big water. Sudden storms could be a booger if your motors wouldn't start. I regularly travel 2-3 miles from the launch with my '50s OMC outboards and even with my '73 mercury 65hp motor without being too nervous, but would NOT do it in the ocean without a pair of motors with separate fuel/ignition systems.
The 4 stroke outboards that are fuel injected should be as easy as a car to start since the computer would control the mixture, but like BK, I have no first-hand knowledge of them.
Later,
JBJ
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Plus 2 strokes just sound better and have way more torque, what's a boat without a good holeshot? 4 strokes are cleaner but slower, go e-tec if you are buying new.
 

jonesg

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

My 150hp 6 cylinder starts on the first try, but its in good tune and I've learned the idiosyncracy to starting 2 bangers.

My 1959 10hp starts on the 2nd pull after a couple of choking pull throughs.

Theres a sticky file at the top of this forum that describes good starting techniques for outboards. If the engine is properly set up you'll find they will start as promised.
 

McGR

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Jun 19, 2004
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664
Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Virtually all cars have been fuel injected for the past 20+ years. Because of the fuel injection and electronic engine control, modern cars are usually very easy to start. This wasn't always the case with the older carbureted cars.

Only fairly rectently have outboards started using similar technology. Virtually all of the older motors you will encounter will have carburators. These older designs are somewhat inherantly more difficult to start. Of the numerous 2 cycle motors I've owned, most had certain idiosyncies when it came to starting. Often you have to get to "know" the motor in order to sucussfully cold start it. Usually its a case of knowing how much choke or priming and throttle position a particular motor preferred.

So, yes, sometimes older motors can be a little tricky to start. It doesn't necessarily mean that there is anything wrong with them.
 

WIMUSKY

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I have a 4 stroke Johnson 60hp. I just squeeze the primer bulb until hard and barely touch the key and it fires right up. No warm up lever. Basically, a car motor. Change the oil once a year. Never have to add injector oil. No VRO issues. Very reliable with the fuel injection. Little maintenance and quiet, quiet, quiet...
 

puddleboater

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

4 strokes, don't know never owned one. I know they are way more maintenance , timing belts and valves and oil changes and all that good stuff. The warm up lever advances the spark timing for cold start. I'd only feel safe going out in the ocean with a dual engine setup of equal size or a aux kicker motor sized for the boat.

I almost exclusively fish saltwater and generally agree with the above statement, where having a dual engine set-up or main OB and aux motor set-up is a must in going offshore. In reality, however, there are plenty of boaters that head offshore with just a single motor, myself included :D. I've done it with brand new and used motors. One old outboard I used sixteen years ago was a 1959 35 hp Johnson.

As far as the main question on whether an outboard needs to be coaxed, well..........my current motor, which is a 1960s Chrysler 35 HP, is turn-key and fires right on the first click. However, I had a 1996 150 HP Merc Black Max Offshore that I bought brand-new. Since day one, that Merc was a PITA to start. I tried different methods and none mattered: it was typically five to seven minutes to get that motor fired up. Once running, though, there was no stopping her. That machine was as bullet-proof as anything I've seen and it ran beautifully even when I sold her and my 20 footer last year :(.
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Quelle Surprise , a hard to start merc, 7 minutes is quick, I watched a guy try for 1/2 hour once LOL.
 

jeff_smith_0423

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

Quelle Surprise , a hard to start merc, 7 minutes is quick, I watched a guy try for 1/2 hour once LOL.

It never fails. On my local river I can always spot at least one person wearing out their cranking battery trying to get a 2 stroke Merc started. I watched one guy completely wear a battery out one morning. He then walked up to his house and got another battery!! I could see from my fishing spot that he wasn't giving it any throttle advance or choke. How can people be this ignorant? I've never had this problem with the Merc's I've owned unless there was something majorly wrong. Our family's Classic 50 that is kept in northern Wisconsin can be started in 5 seconds from cold.
 

rjezuit

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

My 1956 Evinrude Fastwin starts with 2 pulls cold and one pull warm, almost always. Started with 2 pulls in the spring after being laid up all winter. Rick
 

puddleboater

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

It never fails. On my local river I can always spot at least one person wearing out their cranking battery trying to get a 2 stroke Merc started. I watched one guy completely wear a battery out one morning. He then walked up to his house and got another battery!! I could see from my fishing spot that he wasn't giving it any throttle advance or choke. How can people be this ignorant? I've never had this problem with the Merc's I've owned unless there was something majorly wrong. Our family's Classic 50 that is kept in northern Wisconsin can be started in 5 seconds from cold.

LOL!!!

Yep, plenty of times I'd be doing my routine and often wondered, "am I doing something wrong or is it just Mercs that do this?". Then, out of nowwhere, some old salt would show up with a 1960s or 1970s Merc, dump his boat into the water, and on the first click, his motor fires away!

I'd just be sitting and saying to myself, "WTF?!" :confused: :D

Alas, I've had Johnsons, Force, Evinrudes, and now a Chrysler, all of them started easily. In spite of all the cold-start headaches that Merc gave me, she always came through and brought us back from a lot of trips from many miles offshore, some in quite hazardous conditions!
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I don't know if i'd trust a merc on my boat trying to escape a tornado, boat and motor would probably be in the funnel when it fired up :)
 

jeff_smith_0423

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I've also seen a minor phenomenon with the most recent 50hp carbed 2 strokes that Mercury is selling off - mostly on Tracker boats and Lowe Fishing machines. Haven't seen a guy yet at the ramp who can have his buddy dump him in and have the motor started before the current or wind gets ahead of him. I really think it's an education issue!
 

bktheking

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Re: Dumb newb question? Are outboards supposed to be tricky to start?

I always say if it's a merc and it starts first try chances are it's got an OMC powerhead under the cowl. LOL
 
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