Charging Batteries with a generator

[HAV2FISH]

Has anyone ever used a portable gas generator to recharge there Trolling battery and there cranking battery? I have a three bank charger and i don't want to burn it up.

 

[cpubud]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

I use my honda generator to run my onboard charger all the time.

 

[mike343]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

As long as the portable puts out a good 115v/60Hz and that's what the charger requires you will be OK. Just like plugging into a receptacle at the house.

You need to make sure there is an "earth" ground some where in the system. If the boat is sitting on the trailer and there is no generator ground the whole mess could float and cause a shock hazard.

 

[slasmith1]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

I have a Kohler 5e and use it all the time at anchor for ac power and to run my charger to keep batteries going for things that are dc only

 

[HAV2FISH]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

You need to make sure there is an "earth" ground some where in the system. If the boat is sitting on the trailer and there is no generator ground the whole mess could float and cause a shock hazard.


We are going to be primitive camping for a week. Once we launch the boats they will stay in the water the entire time. How would i ground the generator? The generator will stay on shore the entire time but its on wheels and rubber stands.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

with a steel stake or fence post and jumper cables

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

A proper earthing stake is a copper rod.

 

[The Great Escape II]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

You don't need an "earth" ground using a generator to power a battery charger on a boat. Plug it in and turn it on. I use a Honda EU2000 to run my A/C, charger and other 120v accessories on my boat all the time.

 

[HAV2FISH]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

Ok, I'm having what i call a brain fart. Do i ground at the frame of the generator or do i have to ground at the motor? The way I'm picturing this in my mine is putting one end of the jumper cables on the frame of the generator and the other end on the copper rod stuck in the ground.

 

[rbh]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

Grounding a genny is a great question, I would believe that if the generator is hard mounted in the boat, you would tie the grounding point to a neutral bus somewhere, therefore all the AC circuits are bonded back to the generator.
but the stand alone generator thats sitting on the boat or beach, with just a cord plugged in and doesnt have a earth ground, will not be as effective if theres a power bump?
silvertip?

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

You ground the generator head as that's what is producing the power. Generators have a ground lug somewhere on the housing for attachment of a ground cable going to the ground rod. If you go to the "Electrical" section of this forum I just provided a little history about why and when the third contact was added to our standard house receptacles. In a nut shell it was because plugs and receptacles weren't polarized meaning you could insert the appiance plug either way. Well, appliances in the good old days (TVs and radios for example) had the device ground tied to the chassis. There was no issue if the plug was inserted so the hot side was on the hot side of the outlet. If you turned it around, the device would still work but the hot side was now on the chassis. If you happened to have one foot in the bath tub and then touched metal on the applicance your next trip was a visit with the undertaker. With no earth connection, any device malfunction that puts AC on the generator housing creates an electrocution issue. Use a ground rod if you value your life. Modify an extension cord for this purpose. Cut the plug and receptacle off. Tie all three wires together on each end and attach good quality alligator clips to each end. An orange cord works well as it is very visible and you stand less chance of tripping over it. And just so you know, using the metal outside faucet as a ground is not a good idea unless you are positive your house is plumbed all the way to the street with copper. Any plastic in the route kills the ground.

 

[rbh]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

You ground the generator head as that's what is producing the power. Generators have a ground lug somewhere on the housing for attachment of a ground cable going to the ground rod. If you go to the "Electrical" section of this forum I just provided a little history about why and when the third contact was added to our standard house receptacles. In a nut shell it was because plugs and receptacles weren't polarized meaning you could insert the appiance plug either way. Well, appliances in the good old days (TVs and radios for example) had the device ground tied to the chassis. There was no issue if the plug was inserted so the hot side was on the hot side of the outlet. If you turned it around, the device would still work but the hot side was now on the chassis. If you happened to have one foot in the bath tub and then touched metal on the applicance your next trip was a visit with the undertaker. With no earth connection, any device malfunction that puts AC on the generator housing creates an electrocution issue. Use a ground rod if you value your life. Modify an extension cord for this purpose. Cut the plug and receptacle off. Tie all three wires together on each end and attach good quality alligator clips to each end. An orange cord works well as it is very visible and you stand less chance of tripping over it. And just so you know, using the metal outside faucet as a ground is not a good idea unless you are positive your house is plumbed all the way to the street with copper. Any plastic in the route kills the ground.

Thanks for your input on this, I would like to know alittle more about the GFI plugs on the boat and their relationship to the chassis ground on the genset as well as the breakers.
rob

 

[wa_ssv197]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

If using a portable generator like the EU2000 you don't need a ground. We use a Honda 3500 for our RV and there is no ground. Been around this type of generator for 10+ years and never connected a ground to it with no problems.

 

[smokeonthewater]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

you don't "need" a ground with any generator but it is a good idea
you don't need a seat belt to drrive a car or a life jacket in a boat BUT when the car is wrecked or the boat sinks or when something goes wrong with the genny or appliance or cord YOU NEED ALL OF THE ABOVE
Also he is absolutely right a copper rod is better than steel.... we use the steel though as it is easier to get, more durable for repeated use, and works very well for temporary use..... for long term use it would not be nearly as good as it would rust away..... also do not paint it and if it already is strip at least the last foot before use I use a 5 foot sharpened rod with a step 2 feet from the bottom.... I also have a 6" circle welded to the top and painted orange to prevent impailing accidents

 

[jaxnjil]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

woudnt driving a copper grounding rod into your boat hull result in a leak where it comes out the bottom of the hull?

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

I ran my house on a Porter Cable generator for several weeks after Hurricane Katrina. I did ground it and always ground a generator when I can.

I also recharged batteries every day with it and had no problems. One thing that people don't realize, is that the power that you get from "the pole," isn't as "clean" as you think it is. On top of that, any circuit that you have in your house that has something like a large air conditioner or freezer compressor on it, can cause "drops and spikes."

If you have a decent quality generator that runs at the proper rpm and maintains that consistently, you should be getting pretty decent power. If you have a Honda generator, or any other generator with electronic control, you should be gettiing a "pure sine wave" and its probably as good or better than what you get from a circuit in your house, anyway.

One recomendation that I make for both generator use and in home use, is an Acoustic Research power strip. I don't work for them or sell them, so this isn't spam in disguise. The reason why I make the recommedation is because I use a model that they make, that is rated at 5,100 joules. To put that in perspective, the average power strip with surge suppresion is rated at about 600 to 800 joules. One of my ARs once saved about $1,500 worth of computer monitors and other gear, when my house was hit by lightening. I ended up wishing that the actual computer was running through it too!



???

 

[mike343]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

You need to make sure there is an "earth" ground some where in the system. If the boat is sitting on the trailer and there is no generator ground the whole mess could float and cause a shock hazard.


We are going to be primitive camping for a week. Once we launch the boats they will stay in the water the entire time. How would i ground the generator? The generator will stay on shore the entire time but its on wheels and rubber stands.

The boat surely has some kind of ground plate under the hull and that's probably enough. But I'd put some kind of a metal stake and attach it to the generator frame. Any UL approved genny should have the frame attached to the ground (green) wire from the gen in the three wire cable. The charger case should also be connected to the same wire, so it also is at ground (earth) potential.

A GFI is probably a good idea,. What it protects against is a fault from the ac hi side (black) inside the charger to the charger case. The not so low impedance of our stake ground or the fresh water ground might not be enough to pop the gen breaker But a GFI would disconnect it.

 

[rbh]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

The boat surely has some kind of ground plate under the hull and that's probably enough. But I'd put some kind of a metal stake and attach it to the generator frame. Any UL approved genny should have the frame attached to the ground (green) wire from the gen in the three wire cable. The charger case should also be connected to the same wire, so it also is at ground (earth) potential.

A GFI is probably a good idea,. What it protects against is a fault from the ac hi side (black) inside the charger to the charger case. The not so low impedance of our stake ground or the fresh water ground might not be enough to pop the gen breaker But a GFI would disconnect it.

Thanks bud, just wanted to know how this affected the GFI plugs

 

[Silvertip]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

There is a ground lug on a generator and most newer generators are also GFI protected. However a GFI operates with the hot, neutral and ground connections associated with the generator itself. Without an earth connection the GFI will not see a potential difference between the case ground and earth ground. The ground lug is there for a reason and it is intended to be used. As several folks have pointed out, they have used their generators without an earth connection with no problem. Most folks survived trips in their cars before seat belts were mandated but many did not before and AFTER they were mandated. Because you got by does not mean it is 100% safe. Your boat also operates just fine without the kill switch lanyard connected to your person. But it may save your life or the life of someone else some day if you do. It's all about "chance".

 

[HAV2FISH]

Re: Charging Batteries with a generator

Thanks everybody for all the replies. I'm learning allot i didn't know about the use of a generator. I will defiantly be grounding the generator. My next question is how deep do i have to sink a grounding rod into the ground to be safe?