60 Something Wire Colors

[Reifwj]

Ok, I have been lurking for 24hrs now. I have an old Silverline Riviera I picked up for 200. I'm not sure about the year. It has the markings of a 60-63, but they didn't building the Riviera until 64. I need help with wiring because the ignition is missing. I have done a search on google for color codes and they don't match my wire colors. I'm hoping someone on here knows what colors are for what function. Here we go:

Black
Black/White
Tan (or small brown)
Green (fat wire)
Brown (fat wire)
Grey
White
Red/White

If I connect teh battery and touch the white and green the motor turns over, but it doesn't start. I know I'm missing the ignition wire. Some websites say purple (notice it's not the list...LOL) and another said red...still not there yet! Someone help. THANKS

 

[oops!]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

hi.....welcome to i boats !.

congratulations on the boat.
but those wire colors are .....well.....not the colors im used to.

but we have guys here that can help.

im going to call a moderator and sak that they move this post over to the electronics forum...the guys there will be more help to you than us fiberglass guys

cheers
oops

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Ok, thanks. I just didn't know if the wire colors changed by years and figured someone here that focuses on older boats might have some info. if all else fails, I will have to take pictures of the wiring box on the transom and get some help to figure out what wires need what colors.

 

[oops!]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

what type of motor is it?
that will help the guys lots...


im a i/o guy so i know a bit of the wiring in the mercrusier. but the wires are very different from those.......

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Greetings. Welcome to iboats. I will move this to the electronics area.

A few points that may help.......

First you boat "may" have been wired with what was available at the time or it is even possible it has been rewired.

I do not envy your task at hand but you may be starting to do things all over one wire at a time and the color scheme this time will be your own.

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

It has a 64, Johnson Super Seahorse 40. I know how to run wires, I used to work on aircraft for the Air Force. Never having worked a boat electrical makes me question myself. I have pictures of the what I'm going to call a relay box for now. Please forgive my poor vocabulary. I know in the marine world everything has a different name and I'm working on it. lol It is mounted on the transom under the box thing (you thought I was joking) that the fuel tanks sit in. It has a negative which is the left side, and the positive that runs in the right side. On the left side, there is a bundle of wires the run to the O/B. The wires are in decent shape. I won't even re-wire the boat if I can figure this out. There are no splices in the wire and it is run in a factory bundle. I'm guessing teh red/white wire is the ignition or constant power cause when I touched it to the positive on the battery it heard the relay click on the relay box. I figures once I get the constant hot wire figured out and the accesory on wire I should be able to figure the other stuff out. If I touch the wrong wires together, what could I burn out.

 

[F_R]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

It has a 64, Johnson Super Seahorse 40. I know how to run wires, I used to work on aircraft for the Air Force. Never having worked a boat electrical makes me question myself. I have pictures of the what I'm going to call a relay box for now. Please forgive my poor vocabulary. I know in the marine world everything has a different name and I'm working on it. lol It is mounted on the transom under the box thing (you thought I was joking) that the fuel tanks sit in. It has a negative which is the left side, and the positive that runs in the right side. On the left side, there is a bundle of wires the run to the O/B. The wires are in decent shape. I won't even re-wire the boat if I can figure this out. There are no splices in the wire and it is run in a factory bundle. I'm guessing teh red/white wire is the ignition or constant power cause when I touched it to the positive on the battery it heard the relay click on the relay box. I figures once I get the constant hot wire figured out and the accesory on wire I should be able to figure the other stuff out. If I touch the wrong wires together, what could I burn out.

Sheesh,
Does your motor have a generator kit installed? If not, then:

Black= kill wire. goes to either one of the M terminals on key switch (one of them may be marked G)
Black/White= the other kill wire. goes to the other M (or G) terminal
Tan (or small brown) Hot light sender wire goes to hot light.
Green (fat wire)= "hot" wire. goes to B (bat) terminal on key switch
Brown (fat wire)= only used if it has a generator kit. Otherwise, unused
Grey= tachometer ground. Unused unless you have the rare tachometer
White= start wire goes to S terminal on key switch. Also gets a jumper to the choke override switch
Red/White= electric choke wire. goes to choke switch.

Unmentioned: a wire goes from the hot light to the A (acc) terminal on the key switch.

The '64 models originally had an electric choke that was actuated every time the motor was started, hot or cold. The choke N.C. override switch was used to override the choke function for hot starting. Many/most of them got converted to a N.O. switch used on the '65-up motors. After the conversion, the choke switch was a choke switch---only choked it if you wanted to and operated the switch.

Note: if you don't have two M terminals or an M and a G, you have the wrong kind of key switch.

Hope this gets you going.

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Sheesh, what? I said I'm new. How do I tell if it has a genartor kit or not. Based on the ignition that is just dangeling in there now, it looks like I need to find a 3 postition 5 post ignition. Will any ignition in this set up work or is there somethign special to these older ones to consider? thank for they help. That's awesome info.

 

[F_R]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

No, sheesh that nobody knew the answer.

If you have a generator, it is a belt driven unit looking similar to a starter, but on the opposite side of the carburetor.

The key switch is different than a conventional automotive type batttery ignition system. The one you need connects the two M terminals together in the "off" position to kill the motor. As I suggested, one of the M terminals may be marked G. That is simlpy to make it compatable with newer motors. Yep, generally 3 position, 5 terminals.

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

One last question for now anyway. What wire and post runs the accesories like the horn, lights and soon to be added radio. If it doesn't have a generator, will it still charge the battery?

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

none of them, only motor functions connect to those wires. you have to run a separate fused pos and neg wire from battery, to use accessories. no generator, no charge. charge at home, before and after every use.

 

[F_R]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

It is not good practice to run the lights and accessories from the motor wiring. Run separate + & - wires to a fused junction block, then connect your accessories to that. An exception might be something like a fuel gauge or hour meter that you want to go off when you turn the key off. In that case, use the Acc terminal to feed it. But do NOT ground it through the kill wires!!! Use the separate ground wire that you ran.

EDIT: No, if it does not have a generator, it won't re-charge the battery.

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Thanks, that explains the wires that have been chopped off and were just running down the side. So the lights are run off of a simple circuit with a fuze block and toggle switches. It currently doesn't have a fuze block so I'm guessing they ran them without fuzes originally. I guess I'm taking two batteries if I want a radio. Thanks a ton everyone. I can see it in my head now and that's what's hard being new to real boats. Now to find a switch.

My fix to not having a generator is putting a 7 pin plug on the boat so it will charge off the truck on the way to the lake. Extra connection from the trailer to boat, however, will work if I forget to charge the boat or I'm on a week long trip.

 

[tootallofwa]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

I guess I'm taking two batteries if I want a radio.

Not really necessary... The battery is only used when cranking the engine during the day. After dark you need lights. Radios don't draw much juice.

spares are good though...

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Thanks everyone. I have an ingnition installed and it looks like the only wires i need hooked up to start the motor is the green, white and two blacks. I have spark, I have new fuel, but no start. What else is missing on the motor, and please start from the simplest thing I might be missing. Thanks again.

 

[Willyclay]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

I do better with pictures so maybe the link below will help you. NOTE: It is for 58-61 model but it might answer your question. It would be better if someone else could link you to the correct wiring diagram for your 1964 model. Good luck with that great old motor!

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s311/frankr_photos/Wiring1958_6135_40hpwithoutgenerato.jpg

 

[F_R]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Thanks everyone. I have an ingnition installed and it looks like the only wires i need hooked up to start the motor is the green, white and two blacks. I have spark, I have new fuel, but no start. What else is missing on the motor, and please start from the simplest thing I might be missing. Thanks again.

How about the choke?? It won't start if not choked.

 

[tootallofwa]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

Thanks everyone. I have an ingnition installed and it looks like the only wires i need hooked up to start the motor is the green, white and two blacks. I have spark, I have new fuel, but no start. What else is missing on the motor, and please start from the simplest thing I might be missing. Thanks again.

The two black wires kill the ignition if grounded or connected together. They connect on the coil side of each of the points, and short together in the off position at the ignition switch.

So eliminate them as a problem by disconnecting them on the engine. One is hooked to the center post of the cut out switch, take it off and wrap it so it doesn't ground. (I slipped a piece of hose over mine.) The other has a "knife connection", it is routed under the starter. Slip the covering sleeve off, disconnect and isolate/insulate it too. (mind you will have no kill switch.)

Make sure the vacuum line to the cut out switch is good. (you don't need any vacuum leaks.) It connects to the intake manifold so that if the engine overruns (lost prop etc.) causing high vacuum making the switch connect the center post to the switch housing internally and grounding the one black wire through the the white wire that should be connected to the fourth terminal on the starter solenoid.

The second white wire connected at the cut out switch housing goes to a safety switch under the flywheel that is open at idle and closed at high throttle by a cam on the stator plate. This switch stops the starter from cranking if the throttle is too far opened. (preventing overrun also.)

There is the brown wire that connects to a temperature sensor in the head that makes ground when hot. It connects to a dash mounted light that gets power from the ignition switch. I don't know what the terminal is labeled but it's the only one that gets power in the run position.

There should not be an electric choke on this model engine. It should be water heated. (don't get the hoses mixed up or you'll have water in your engine) sorry this is 63' specific
​

You do not need any wires to start this motor if you have the rope starter installed. But the electric start is so much easier.

If you still can't start it... you either have low compression, bad spark, clogged carburetor or bad butterfly valves. (Mine had low compression due to the wrong spark plugs with too much reach, breaking on the piston top, scoring the cylinder and damaging the piston.) I didn't do it.

These engines are so basic, they want to run. It's getting power out of them that can be tricky.

Buy a book. search this forum. I had to re-learn everything I thought I knew.
That was two weeks ago.

Let me know how you do... My new project is 62' 28hp Johnson. It's nearly Identical to the 63' 40hp Evinrude with the bad piston. This one runs... Kind of...:redface:

 

[F_R]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

He said he has a 1964. They certainly do have a choke solenoid. Along with a hot air heated warmup choke. The troublesome water heated choke is gone.

 

[Reifwj]

Re: 60 Something Wire Colors

It's running now. I have a book coming in the mail. I think it was the choke. I have a posting asking what I did. After thinking about it, I think the choke has a manual lever side on the port side. The electrical solinoid is on the starboard side.