1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

can I get exterior plywood from homedepot? I went and looked there today only found 23/32 and some birch plywood that was it....

what else would I need to complete this task???

Yup, any of the big box stores will have exterior grade ply.

Pop on over to the restoration page and you can do some major reading there about the process. I don't think there in ONE WAY to make it happen, but a general path I suppose.

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

When I build the transom can I use home depot 3/4 plywood glue it together and use fiberglass to make it sealed??

I know glass resists water. Will that work?

or do I need to do anything else?

oh and where can I find this stuff called Gluvit. so I can get it ordered.

Right here on iboats you can find Gluvit. I got mine at JMS Marine for a pretty good deal.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Just for clarification......the new kind of pressure treated wood they started making a few years ago eats aluminum. That's why you don't want it anywhere in your boat.

 

[starcrafter65]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Chiming in: I am personally not for the exterior ply + Glass method...why not just buy marine plywood? I bought 1/2" sheets for 50 bucks apiece - probably take 2 sheets for the 16'. If you buy exterior ply+glass probably spend close to that plus you have to glass the sheets. By using marine - plus treating it with a waterproofer just for an extra boost - you know you will never have a problem. My PO glassed the floor but was skimpy on some spots and on the edges - and you will drill through it compromising the glass ...sooner or later the water will get there....my ..$.02....a couple of calls around and I am sure you can find it.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

I gotta disagree sc65. Marine ply is no more resistant to rot than exterior grade (well maybe a little bit). Don't get me wrong, it's definitely a nicer product but you still need to seal it the same as you would regular exterior grade

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

I gotta disagree sc65. Marine ply is no more resistant to rot than exterior grade (well maybe a little bit). Don't get me wrong, it's definitely a nicer product but you still need to seal it the same as you would regular exterior grade

Ditto

 

[starcrafter65]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

From the experts:

Exterior grade plywood is made with water-resistant glue, but the exterior shell is the only layer that is made void-free. There may be gaps, voids and the resulting points of weakness in the interior layers. When you cut a sheet of exterior grade plywood, you may expose a gap on the cut surface.

Marine grade plywood, on the other hand, is a different creature. Marine grade plywood is assembled gap and void-free in all layers, and laminated together with special, water-proof glue that holds the various layers together. When immersed, water has absolutely no effect on the glue or the strength of the lamination of marine grade plywood. Marine grade plywood will not commonly delaminate, bubble, buckle, or warp. Upon cutting marine grade plywood, no voids will be discovered on the cut edges. It is also usually constructed of harder woods such as Douglas Fir, or Western Larch.
Marine grade is a superior grade of plywood, and a substantially better product.
Do choose carefully when selecting plywood for marine use. Although it is more expensive, marine-grade plywood, when finished appropriately, will outlast pressure-treated plywood by far. The ordinary glues used in plywood , pressure-treated or not, will eventually fail for structural reasons.

When the transom on your boat fails in the middle of the lake, the wisdom of having saved fifty dollars by buying cheaper pressure-treated plywood instead of marine grade will come to question rather quickly. In this application, and other critical structural applications, let us suggest that "the RIGHT wood IS good", and marine grade is best.

Now you know the difference between marine grade and pressure treated plywood.


That last line was by the author not me! My father in law restored many wooden boats in his day....

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Marine grade is no doubt great stuff.

It's even better when it is properly sealed up with epoxy resin (plus or minus glass)!

If yur doing it, why not do it right the first time?

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Clark I most definitely agree that marine grade is a far superior product. It's probably also worth the money. However what you seem to be implying is that marine grade treated with a waterproofer (I don't know if you mean Thompson's or something like that) would be as protected (or better) from rot than exterior ply sealed with fiberglass. I strongly disagree with that.

I will say that the exterior grade I used for my deck was pretty much crap and had tons of voids. The Arauco ply I used for my transom from Lowe's was VERY nice and was virtually void free. I have heard that the Arauco may be made from a softer wood though. In my opinion though, I'd rather have the void free so the trade off is worth it to me.

 

[starcrafter65]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Whelp - I forgot to add what my father-in-law said (as he watches me) "It's a boat right?" He did $20,000-30,000 wood restos so he is coming from that direction

My personal take on it is this - the difference - at the end of the day is less than 60 bucks - I spend - what 200 hours doing a boat, i'll probably put in 3000 bucks into it (barring mechinal issues) - what is another 60 bucks? Heck - I got two emblems from NB for 75 bucks!....

Alternately - you guys probably think I am crazy because I didn't put foam in...I wanted the underfloor space in the middle for water ski storage - did a little calculations and figured that the foam on the sides might float the hull in the case of complete sinking. Plus - even extruded will sooner or later hold some water and I just wanted as much drying as possible under the floor..

But.....if you are going economical as possible - which is one of the great benefits of working on these boats...they have both proven to work - and we all get to be our own decision maker!

 

[Daltonxj]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

I agree but closes place to me that sells Marine plywood is almost 500 miles away. thats another reason I was asking about whats the best plywood to use plus sealer plus glass. if it only cost me an extra $60 more I would go for it but it would cost extra $60 + 500 mile 1000 mile trip just to get it here...

so you see my delima..

thats for all the info...

picked up the JB Weld for the holes on the side.. getting ready to goto fasenall for some rivets to fix the knee brace back and a few other thing.. also makeing a swing by a boat shop to see what they have instock there...

man I starting to love this boat...

 

[Daltonxj]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

I'm curious I was just reading about Gluvit could I use that on my transom plywood the glass it to seal it???

Gluvit is a paintable waterproof epoxy sealer that seeks, fills, and seals cracks in wood, fiberglass, and metal.


if so how much would it take to do my inside hull?
and would there be enough left over to do the transome area as well?? hmmmm.....

 

[ezmobee]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

I wouldn't. Not cost effective. Buy the small can of Gluvit and hit all your interior rivets and seams with it. Buy a half gallon or a gallon of epoxy to seal your transom.

 

[Daltonxj]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

thanks for the info.. will stick to just doing the rivets and seams with the gluvit!

I wouldn't. Not cost effective. Buy the small can of Gluvit and hit all your interior rivets and seams with it. Buy a half gallon or a gallon of epoxy to seal your transom.

as in epoxy what type you mean? brand,ect.. ect.. need help on this part never used epoxies before...

 

[Daltonxj]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

WoooHooo!! Gluvit ordered it will be in saterday morning!



Went to Holiday Marine today. mans name was Walt Johnson(notice the to in blue. type of boat i own and OB).He used to sell and repair starcraft in his younger days. He was telling me to just goto Lowes and pic up some PT plywood use some 5200 clamp it together and install it in the transom and use 5200 for all my bolts. since mine isn't gonna be used in saltwater it shouldn't be that big a deal and also it's so easy to replace the transom to just do it every 2 - 3 years during the winter months when your not useing it. also he said i can use some SS bolts on the knee brace since it won't see saltwater as well just use 5200.

on the bow I have 2 choices I canbuck it real good and use gluvit and hope it seals it. or use SS bolts with locking back nuts and use 5200 and then gluvit it all.

and the floor he said 3/4 ply and glass it then paint or marine carpet it...
also has a few old starcraft outback that have bad hull rot but parts in the interior are still good said if i find anthing I can use more then welcome to get. he's gona strip them for the aluminum. gona give them a nice send off.

todays agenda

design dash and rear deck addon

fridays agenda

JB Weld the holes
knee brace
buck the rivets in the bow
plywood for transom

Saterday

build transom
install transom
seal all bolts with 5200

Sunday

leak test
start on dash if all goes well

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Check post #58 and #63 on the PT ply idea...

 

[Daltonxj]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Maybe he ment exterior grade ply my bad. nephew just told me he said exterior grade. he was telling me not to use PT. my bad again. glad I took him with me LOL

 

[North Beach]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

OK you guys know I can't resist wading into any and all marine wood/foam arguments so here goes.

Dalton, we are here sort of like your cabinet. We make suggestions based upon our experiences and what we've gleaned from others when we asked the question, and you take it all in, look at what you want to accomplish, peek in your wallet, and make the decision.

With that said I'll offer what I think. and this is in no way meant to mean that anyone else here making comments is a moron or doesn't know what they are talking about. I just think sometimes folks make their decisions, and human nature would lead us to beleive it was the best danged decision that could have been made.

First, I went with marine grade 5 ply Douglas Fir plywood in the deck of the liquid limo for a couple reasons. The fir exhibits more resistance to moisture than the danged pine they use in all the other plywoods. Also because it's more dense which makes it a little stronger and again, less suceptable to moisture intrusion.

Secondly, the glue is waterproof in marine grade, not moisture resistant. There is a big difference.

Third, no voids in the inner plies. This makes it stronger and again, gives the water no where to lay around and fester and attack the moisture resistant glue.

Then I applied two coats of epoxy resin to the bottom, and did the same on top with a layer of glass matt. Again for waterproofing, and the matt for added strength.

When I finally get to the wood portion of the mariner, I'll gladly do the same. And I'll use the doug fir marine ply on the transom with at least two coats of epoxy resin on each side. Now maybe that's overkill, but I'm 53 and I don't want to do the same boat twice.

My 44 year old boat had doug fir marine plywood (not resin coated) on the deck and it lasted a heckava long time. I seriously don't think the exterior grade pine would have. I should note that it was severly degraded in areas where moisture collected like around the bottom of the motor box and in the back near the stern.

Now, several of the guys here have taken different paths and no one has come on board and blasted them for it. I guess we all feel like it's your boat and you can do what you want to. But the doug fir marine grade will be the only thing I put in my boat.

If you decide to go that route you can go to Lowes and they will special order it for you but you have to pay shipping.

Additionally, you should consider that most of us have only recently restored a boat and all of them could fall apart in the next 5 years for all we know

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

maybe he ment exterior grade ply my bad. Nephew just told me he said exterior grade. He was telling me not to use pt. My bad again. Glad i took him with me lol

Sweet!!

 

[jasoutside]

Re: 1979 Starcraft Holiday16 closed bow

Additionally, you should consider that most of us have only recently restored a boat and all of them could fall apart in the next 5 years for all we know

Ha, ha!! Wouldn't that be a drag! I suppose it would keep the resto thread busy, eh!