HELP!

[wells2001]

Hi all..new to this forum and VERY new to boating. I recently purchased an 81 15'sea raider (trihull,bowrider) and it needs work. I have torn out the floor and I would like ot know the materials needed to replace it. The piece that I am replacing is about 2.5 x 7. I have the foam and the middle stringer still there and I am not planning on doing a major restoration. I would just like to get this boat floating. <br /><br />I have holes on the outside to fix as well . How should I start? inside first then outside? What would be my first steps? Any help would be appreciated greatly. I have pics posted of the boat at www.weltechconsulting.com/Boat/boat.htm

 

[JustMrWill]

Re: HELP!

First - Welcome to iBoats!<br /><br />Second - If you look towards the top of the page (just below the POST NEW TOPIC) there is a red SEARCH link. This is your friend. Trust me, this is the first place to start...<br /><br />Third - Go buy the boat Runabout Renovations...this will tell you step by step what you need and how to do it.<br /><br />Once you have read hundreds of posts about renovations...and you read the book...then we can help better with the more specific posts.<br /><br />Tengals progress is outlined in this post<br /> http://www.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=26;t=002761 <br /><br />Check on the share projects link at the bottom of his posts...there are MANY people in your boat (no PUN intended...no wait..PUN is in your boat too...)<br /><br />Have fun...we look forward to seeing your progress.<br /><br />-JustMrWill

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

Thanks for the Warm welcome and advice. I have already learned how I am going to start...looks like its gonna be a bit expensive. I just need to get the plywood,epoxy,fibreglass...and sandpaper...lots of it, lol. Anything I am missing here?

 

[tengals123]

Re: HELP!

I can't say this enough. When you buy your resins, try and work out how much you'll need, then double it. Everyone I know skimped out on resins and ended up going back to the store 2-3 times for more. ( including me! )<br /><br /><br />cheers

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

Well if you have seen my boat, what would your esimate be for the amount of resin,epoxy,fiberglass (would 6oz be ok?).What brand of epoxy should i use, keep in mind I want the cheapest fix possible. Also, for the holes in the outside bottom of the boat and the ones that go right through..whats the best fix?<br /><br />How many layers of fibreglass would you recommend for the floor?<br /><br />Thanks for all your help, I am sooo new to this so your wisdom is appreciated. <br /><br />tengals...I have looked at your restoration...AWESOME! You da man!

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

I have heard roofing spray tar would help a bit..any comments?<br /><br />I am only going to use pressure treated plywood for the floor..non marine grade. I am going to seal it, any recommendations for that?<br /><br />I realize that these are newbie questions but sadly..that is what I am..lol<br />thanks again for any help.

 

[AMD Rules]

Re: HELP!

Hey Keith,<br /><br />Looks like you made quick progress!<br /><br />You might want to check out Jason's site as well.<br />His boat has a similar profile, although bigger:<br />1970 Silverline Comoro 165 tri-hull<br /><br />Good luck with your project. Hope everything works out well for you.

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

thanks tengals..so poly is the cheaper way to go or just not good to use? If it will suffice I will use the cheaper method. What kind of shape does all the surfaces have to be in to start with the resin and for the glass to stick well?

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

Thanks AMD.. The site is great! He has 3 stringers..I only have one down the middle..is that ok? I feel so stupid right now...but I would rather be safe then sorry. I am leaving the middle stringer in...its not the best but it will hold for this summer, untill I can get it redone properly. When I ripped up the floor there was only one stringer down the middle and a piece of 1/4" plywood cut 28" wide and 7' long to cover the middle stringer etc.. So from what I can tell..I only have to fill that spot with 1/2 inch ply now.

 

[tengals123]

Re: HELP!

by the looks of your boat, I'd say your going to need anywhere from 5-10 gallons of resin. All epoxy if you can afford it. I use 'international' products thruout my project, they are expensive. Buy your resins in bulk. Some other guys here will be able to reccommend brands of poly and epoxy in your country, i'm in 'the land downunder'<br /><br /> <br /><br />cheers<br /><br />cheers

 

[tengals123]

Re: HELP!

ok, poly is cheaper and personally I used it to seal all my ply. It's quite ok for glassing in non-structual area's to. It is no good for stuctual filling, binding joining or anything like that. You will need to use epoxy for that.<br />As for the surfaces, they need to be washed, cleaned sanded, cleaned again and then applied. Surface preperation is 95% of the work and of the quality of job. If you skimp on this part, you boat WILL fall apart.<br />Important.....don't sand first then clean. If you sand first, you'll sand all the dirt, oil, grease, grime and the like into the glass and no amont of cleaning will get it out. So, clean, then sand then clean again.<br /><br />Hope this helps a bit.<br /><br />cheers

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

awesome tengals!..you are such a great help to everyone on this site. As I go through leaerning more and more I see you helping people everywhere..thanks very much. So what you are saying so far is .. I will need a bit of epoxy and poly for the rest. See the problem I have is I don;t know what is Structural or not..lol.I have one stringer still glassed in and foam..the ply was right on what you see in the pics but with fibreglass over top.<br /><br />Im thinking some fibreglass cloth and poly for the inside over top of the ply..epoxy for the outside of boat.<br /><br />Will poly and the cloth stick to the old boat material?

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

oh and i will treat the plywood with resin as I understand..before I put it in. Good thing is that I have a nice rectangle shape to cut<br /><br />Should I get 6oz cloth for the whole boat and just tape for the edges of the ply and the holes i see?

 

[JustMrWill]

Re: HELP!

I have not started my restore project yet so I am in no way an expert (someone correct me if I give bad info) but <br /><br />if you are using pressure treated plywood, you MUST dry it before trying to coat it with resin...everything I have heard is that the resin will not stick to wet wood.<br /><br />-JustMrWill

 

[tengals123]

Re: HELP!

Just Mr will you are right all PT ply need to be completly dry before resining. One one would want to seal is 'wetness' anyway.<br />Keith, Structual is anything that basically give primary strength to the boat. So what I would define as being structual would be like, Stringers, transom, crossmembers, any deck or support strut or the like. Also things to consider that will also need epoxy are things like, pedistal seat bases, lounge box bases etc. I know people that epoxy their floor, I polyed mine, which is common. Remember when glassing, you will need 2-3 coats. Basically, you put 1 coat down, then lay the cloth/mat, then coat it again, the next day or so you properly seal it with another coat. With that said, if you were glassing your transom to the sides of your hull, you would use glass matt and epoxy resin. If you were fiberglassing your live bait tank, you would use glass matt and poly resin. You need to use your common sense a little bit. Ask yourself, when the boat is in use, which parts are under stress and which parts are not. This is the difference between structual and non-structual. Poly and cloth should stick to nearly anything if its cleaned well and sanded to give some 'bite' to the surface. And yes your heading down the right track, I would never use poly resin on the outside surface of a boat.<br />Hope this helps abit.<br /><br />cheers

 

[Ralph 123]

Re: HELP!

Just a nice explanation of Epoxy and Poly<br /><br />

<br />Don Casey Tip #29 <br /><br />Polyester or Epoxy Resin? <br /><br />What kind of resin you should select depends on the job you are doing. Polyester resin is excellent for fiberglass lay-up--building a boat, for example—but it is less ideal for repair work. Polyester laminating resin doesn’t fully cure while exposed to air, so when it is used for lay-up, every application joins to the previous one on a molecular level. You end up with what is essentially a single substance encapsulating multiple layers of glass fabric. <br /><br />When you are doing a repair, you need for the resin to also function as an adhesive—gluing the patch to the surrounding surface. Polyester is not very good at this. Epoxy resin, on the other hand, is a first-rate adhesive. Because of this, as a general rule you should use epoxy resin for all repair work. <br /><br />The exception is when the repair will be finished with gelcoat. Epoxy adheres tenaciously to cured polyester but the reverse is not true. The bond between an epoxy repair and an overcoat of polyester gelcoat will not be strong. Use polyester for repairs that will be gelcoated. Cost can also be a consideration. Epoxy is three to five times more expensive than polyester. This is relatively insignificant for a small repair, but where the damaged area is large, using polyester resin significantly lowers the cost of the repair. <br /><br />Grinding (sanding) is essential regardless of which resin you choose, but if, for reasons of cost, you elect to make your repair with polyester resin, it is imperative to grind the repair area especially heavily. First wipe the surface thoroughly with a dewaxing solvent, then use a 36-grit disk to grind everywhere you want the resin to adhere. Heavy grinding can somewhat offset polyester’s weaker adhesion. <br />

http://www.boatus.com/boattech/TipResins.htm <br /><br />You can find more of his tips, including fiberglass repair, here:<br /><br /> http://www.boatus.com/boattech/howto_lib.htm

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

WoW ....Thanks guys, Tengals you amaze me!!lol<br /><br />All this help is pointingme in the right directions fast..wihtout it all I would not have this boat in the water for a loong time. My goal is to have it done with in the week or so.<br /><br />I am going to day to get ply and fibreglass tape,epoxy and saftey gear(gloves,glasses) I am going to cut all my wood peices today and poly them al and let them dry. then begiun sanding EVERYTHING inside and my girlfriend can start on the outside. <br /><br />Thanks for the all the great links too fellas, I will post many pics of its progress and pics of it on the water..sinking or not..lol so YOU all how much you have helped me

 

[burt_066]

Re: HELP!

Check out this place before you buy your supplies<br /> http://www.shopmaninc.com I saved about 50% or more over west marine's prices.

 

[tengals123]

Re: HELP!

Good work keith.<br />One importand tip. Cut your ply first then resin the peices, paying special attention to the edges and corners. If you have a peice of cut ply and leave 1 square inch bare, the whole thing will begin to rot, if exposed to water or moisture. Rot/wet creeps, so if it get in thru a little bit you missed, it will creep all the way in untill it falls apart. And that's not good.<br /><br />Keep us updated and good luck mate.<br /><br />cheers

 

[wells2001]

Re: HELP!

Thanks for the tip tengals, I have gotten alot done today, I am quite surprised actually. I guess it helps to have your neighbor off work..lol<br /><br />I did cut all the ply and I am re inforcing the floor with 1x2 strapping and putting one 1x2 on top of the middle stringer to help that out and raise the floor a bit. I am using 1/2 inch ply as aposed to the 1/4 inch they had originally. As i stated earlier it is a strong fix to get it out on the water fast. <br /><br />So today I sanded the inside ...taped and epoxy'd all the holes I saw from the insideletting it dry over night). <br /><br />I cut all the strapping and ply for the floor and gave it first coat of poly. <br /><br />I reinforced and sealed the foam in the middle with spray foam from homedepot("great stuff").<br /><br />She is tarped and sleeping for the night.<br /><br />Should one more coat of poly be ok? How many layers of 6oz cloth should I use to do the floor on top of the ply? <br /><br />Thanks again all (especially you tengals)