Transom Leaking-Please Help!-

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
I will try to keep this short while still providing all the details. The Boat is a 92 Bayliner capri with a mercruiser 4.3 alpha 1 gen 2. I have owned it for 4 years now. Ill start with last summer as this was the first season I did any preventative maintenance. I Started the season replacing all of the bellows along with the trim sending unit, shift cable, and impeller. I did these repairs initially on my own. I didn't want to break the seal for the trim sending unit so I cut and spliced the wires and heat shrunk the wires to prevent corrosion as best I could (I know this was not the best idea). The units aren't terribly expensive so when it goes bad again ill replace it and do it right.

I had trouble keeping the exhaust bellow on. after a few days it would keep popping off. At the time I wasnt aware that its not a big deal and there was an alternative to the old style exhaust bellow. After it coming off 3 times on me I decided to take it to a shop and have it put on. The boat sat at the marine mechanic waiting for the bellows to be replaced for a couple of weeks and it was already late in the season. This marine mechanic I took it to was highly recommended from several people. While doing the bellows he discovered the "main seal" in the outdrive needed replaced and I also replaced the u joints while he was in there. Im wanting to say he did a few more things to the outdrive while he was in there. anyway, it was to late in the season by the time I got the boat back so I winterized it and stuck it in the warehouse.

This summer I got it out (about 3 weeks ago), noticed the exhaust bellow was off again. I went to take the boat out anyway and replace it later. As I only got it out once last summer and it was already halfway through our short boating season. The wife, kids and I were all eager to get on the water. I went to launch the boat and noticed it took on a fair amount of water in a short amount of time. about a gallon in 20min still sitting on the trailer. This is my first boat so im paranoid about everything lol. so we decided not to launch because I couldn't tell where it was coming from at the time. I took it back to the marine mechanic, explained the bellow issue and that it was taking on water. It wasn't taking on water before the initial bellow install last summer. He changed the exhaust bellow to the newer style and told me there was no water in the bellows but he didn't have time to stick it in the water to investigate unless I wanted to leave it there for another 10 days till he could get it in. He informed me of the play in the drive from the steering pin. That possibly the seals were worn out and could be leaking there.

So I decided to take it on home and try to investigate on my own until it gets a little closer to my appt date. I took the boat down this morning and found that if I stick the boat in the water without starting it, it stays dry. I can see water creeping in up on top of the steering arm. its minimal though. its no where near the amount of water I noticed initially. I let the boat sit maybe 10mins. raising and lowering the outdrive. turning the steering wheel back and forth. No real leak until I start the boat. once started it takes less than 2 min for the leak to show. I can see it on the port side of the boat leaking under the y pipe. where it connects to the transom plate. Its kind of tight in there. I cant really get my hands back in there to feel around to much. The little bit I can, there seems to be no water leaking down from the water inlet hose. which is where I thought it was coming from since it only leaked once i started the boat(but nothing seems to leak while running on muffs). No other hoses seem to be leaking anywhere. There is a small steady stream of water about a half inch from the port side corner, bottom of the y pipe where it meets the transom. Also about a 1/4" away from the small stream, closer to the port-bottom corner of the y pipe theres a larger bead that forms right in the seam and runs down the transom. im leaning towards the y pipe being the main cause of the leak. I can run it back down to the dock and get a picture of the what I think to be the leak. Im sure a picture would be better than a description. I also just ordered a borescope. itll be here in 2 days. I should be able to get a little better look at what is going on. Hoping to get a second opinion on what may be the cause or where else to look.
 

kenny nunez

Captain
Joined
Jun 20, 2017
Messages
3,356
You are going to have to pull the engine. The “Y” pipe may be eroded at the bottom where the mounting bolts go through the flange. That is where electrolysis gets to them. I have seen holes in the gimbal housing near the top from the same cause.
Bayliner used some very poor materials in their transom. If your transom is still good then you are extremely lucky.
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
if the y pipe isnt rotten or corroded. is it odd for the y pipe to just start leaking for no reason? its not been bumped hard or ran into anything. the boat is in extremely good condition for its age honestly. the guy I bought it from bought it brand new and stored it indoors its entire life. it doesn't seem to have been abused. hell it still has original material on the seats with no holes or wear on them.
 

Rick Stephens

Admiral
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Messages
6,118
Most common Y pipe leak comes from an overheat that burns an exhaust shutter and drops parts down in the Y pipe which then wear a hole in it. Also, there is an o-ring between Y pipe and gimbal housing with 4 bolts. Those can get loose and bust the o-rung.

You can have a poor gimbal housing to transom seal that allows the water to leak down inside the keyhole until it becomes visible at the bottom of the keyhole near the Y pipe. That is most often caused by a rotten transom. Easiest way to test a transom is to drill a couple test holes from inside into the wood down low. See if the wood comes out clean or mushy. Plug the holes with 5200, which is permanent.
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
ok ill go out and drill some holes in the transom. how deep should I drill? I have some 5200 on hand too... Im going to take it to the ramp again as soon as I get the borescope. so I can take detailed pictures and be able to get into the tight spots I cant get in with my mirror and flashlight. Just so im 100% sure that's exactly where its coming from and not running down there. Im pretty confident that it is coming through from the bottom of the y pipe.
 

Bondo

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Apr 17, 2002
Messages
71,214
Im going to take it to the ramp again as soon as I get the borescope. so I can take detailed pictures and be able to get into the tight spots I cant get in with my mirror and flashlight. Just so im 100% sure that's exactly where its coming from and not running down there. Im pretty confident that it is coming through from the bottom of the y pipe.

Ayuh,..... A digital camera in yer hand can do wonders,....... ;)
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
ok, so i took it back down to the marine mechanic this morning. we took it to a ramp and stuck it in. immediately said its your steering pin seal. Said it was leaking bad and running down between the transom plate and dripping off of the y pipe. Said it was roughly a 1500 fix. I just dropped 1000 on bellows and some other things for the outdrive, i cant swing another 1500. The motor and drive needs pulled obviously. Then he said the transom plate and everything would need removed. The steering was also a bit loose indicating something was wore out. he said either the pin could have weld added to it and filed down to make a good fit, or the aluminum could be built up and filed to fit the pin. I'm a welder by trade and have a milling machine and lathe in my garage as well as welding machines. So either way I went I would be able to do it right here in my garage. i just lack the marine mechanical experience. i need to know what parts ill need to replace in the process of this job. such as seals, gaskets, and whatever else. I have no idea what im getting myself into here. I do have a seloc manual although I haven't read through it yet for this issue. Any guidance and advice anyone could provide would be greatly appreciated. If this problem hasn't been covered several times I can provide detailed pictures of the process if anyone feels itll be helpful. I'm aware of the method of drilling large holes to access the bolts, im just not real fond of putting big holes in it if I don't absolutely have to.
 

porscheguy

Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 17, 2013
Messages
441
Make sure you’ve got a strong battery and a good bilge pump, and run it until you can afford to fix it.
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
unfortunately its flowing in to much at this point to even do that. It's either fix it now. or store it until I put back enough to pay someone to fix it. My plan b would be if get to uncomfortable messing with it. take it to him with the motor and drive out and just pay him to remove the transom plates, fix the pin and seals then bring it back home and reinstall the motor and drive myself. i have all the tools to complete the job, just lack the know how. which I know is what your paying for at a shop. im comfortable with pulling the motor, drive, and gimbal. It's just the transom plate I have no experience with. Just looking for tips and tricks from experienced guys so I know what im looking for and whats going to need replaced when reinstalling everything.
 

Boater31

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
129
Haven't done this job yet but with that equipment I can assume you have the smarts to get it done.

I will say get creative and destroy that seloc manual and get your hands on the real manual. I believe #14. It explains step by step what you need to do.

If you don't wanna drill the holes to get to the steering parts your gonna have to remove drive, bellhouse, and engine to get at it.

Good news is since you gotta remove bellhouse you can do trim senders the right way since your in there, just one more bolt above the water hose.

Special tools I can think of will be alignment bar for engine reinstall, exhaust bellows tool, hinge pin tool, and a way to remove engine. I think you can leave outer shift cable installed to bellhouseing but will need to be careful and remember to tie a chaser wire for cable routing.

The real experts will probably have more.

Look up Friscoboater on YouTube as he has a video don't 5 this.
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
thank you for the reply. I have all of the tools you suggested above i will also look into the manual you suggested. the exhaust bellow is now a more modern version. or that is what I was told. so it doesn't connect from the bell housing to the drive. it just has a little stubby bellow on the bell housing. And for the u joint bellow. I really don't want to break the seal on the gimbal side. is it possible to just break it loose from the bell housing side and leave the u joint bellow connected to the gimbal?

Im sure there is a type of seal on the transom, will it need replaced after it is broken loose? is it like an o ring or is it a gasket? is there something on both sides of the transom?
 

JASinIL2006

Vice Admiral
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Feb 10, 2012
Messages
5,731
If you can pull the drive and the engine, then pulling the transom plate is no big deal. Just take a lot of picture of how everything looks before you pull it apart. You will need to get a new gasket to seal the gimbal housing to the transom; it's just a big foam rubber ring that fits into a groove in the housing.

And get rid of the Seloc manual. Use the actual Mercruiser service manual at http://boatinfo.no/lib/library.html .
 

Scott Danforth

Grumpy Vintage Moderator still playing with boats
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Jul 23, 2011
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50,608
the fact that the drive was off for a $150 part job with $850 worth of labor makes pulling the drive and the motor easy

pull drive
pull motor
pull y-pipe
remove transom shield
fix transom shield
install transom shield
install y-pipe
install motor
align motor
install drive.
 

Rick Stephens

Admiral
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Aug 13, 2013
Messages
6,118
It is NOT a technically difficult job to pull a motor and disassemble the transom plate from the gimbal housing. A few special tools, available on Fleabay or other. I would be more worried that you find something else that adds to the job.

I am a welder and mechanic and machinist by trade(s). Rebuilding my boat's mechanicals was definitely not all that challenging technically. There are jobs that require more investment in tools than the job is worth unless you are going to do a bunch of the same for $$. Removing the motor and running gear is not in that class.

Drilling holes and threading them for plugs is also extremely straightforward. A guy with a lathe and a mill should know that.

Get the correct Merc manual.
 

a8218

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Jun 23, 2016
Messages
32
thank you all very much for the replies. im also very afraid of what I might uncover after I tear it apart. im going to go ahead and take the plunge and attempt to tackle this. I watched the friscoboater video on the gimbal rebuild that was suggested and it was a great help in understanding what to do. on the transom seal, he put bellows adhesive on it as well. is that recommended? should I replace the y pipe seal while im in there? ive read a lot of people have problems with them leaking.

the boat mechanic I took it to said something about having to build up weld and file to fit to get rid of the play in the steering. Which part was he referring to? if I order a new steering pin and bushings, that should get rid of the slop correct?
 

JASinIL2006

Vice Admiral
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Feb 10, 2012
Messages
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Some folks add sealant to the gimbal housing, but that’s not what the manual calls for... I used just a touch of bellows adhesive in the groove, to keep the gasket from popping out, but I used no sealant on the gasket itself. If your transom is flat, you shouldn’t need any sealant.
 

scoflaw

Ensign
Joined
Jun 2, 2010
Messages
962
That $10 POS foam rubber Mercruiser transom gasket should definitely be glued in, like with 4200 or better.

How many rotted transoms do you think this gasket is responsible for ? It should be a formed rubber o-ring like the y-pipe gasket.
 

JASinIL2006

Vice Admiral
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Feb 10, 2012
Messages
5,731
That's an interesting question... I really don't know. I haven't read too many threads here where that gasket was the culprit. If it fails that much, I'd be surprised that Mercruiser still uses that design. I do know that anytime I see sealant around the gimbal housing, I've always assumed it's a half-baked attempt to solve a leak caused by a bad transom.

It would be interesting to hear how many people routinely use some kind of sealant between the transom and that gasket.
 

Boater31

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
129
Im not sure what he is referring to for welding, but I would replace the pin and bushings/seals when I'm there. The only other thing else he is referring to is the steering arm but I would think that will be obvious when you get to that part if replacement is needed.

You might have to remove gear lube hose and water house to remove the bell housing. Lots of post on best way to reinstall.

Your gonna have to remove the uj sleeve in Bell house there is a special tool to remove it but it's cheaper to just bend it and replace. Will need another special tool to reinstall.

​​​​​Leaving it in the gimbal side is up to you.

You are also going to need a bell housing gasket set for the drive install.
 

TunaFish389

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Apr 26, 2018
Messages
184
Can you see the water coming from the steering pin? Seems like a lot of water coming in at this point. You said the exhaust bellows came off after improper install, maybe the drive bellow has issues too. See if water is coming out the little hole above the drive shaft.

You said that you were not taking on water before bellow replacement so that gots me douting the steering pin. If its the same mechanic that installed the bellows saying this then I would second guess his diagnosis.
 
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