Conventional vs smart tabs

[swist]

Can some one give me a succinct pro/cons of conventional (console-controlled ) trim tabs vs Smart Tabs. If the smart tabs are so good, why would anyone go through all the considerable installation complexity of conventional tabs?<br /><br />I can see two things off the top of my head (1) conventional tabs can be used to adjust for unequal side-to-side laoding which I can't imagine smart tabs can figure out.... and (2) smart tabs hang down when unloaded - seems like you could be asking for trouble backing up in shallow water and hitting an onstruction which would bent the tabs over backward...

 

[f_inscreenname]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Go over to the I/O board. This war has been on going for weeks.

 

[umblecumbuz]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

This is the thread:<br /><br /> http://www.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=010810 <br /><br />You might win a hat!<br /><br />Ciao

 

[Snowdrggn]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

In answer to your questions,<br /><br />1. Smart tabs can be set to compensate for ueven loading to a degree. But not while underway.<br /><br />2. On my application they do not hang below the leg of the outboard, so dragging them while backing up in the shallows is not an issue to the tabs, but can be to the lower unit!<br /><br /> Please understand that I run a small inflatable, and have no onboard power, or room for operator contolled tabs. Smart tabs have been the best addition I could have made to the performance of the boat! Far less bow rise on hole shot, way lower minimum planing speed, better ride, and far better handling at speed.<br /><br /> As for being the better choice? For me it was between Smart tabs and fixed plate tabs, I know I made the better choice! <br /><br /> If I was working with a larger, conventional boat, I would probably go with Bennett tabs as they seem to be the standard, which makes parts availability a non issue. I also like the "on the fly" adjustability of the Bennett tabs. <br /><br /> The smart tabs are of the set them and forget them school of thought, and are incredible in regards to their performance in my application. The people at Nauticus are great at helping you make sure the tabs do what they claim.<br /><br /> I have met several people on the water that also own inflatables, who have enquired about the tabs on my inflatable. If I have the time, I'll take them for a ride and disconnect the actuators, then stop and hook them back up to show them the difference. I have not done this once that the person has not gone and bought Smart tabs for their own inflatable! <br /><br /> I have purchased a new inflatable for next season (frozen solid here at the moment) and have a new set of Smart tabs for it waiting to be mounted. A friend of mine bought my old inflatable and there was no way I could convince him that I should keep the tabs that were on it for my new boat.<br /><br /> Personally, on bigger craft, I feel hydraulic tabs are the better way to go if the operator understands how to use them, they can be scary in the hands of the inexperienced! <br /><br /> Just my input.<br /><br /> Cheers,<br /> Snow.<br /><br />PS: remember this was posted by someone who goes 32mph in a 10ft inflatable boat, so sanity may be an issue?<br /><br />

 

[rwidman]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

I agree with Snowdrggn and I have owned both. Small boat - SmartTabs, larger boat - helm adjustable tabs.

 

[richg99]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

I've only owned Smart Tabs, but, I have read, with great interest, all of the recent TAB comments on about four newsgroups. <br /><br />No matter what brand or style that you like...it is interesting to me that ALL of the owners love their tabs. Big tabs; little tabs; control-able tabs; non-control-able tabs. No where, that I have read, does any OWNER knock the concept and value of TABS. They are a great addition for your boat, if you need help staying on plane, or getting up to plane. RichG TX

 

[Snowdrggn]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

richg99,<br /> Prior to installing the Smart Tabs, I had a "fin" on the outboard to try and help the inflatable on a plane and control bow rise. It accomplished these things, and caused the boat to run bow down once on plane. With the smart tabs, I get the "help" my boat needs and they let me run the motor trimmed properly. My wife finds the fin far superior to the Smart tabs it seems and won't part with it. She uses it as a garden tool, picks the neighbour's dog's "gifts" off the lawn with it, and has found various other uses around the yard for it. In her opinion the "fin" is a far better solution than tabs in the fact that it is not attached to a boat! She highly reccomends the "fin" as being far more useful.<br /><br />Cheers,<br /> Snow.

 

[umblecumbuz]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Snowdrggn,<br /><br />Soon be obsolete fins sold on ebay - under 'Pets'.

 

[swist]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Looks like even the West Marine (2004) catalog agrees. Smart Tabs only have models for lengths up to 21'. So looks like my 24' boat would need Bennett tabs.

 

[Jdeagro]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Smart Tabs II have just been introduced for shipment in Late January. They are designed for low prifile boats (no fly bridges) under 10' in width, up to 30' in length, and up to 8500 Lbs. List price is $349.00.<br /><br />They are 16" wide by 10" deep, and come with two Actuators per plate.

 

[Tabman]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Swist,<br /><br />My name is Tom Mcgow and I work for Bennett Marine. Anyone who works at Bennett Marine and posts at any marine forum is required to identify who they work for, each and every time they post. I feel that it is incumbent upon all of us in the industry to do so. This prevents any misunderstanding of our intentions and helps those who may not know us by name! In case you did not know, NautiJohn is the president of Nauticus, the company that manufactures Smart Tabs. John does a good job here on this site explaining the virtues of his product. I do feel however for the benefit of newcomers he should identify himself.<br /><br />I would be delighted to explain the advantages of remotely controlled "conventional" Tabs if you wish. We manufacture systems for boats from 15' -90' as do many other manufactures of remotely controlled Trim Tab systems. However most of the other posters here are doing a good job of it so I will leave it to them! If you have any specific questions regarding remotely adjustable Trim Tabs in general, or Bennett Trim Tabs in particular please let me know and I will do my best to give you complete information.<br /><br />Tom McGow<br />Bennett Marine

 

[umblecumbuz]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

This thread is getting interesting!

 

[phatmanmike]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

in this corner....wearing the blue trunks, its NAUTI JOHN<br /><br />and in the other corner, wearing the green trunk with blue stripe......its tabman<br /><br />ladies and gentleman, this is the fight we've all been waiting for.<br /><br /><br />seriously, they both have theyre advantages and disadvantages.<br /><br />it truly depends on :<br />your budget<br />type of boat<br />how many chicks you get

 

[Jdeagro]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Hi Tom;<br /><br />Hope your holidays have been good, and Happy New Year to you and yours.<br /><br />I have not been trying to hide anything, and have stated my position at times although not always.<br /><br />I have just updated my profile so that the signature should show who I am. Frankly - I did not know that this could be done automaticaly.<br />Sorry if you have been offended, or if you feel I have been attempting to mislead anyone. Realy not my style.

 

[Snowdrggn]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

John and Tom,<br /> In the past I've owned a larger boat with Bennett tabs, and now own an inflatable with Smart Tabs. In the past, I found customer support from Bennett to be excellent. In the more recent past I found John to provide support not often found in this day and age. Both products have performed very well in their respective applications, and I would not hesitate to reccomend either of them! Both of you represent superior products, but with different angles of attack. <br /><br /> There shouldn't be a debate between them as the operator's choice would be defined by the amount of personal input versus the amount of "on the fly" adjustability the require. In my present application, I like the lack of input required, once the initial set up has been done. On the other hand, with a large hard hulled craft, I think I would go the helm controlled route as the ability to adjust on the fly would appeal to me.<br /><br /> Thanks to the both of you for your efforts and support,<br /><br /> Snow.

 

[Tabman]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

John,<br /><br />Thanks, my holidays were and continue to be great and I hope yours were too. <br /><br />Please take my statement about identifying ourselves on these forums the in the spirit I intended it. I never thought you meant to mislead, you are a straightforward guy, no question about it.<br /><br />I am however a stickler when it comes to identifying ourselves on these forums. We are pretty much here as guests and we need to be scrupulous about this sort of thing or we stand the chance of opening a can of worms. This subject came up last spring on this board, and it has come up on many other boards my company participates on. I truly feel it is in the best interest of you and I and the folks using this forum. So please take it to mean that both you and I, as well as any other manufactures here need to "play nice".<br /><br />Snow,<br /><br />Thanks for the kind words.<br /><br />Tom McGow<br />Bennett Marine

 

[swist]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Well then let me ask a slightly different question. What is the downside of any kind of tab? There are many topics in these forums relating to tabs and it sure seems like there aren't any (small) boats that don't benefit from them.<br /><br />So one wonders why they are not standard equipment in more cases than they are. Sure I can see why the very low end boats need to save every nickel in cost, but compared to a lot of other more commonly-installed standard equipment, tabs aren't that expensive (I would imagine the cost to the boat builders would be quite a bit lower than what we pay).<br /><br />Any thoughts on this?

 

[garycinn]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

My name is Garycinn and I don't work for any tab company .<br /><br />I have been researching tabs for my boat as of late and I am leaning towards Lenco. <br /><br />www.lencomarine.com<br /><br />The reason I am leaning towards Lenco's vs. Bennett's is:<br /><br />-easier install<br />-electric vs. hydraulic system<br />-auto retract part of indicator switch vs. a separate add-on module<br />-dash space -- indicator and switch is one unit<br /><br />I know, everyone says good things about Bennett's, but I don't want another hydraulic system when I don't have to have one. To me, electric seems less complicated.<br /><br />I'm sure Bennett's are great, but I wanted to point out that there is another alternative.

 

[Jdeagro]

Re: Conventional vs smart tabs

Swist;<br /><br />I would like to answer your question from more than one point of view. <br /><br />First is there a down side? From a boat performance view point I can not think of any. I guess it would be like asking the pilot of a small plane if he could do without the flaps. <br /><br />Some high performance boat owners may say that they slow the boat down, not true! If the boat chine walks or porpoises badly a slight deployment (helm controlled) of the tabs will eliminate the problem, and may slow the boat a bit, however operating the boat at high speeds when it is chine walking or porpoising is not safe. Smart Tabs work slightly different and since they are "spring loaded" they are not deployed at high speeds. Adjusting the pressure correctly will eliminate the porpoising or chine walk without any reduction in speed. <br /><br />With regard to the "standard equipment" issue, here is my take.<br /><br />Thinking like a boat manufacturer you need to accept the following: <br /><br />1) two of the three biggest lies in the world are - "Our Boats don't need trim tabs", and "If the boat needs trim tabs there is something wrong with the hull deign" - you know the other one - "the check is in the mail".<br /><br />2) Every dime counts, and the cost of helm controlled tabs on smaller boats is beyond the manufacturers budget.<br /><br />3) Most small boats will have twice as much HP per pound (HP to weight ratio) as there bigger (30' twin engine) cousin. With enough horse power you can make any boat plane, but that does not mean it is a good design.<br /><br />4) "Trim tabs are only needed to make the boat plane" - a false statement. Trim tabs adjust the hull design to compensate for the constant changes in water, speed, weight, and balance conditions.<br /><br />5) Most I/Os and Outboards now come with "tilt and trim" and the boat manufacturer "tilts" the transom so that the motor can help push up on the stern during acceleration. This is not only inefficient but is limited in it's effectiveness. The motor/ propeller is for propulsion not attitude adjustment.<br /><br />6) Changing props will fix the performance problems - False! They cure one problem then add to another. For example: A lower pitch prop will provide faster acceleration - but reduce top speed and run the engine faster at all other speeds, resulting in more fuel consumption. and vise versa.<br /><br />I think you will be hard pressed to find a boat owner who has trim tabs that will tell you he isn't happy with the addition. That should tell you something.