1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

[Tbonus]

This is my first post, so be gentle.<br /><br />Almost got stranded on the water yesterday. The starter acted like the battery was dead. After a couple of tries, it did start. I also noticed that my hummingbird fishfinder that is wired to the battery froze and I could not turn it off without disconnecting it from the battery. One more stop and no more starts. I lifted the cover and saw that the starter would engage but would turn very slowly and make a grinding type of noise. I had a pull cord on board and the motor manually started right up. I have searched this board and read numerous posts, pages of posts, in fact. Lots of great info. <br /><br />I have taken off the negative lead to the block and cleaned it. I have also bypassed the solenoid with the positive lead with the same results from the starter. Tomorrow, I will run a lead from the battery straight to the starter and see if that resolves the problem. Does the grinding noise indicate a need to replace the starter? Does it sound like it would be electrical or mechanical? Any other ideas?

 

[jimalsk]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

It sounds as if the brushes in the starter are gone. Take the starter off and tear it down and check. It could be an electrical problem also. Do your test with the positive lead, but I'm leaning towards the brushes. Good luck

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

I see that a brush kit is less than $20. I am new to the outboard arena, but am comfortable turning wrenches. I also bought the Clymer manual for my motor. How hard is it to change the brushes and do it correctly? I have never done it. Would I be better off buying a reman starter?

 

[JB]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Changing brushes is pretty easy, Tbonus.<br /><br />The only tricky part is reassembly.. . getting the brushes seated on the commutators correctly and the end plate position correct (if you put it on backwards, which is easy, the motor reverses).<br /><br />Very careful observation during disassembly will make that a lot easier.<br /><br />Good luck.

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Thanks for the replies. <br /><br />I ran cables from the battery to the starter just to check the cables, and starter has the same problem. I have disassembled the starter and polished all of the contacts to a shine. I did not put in new brushes because the old ones looked fine. Re-assembled the starter and on a bench test, the starter spun like a top. Patting myself on the back, I re-assembled everything. Turned the key and have the exact same problem. Under a load, the starter just doesn't have the ummpfff to turn the motor. As stated before, I can pull start it just fine so it is not bound.<br /><br />Any ideas?

 

[angus63]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Check alignment and engagement of the starter gear and flywheel. Also give a visual to the condition of the flywheel and starter gear teeth. The starter will spin fine without a load even if it's going south. Also, if the bearings are shot, it will force the shaft over to one side and "grind". Be sure your battery is good before chasing further. Good luck

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Alignment is fine and the condition of the teeth is fine as well. <br /><br />I called the marina shop, and he thought it may be the solenoid. He said it may not be sending the correct amps. I thought the solenoid was either on or off, and the fact that juice was getting to the starter meant the solenoid was fine. Right or wrong?<br /><br />Now the starter just spins and does not engage the flywheel. If I help the gear up, it does the same as before. I did notice a little bit of a funny spot where the wire wrap inside the starter contacts the bottom. At on spot, it looked either corroded or a little burnt. Is it possible that the starter is just going and is weak?

 

[angus63]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

You can bypass the solenoid and use as close to 4 gage jumper cables as you can find. Just clamp the neg to an unpainted suface and touch the pos to the post on the starter. Expect a spark or two. Never saw a solenoid with too much resistance. Contacts commonly weld together when this is the case. If it works ok with the jumpers, it's either solenoid or connections. If it doesn't, sounds like the starter motor is kaput. Maybe you can find a local shop that will test the starter for you.<br />Good luck

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

We are making progress. It's looks like the problem is connections. Somewhere.<br /><br />I ran jumper cables from my truck right to the starter without the positive or negative cables from the boat attached to the motor. The motor started cranking. I then took sandpaper to the connectors and re-attached the positive and negative cables to the motor and disconnected them from the boat battery. I connected the jumpers from the truck to the cables from the boat battery. Starter had the intial problem and would barely turn. I figure it must be the battery cables. I then re-attached the boat cables to the boat battery. I ran the jumpers from the truck and directly to the solenoid, turned the key, and the motor started cranking. <br /><br />So it looks like the starter and solenoid are OK. The battery cables look to be in great shape. The boat and motor are only six years old. Maybe thats a long time in boat years. Am I missing any other connections for the battery cables? <br /><br />I am unsure how to change the cables from the battery to the motor. Is there a cable harness already made with the ends attached. Sorry if that's a dumb question. I just don't know. I would guess I would just attach a smaller guide wire and pull the old one out, attach the new cable to the guide wire, and pull the new one through.<br /><br />Any thoughts are appreciated.<br /><br />I have only had the boat for about three weeks. Here is a picture from this past weekend. Before the problems showed up.<br /><br />

 

[Solittle]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Great looking rig. You may be on the right track though it is a bit unusual for battery cables to crap out that quickly. Cables can and will corrode from the inside and actually turn into a green mush and on the outside look perfectly servicable. My rig is 15 years old and my cables are still sound - - and mine is a salt water 23'er.<br /><br />Why not buy some new cable and connectors and try it before you try to snake them through the wire bundle?

 

[BoatBuoy]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Could it simply be a bad or undercharged boat battery?

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Thank God for floodlights and neighbors that aren't home.<br /><br />I butchered a set of car jumper cables and tried to identify if it was just the positive or just the negative cable. I was using the truck parked next to the boat as a power source, just in case it was the boat battery causing the problem. Wouldn't you know it, every combination worked except the boat battery to the boat cables. Last time I tried a direct connect from the truck to the battery end of the boat cables, the problem was still there. Now it works just fine. <br /><br />I am not sure if disconnecting and reconnecting all the cables did the trick or if the battery has just been weak the whole time. I can tell you this, though. All of the connections are now shiny and tight.<br /><br />I'll hook up a battery charger tomorrow and see what we get. It looks like I may have a bit to learn about my new toy. <br /><br />Thanks again for the ideas.

 

[jimalsk]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

I think your on to some thing. The starter worked when you jumped it from your truck battery right? You could have a dead cell in the battery. Take your truck batery and hook it up to the boat. If it starts then the battery is the problem, if it doesn't then the cable or cables are bad. May even try putting the jumpers on the cables and give that a go. Elimination is the key to trouble shooting.

 

[jimalsk]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Isn't it great when great minds work alike, even being 5000 miles apart.

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

I'm thinking about just buying a new battery and avoiding any other headaches. I've only had the boat for about three weeks, so there is no telling how old the battery is. It looks like it's a car battery from Wal-Mart. No stickers indicating age although it looks brand new. Maybe just charge it and see?

 

[angus63]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Swap batteries with the truck (if the posts are common) and see how the truck cranks. A simple battery load test will tell you if it's good. Any auto repair shop or place that sells batteries has them (basically a toaster and a meter). Being battery is a mystery, sounds like a good idea to replace anyway for peace of mind. Like I mentioned in my first reply, always check the simple, obvious stuff out first when troublshootin' to avoid chasing your tail in the future. Wish I'd do it more often!!!<br />Good luck with that enviable rig!!

 

[Silvertip]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

Even though the battery terminals are clean and tight, the physical connection between the battery cable itself and the terminal may have become corroded or loose. There is no fix other than replacing the cable or using one of the replacement cable ends available at auto supply stores. I don't care for those however and recommend cable replacement when the ends are bad.

 

[Tbonus]

Re: 1998 Johnson 90 Special -starter grinds and turns slowly

I have been out in the boat twice since my R&R and have had zero problems. Cranks up every time.<br /><br />I think the main problem was a bad ground and then the battery was drained as I troubleshot the problem. I now put the battery on a charger before I take her out. Cheap insurance to make sure I make it back to shore.<br /><br />Thank you to everyone who replied. I learned alot about my boat and motor. Main lesson learned - Check the easy stuff first, ie - battery and connections. It would have saved me loads of time.<br /><br />'Til next time.