Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Yeah, that was kinda short notice, but a valiant effort none the less. Did you go? I didn't get to the motor as soon as i'd hoped but I came in to the shop for some tools today(no internet service ant the ol' homestead). I'll post on what I found monday morning......

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Well everything looks rebuildable! The upper rings were a little stuck, but the ring gap is looks pretty much like what you would expect new rings to have. <br /><br />Would a repair manual have blowups of the engine and drive? Also do they have part #'s in the manuals?

 

[racinmason]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Didn't make it to the auction,seeing how it was so wet.Took the money I would have used on gas and bought a starter solenoid for the Big Twin instead.Spent the rest of the day working on wiring.I've got a Seloc manual,and they've got blowups of just about everything,but no part #'s.You can get a parts catalog from places like kencook.com,but they're kinda pricey.I don't know if there's a site on the web that would have a parts listing for these old Big Twins,but if there is,someone here will know! Good to hear it's in good shape.Maybe you can get by with just a re-ring!

 

[racinmason]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

bump.

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

"bump."??<br /><br />Paul,<br /> Is there anything I should worry about if the rod journals have rust pits outside of where the bearings ride? The surface the bearings run on are perfectly smooth, with no pitting whatsoever. I think the rings are fine; they have no scoring at all on them and the gap is tight. I haven't measured it yet, but it's near the specs, if not less than the maximum spec. I was wondering if maybe this powerhead is a different year because the rod bolts were 3/16 allen instead of the 5/16 12 point that I was looking for. Maybe someone already swapped the powerhead? I was thinking last night that maybe my compression guage was messing up when I checked the compression, but I was using it on a customer's car the next morning and it was working fine. I just don't know what could be causing the low compression! I could take some pics of the pistons and other stuff for you guys if you would like.

 

[Chinewalker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Hi Eric,<br /> The rod bolts are correct - those old Big Twins used the allen bolts on the caps...<br /><br />- Scott

 

[Paul Moir]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

I wouldn't worry about the journals so long as where the bearings ride isn't blued, badly pitted, and measures to spec. I've only got a later spec (1.1828 - 1.1823", or 30-30.05mm), but it should be pretty obvious what the measure is. <br />Stuck rings will certainly cause a low compression reading. Perhaps the bottom ones came unstuck during removal.<br />Since you're looking to reassemble your engine, it's manditory you get a hold of a service manual now. I can understand why you wouldn't want to blow money on it with a bad outboard, since noone wants to throw good money after bad. The factory one from kencook.com is great, but since it's a big edition that covers a bunch of outboards it's expensive. Check out acmeoutboards.com for an inexpensive alternative. The Seloc one that Iboats sells is alright, but not nearly as good as the factory one.<br /><br />I thought the rod bolts were the same as the later ones - sorry about that!

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Not a problem, Paul!<br /><br />I purchased a factory service manual and parts list that is application specific. $76.50. I hope that will do. I didn't think I should worry about the pitting on the journals, since it would be all but impossible for the rod bearing to come in contact with it. Do you think that I should hone the cylinders with one of those "dingle-ball" hones to make the cylinders less "polished"? Probably not, if I use the same rings, right?<br />Best regards!<br />Eric

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Hey, guys.<br /> I got the manual and parts list today. I was wrong about the manual; it isn't model specific. <br /> <br /> I was noticing that the part #s in the list mostly start with "30" and are in a format like this: 304712 .<br /> That's the number for a ring set.<br /><br />Are these part #s going to help me, or do I need to find another source of #s?<br /><br />The manual, on the other hand, is great, and very specific!

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Everbody go on vacation or what?<br /><br />I wanna!

 

[Paul Moir]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

If you re-use your piston rings, I would deglaze the cylinders while it is apart. In other words, just a light honing. It'll bring the compression up a bit as oil will adhere to the cylinder wall better. The object here is to remove as little material as possible. If you replace the rings, then you'll want a thorough honing so the new rings will seat properly.<br /><br />Those are the correct, OEM part numbers. The 18- ones are aftermarket p/ns but they're cross-reference-able. Frankly, I find the easiest way is to abuse the ishopmarine.com website, where you can plug in a part number and it'll offer you various alternatives. Also, that site is good to check to see if a part has been superceded or discontinued. <br />They didn't go to model specific manuals until the early 60s.

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Have you ever bought anything from them? The way you described what to do with the cylinders is exactly as I had imagined doing it, but it's always good to ask, 'specially if one hasn't done this before.<br /><br />I was thinking of ordering through ishopmarine. Is that a good idea, or should I get parts through someone else?

 

[Paul Moir]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

I've never ordered anything from them, and I've only read two reports of people who have - one glowing, the other said they were slow but they got what they ordered. I try to avoid ordering from the US now because it takes such a long time to clear customs.<br />Your local Johnny/Rude dealer should be able to get what they have, as well as other online J/E dealers such as maxrules.com, laingsoutboards.com & theoutboardwizard.bizhosting.com. Usually the local dealer works out best if they're any good at all. Find something small you need, check out the price at ishopmarine, and then go visit the dealer so you can get a good idea of what he's charging you for your business.

 

[racinmason]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Eric,if you're looking for wear(maintenance)parts,or some engine parts,Ive had really fast service from laingsoutboards.com,even tho they're in NY.Another site that has good service is vintageoutboard.com.They're in Spokane,so shipping is quick.You can try Wallace Marine here in GF for newer outboard parts or non specific parts like ignition switches and stuff.But their parts catalog for OMC only goes back to '68.Their eyes kinda glaze over when you start asking about '59's. You could try Missouri River Marine here.I've never dealt with them.

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

I ran into a little problem <br /><br />I couldn't find a head gasket that was a direct cross-reference. The one I found was a 307069. Is that correct? Supposedly it fits '60-'70 40 hp engines, and maybe mine, too. I really don't want a low compression gasket or anything though!

 

[racinmason]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Laingsoutboards.com has a head gasket for a '58-'59 35 horse (with thermostat) for $30.Their part # is 305206.Seems reasonable!

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Oh..yeah. Great! I just scrolled right past it! <br /><br />I found out yesterday the forward gear would cost me $200+ from a dealer that wants list price for everything, only 165 from most online sites. Thats a big difference! Would the lower cost unit be lower quality, or is it just the way dealers operate?

 

[racinmason]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Usually the online places don't have the overhead that dealers have ,so most of the time they're cheaper.Also,the online places can buy in bigger bulk from the manufacturer than even the dealers can,but they also sometimes gouge you on the shipping,so you gotta watch for that.You might wanna do a search on ebay for "Johnson lower unit"<br />I found this one that looks like it would work- johnson lower unit.Also check out this post.Might find some info and parts. http://www.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=28;t=037262

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

I think I'll get it running good before I rebuild the lower unit. It really just needs bearings. The surfaces where the clutch dog mates with the forward gear is worn to the point that it just pops out of gear sometimes. Running good is the first project to finish. <br /><br />I found all the parts I need to get the powerhead back on and spiffed up, just have to get around to ordering them. I just have to decide how much of the parts to order.

 

[tiresmoker]

Re: Low power and slight skipping? 1959 Johnson 35 Super Sea-Horse

Hey guys!<br /><br />Would a '56 evinrude 30 have anything in common with my '59 johnson 35?