Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

[mcbyron]

Hello<br /><br />I have a new Mercury 115 and am seeing a small amount of oil in the water each time it has been changed during the breakin servicing.<br /><br />So farm, there has been a couple of tablespoons of non-emulified water in the oil. Initially the dealer stated that it had something to do with condensation but this does not make sense to me as I have never seen this before and have owned several different outboards (albeit 2 stroke). Other I know with 4 stroke outboards do not expierience similar problems.<br /><br />Mercury has stated that they will analyse the oil in the engine the next time it is changed and that if it is salt water they will deal with it - but if it is fresh (from "condensation" I suppose) they will not do anything.<br /><br />1. has anyone else heard of this problem. if so what was the resolution from Mercury?<br /><br />2. can anyone verfy that the occurrence of fresh condensate water in oil is prevelant in mercury 4-stroke outboards?<br /><br />3. has anyone heard of the same problem with competing lines of 4 stroke outboards such as Honda or Yamaha?<br /><br />Thanks in advance for your input.

 

[hondon]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

Nothing new here.You will get condensate on any engine,no matter 2 or 4 stroke or whatever.The big ? is,how are things working?Any water fouled plugs?Performance difficulties we should know about?Is this engine rigged right and not ingesting water through the exhaust?If you drain this thing cold ,at that huge drain plug ,you are gonna see some BBs of water shooting out at you.It's the nature of the beast.

 

[TUCKER1]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

Here we go again just look under my name under mercury and yamaha forums. I have a 2002 115 4 stroke EFI Mecury (It has alot of Yamaha parts i.e. power head) I have also have a problem with water in my engine oil. Mercury has put a high temp thermostat and a new set of plugs along with a new ECU. It came up to about $1500 it is still under warrenty. I have been told by Mercury that up to a cup full of water is within acceptable parameters. I am currently seeking legal representation. I belive there is a design flaw in the power head on all Merc's and Yama's Power heads 115 4 stroke models. They refuse to replace my motor. I will have my day in court and then see what they will do . Bottom Line is it is not condensation they - Merc and Yamaha have a design flaw in the power head.

 

[DJ]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

I have to agree with hondon. Condensation is perfectly normal in an engine that never reaches 212 degrees F. No way around it. <br /><br />If it's saltwater, that's a different story<br /><br />Take them to court, you'll win but every four stroke you will ever own will do the same thing.<br /><br />Two strokes do it too, it just gets flushed out of the crankcase during the cylinder scavenging process. That is exactly why some outboard makers went away from the 100:1 oil to gas ratio. Crankcase water was rusting internal components. The 100:1 didn't leave enough oil to protect surfaces.

 

[TUCKER1]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

DJ,<br /><br />Explain to me how I can post pictures on this forum I could show eveybody "The Condensation Issue" on Merc and Yama 115 4 strokes. If merc is willing to pay out $1,500 in parts not including labor costs. I think it would be safe to say they know they have a design flaw. I have analyzed this issue quite extensivly. Have had many discussion with Merc warrenty personnel. Mercury said that up to a "cupful" of condensate is acceptable. I think not This is a engine life issue. I have the documentation and and now the legal representation. I paid way to much $$$ to have sombody say a cupful of water is within acceptable parameters..

 

[2springers26]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

first off... a boat motor runs In all types of conditions... shallow warm lakes.. deep cold lakes, cold northern waters in november,, hot temp of the south... condensation is NORMAL On all engines... every time i pull a cover On a I/O the motor is sweating... If it's wet on the out side it's wet On the inside.... same with out boards... cold water causes a motor to run cold... not warm up to temp & make water... just because merc gave you some help does NOT mean they have a problem.. they are tryin to help you.. & keep you off the dealers back.. I deal with this every day.. I've seen merc help On stuff that shouldn't even be considered warrenty.. but they are trying to keep a customer happy.. we have a condensation issue up here to.. we have the great lakes... change your oil & run your boat...

 

[TUCKER1]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

I would have to change the oil every 4 hrs. To get the cup of "Condensation" out. The dealer has been EXCELLENT, I am not on there back just MERCURY'S. It's too bad I have to take them to court but a cup of "Condensation" is not acceptable in my book. "Design a good product and you will keep the consumer happy there 2springer26"

 

[2springers26]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

we sell over 40 yamaha/ mercury 75, 90, & 115 four strokes a year.... My only Condensating motors are of those that run cold water.. do you have a issue... maybe.... Is it codensation or sea water.. there is a diffrence.. sound like you have a water leak.. head gasket, base gasket.. something on that order.. if the base gasket is leaking you'll fill the oil with water with that system.....

 

[sledhead041]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

Ok first of all I want to say I’m sorry if I come off as a ***** but I think you two need to sit down and think about things a little more. Come on tucker1, you are an engineer; you of all people should know that water has some lubricating properties. You have never said actually “how much” water you have in your oil and how long it takes to accumulate this amount of water. I have to fully agree with 2springer26, you are going to have water in the oil system no mater what with a marine engine. This sport doesn’t get the luxury of running the same coolant for hours on end. It’s defiantly not like an automobile that heats it’s coolant to a slightly lower temp then operating temp of the engine. Heck, if they did that to outboards they would be a hundred more pounds then they already are. Let’s face it you change the oil in your truck not because of “dirt” in it but because of the natural breakdown of the oil due to water and acid formation that is a byproduct of combustion. You have not either stated what exactly is the design “flow” with Mercury and Yamaha’s powerheads. I’m sure the court system is going to want to know why theses things are defective? I will also say this that I know personally that Mercury has 5000 gallon test tanks that have engines running in 24\7. There is always someone there monitoring and watching theses engines. They can vary the temp of the water in the tanks from below 32 degrees as if you were a fisherman out getting the last catch of the year to over 90 degrees as you might experience in the reservoirs in the Southwest. I can put money on it that those test beds didn’t care if they had water in there oil and they are the engines that will have four times as many hours on them then any customer engine will ever have on it. Mercury and Yamaha both have to have independent research facilities test the products they produce so if there was truly a design flaw they would of known about it and made changes to adjust for the flaws in the units. Just keep in mind as you follow through with your legalism that when this is all said and done that in the long run have you won? I’m sure you will leave a bitter taste in Mercury’s mouth when your name comes up when you want assistance for repairs after your warranty coverage is over. Like it has been said before on here that outboard companies do A LOT of customer relations gestures for people on things that I would never consider warranty and have clearly been misused. Just my two cents.

 

[Mercury140-I6]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

TUCKER1, (My personal opinion) If you are that unhappy with your Mercury 115, sell it on E-Bay and buy another brand that you will be happier with. All sueing will do is raise the price of these outboards further away from the average boater (Like Me). I chose to go with proven technology and got a 1979 Merc 140 inline 6.<br /><br /> http://www.myfishingpictures.com/showphoto.php?photo=13002&sort=7&thecat=500&password= <br /><br />Craig

 

[TUCKER1]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

Water has some lubricating properties in a petrolum based system ??? I mustbe talking to a Mercury warranty person (MNmarine man). Look all I want is my engine fixed or replaced. It takes approx 4 hrs to get a "Cupful" (approx 6 -12 oz.)of "condensate" in my engine crankcase. I documented with pictures and have sent them to Mercury. They keep telling me that up to a cupful of water / condensate in my engine crankcase is within acceptable conditions that is when I loss all my train of thought. Its a matter of principle at this point. No Mercury140-I6 I don't roll over that easy I am a person with basic principles and high standards. I have asked Mercury to make things right, they so far have not. Any clear thinking person who was to view the phots's I have documented on my engine would say that does not look right.

 

[Mercathode]

Re: Mercury 115 EFI FourStroke Saltwater

Hi Mcbyron<br />I have a 1995 FourWinns 190 with a Volvo/Ford I/O. I have battled moister in this 302 motor from day one. I have found traces of condensation in this motor since I bought it new and now I am nearing 600 hrs and I have had no problems. The oil now turns a rusty red after a few hours so I know that there actual corrision going on inside. But it consumes no oil and still holds good oil pressure. It just never runs hot enought to burn the condensation out. After 9 years it still works...Matter a fact I bought this rig new this week in 1995!