What kind of damage from an I/O in salt water for 2-3 years?

tpenfield said:

Well, we don't know how new the boat is, or the brand of the engine/outdrive. . . which may help.

As for the outdrive . . . I get about 3-4 months out of a set of anodes, then they are ready for the scrap bucket. You mentioned that the boat has been in the water for several years (continuously, I assume). I would doubt that there is much left of the outdrive casing. The transom assembly is probably not much better.

the hull/transom should be OK, if it is a newer boat. If the boat is 20+ years old then the transom may have age-based deterioration.

What attracts you to this boat?

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Thanks for your detailed reply. Yes, I think the boat has continuously been in the water all this time. I also doubt that there's much left of the outdrive, I am 100% replacing the outdrive. What I'm less sure about is the rest of the transom assembly.

The boat is a 1991, so pretty old. What do you mean, age-based deterioration? Do you mean that the transom on 20+ year old boats is basically bad no matter what?

This boat may or may not be the right project for me. I am specifically looking for a project where all of the work is mechanical. I have a couple other IOs and one is a total starcraft rebuild (like, taking it apart and re-riveting the whole thing) so that'll take years, so I'm not ready to do mechanical work on that yet. But I have another IO (that I currently keep in salt, FWIW) and have mostly paid someone else to do the work when something goes wrong. I'm hoping that this boat will have issues that are limited to the outdrive/transom assembly and/or motor and/or electrical, because that's what I would want to learn how to fix. If there are issues with the transom or hull or anything *structural*, I'm honestly just not in a place where I trust myself to fix those safely. So what attracts me to this boat is that I think it MIGHT be a project for exactly the things I would want a project for.... non-structural stuff. Like I would love to spend a year or two redoing the electrical, fixing the motor (so long as it doesn't need a complete replacement), totally replacing the transom assembly and outdrive.... I just don't want to mess with a bad transom or anything structural because I don't feel ready for that yet. I'm hoping that the experts here can help me figure out the likelihood of hull or transom damage, just to get a sense of what's what. Eventually, I'll probably get a survey, but I thougth I could collect more info before I drop a ton of money on a survey or something! Like if the consensus here is "the transom is definitely bad, zero chance a transom survives 3 years in the water" or "if there's zero water in the bilge, that means no water is getting in so the transom is absolutely, definitely fine," that would help me make a really informed decision, if that makes sense.

Thanks

Water in the bilge or not, it may not be a problem, it is very common to have rain water in the bilge because all boat covers leak, it would be pretty rare for it to not leak but if the boat has well placed scuppers, and the deck was built to drain properly, it could be OK.
The rest well this is an old Bayliner, not a bad boat but if the structural members are wood, there is plenty of opportunity for disastrous problems, water and just moisture from condensation gets thru the 'glass and rots the wood inside, you won't know this without a very good inspection by a fiberglass expert. And having done a partial rebuild on my present boat (18 years ago) I would NEVER not EVER do it again. I would rather do engine work, outdrive work, even rebuild a salt water used trailer before I would do any involved fiberglass work again. Nasty, toxic, time consuming, no way. So if you want the boat, pay for a surveyor to look at it or a fiberglass repair person!

'91 Bayliner. I'd run from it.

'91 Bayliner is the operative phrase. If it was fresh water it would be a bad choice.

tabletop said:

And what's the concern if there isn't any water?

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Your being taken for a ride.......none of what you say aligns with the reality of being left in a slip for 2-3 years


A boat sitting in a slip unused or 2-3 years would take a beating.
The glass would be seriously oxidized by the sun.
The hull would be covered in growth.

Is the bottom painted?
If so, that's a whole other ball of wax

The bilge would not be dry.
Bayliner utilizes "sump pumps" to push water overboard from fish and bait wells. they fail, they leak over time.
Bayliner also don't seal rod holders, anchor lockers, hatch covers, etc.
The bilge of my buddies boat was always "wet"

dingbat said:

Your being taken for a ride.......none of what you say aligns with the reality of being left in a slip for 2-3 years


A boat sitting in a slip unused or 2-3 years would take a beating.
The glass would be seriously oxidized by the sun.
The hull would be covered in growth.

Is the bottom painted?
If so, that's a whole other ball of wax

The bilge would not be dry.
Bayliner utilizes "sump pumps" to push water overboard from fish and bait wells. they fail, they leak over time.
Bayliner also don't seal rod holders, anchor lockers, hatch covers, etc.
The bilge of my buddies boat was always "wet"

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I think there has been some miscommunications/assumptions. When I said that the hull is clean, I meant above the waterline. There is significant growth under the water. It looks like mostly some wispy algae, I did not see a of barnacles or other hard things and didn't feel many when I ran my hand under the hull as far as it could go (which was not very far). But there is significant algae growth on the hull, but the hull that's out of the water is in good shape.

It looks like it's been bottom painted at some point, but I don't know what kind of paint or how long ago. But is has the typical grey/green bottom paint on it that is clearly different from the factory fiberglass.

I think the reason why the cockpit and fiberglass still look good an unoxidized and why rain isn't an issue is because it's been stored in a covered marina. The water is salt but there are only a few places sun or rain could get to the boat as there is a solid roof over this whole slip that extends quite a bit beyond the boat. Does that change anything?

Thanks

It does suggest that the gelcoat might not be as oxidized or the vinyl won't be as dried out and cracked as it would normally be but a boat that old, exposed to moisture with wood structural members under the 'glass is ALWAYS SUSPECT. And I'm telling you if you are used to working on an aluminum boat, a 'glass boat is a whole nother world of problems, mostly because the type of construction used has a service life of approx 15 years in a normal climate, in a desert region is stored out of the sun they can last much longer, but just the moisture in the air with the right temperature, is perfect for the growth of microorganisms that literally eat the wood inside, and then, it's a disaster. And when it gets to that point, it is about the most labor intensive thing you've ever done. Dusty, itchy smelly, not good for you stuff, imagine yourself in a full tyvec suit with a 3 M full face shield. For hours. In the heat.

We need actual pictures of the transom and boat in general to suggest anything other than speculation. One person's clean is another's immaculate. Also, where is this boat located? Are there large temperature swings? Is it a northern or a southern boat? The elements have a big impact on the vessel.

The fact that it is a '91 Bayliner is suspect. They were not the best built boats on the market. Personally I would only consider owning a Bayliner that old if I knew all it's history and it was a freshwater boat and kept in a garage or temperature regulated covered storage when not in use (And I would still want to drill test holes and check for rot in the wood).

Sitting in the water and not moving for 2-3 years, I would assume the transom is rotted and also the stringers. I would not be considering this boat unless I was willing to do a FULL restoration.

aspeck said:

We need actual pictures of the transom and boat in general to suggest anything other than speculation. One person's clean is another's immaculate. Also, where is this boat located? Are there large temperature swings? Is it a northern or a southern boat? The elements have a big impact on the vessel.

The fact that it is a '91 Bayliner is suspect. They were not the best built boats on the market. Personally I would only consider owning a Bayliner that old if I knew all it's history and it was a freshwater boat and kept in a garage or temperature regulated covered storage when not in use (And I would still want to drill test holes and check for rot in the wood).

Sitting in the water and not moving for 2-3 years, I would assume the transom is rotted and also the stringers. I would not be considering this boat unless I was willing to do a FULL restoration.

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If it were free the cost of a full restoration would be double what the boat was worth.

Regarding the original question re. 2 years in salt water, a friend of mine had a similar situation, however his boat was 5 years old (bought new) and had lived in fresh water its whole life. It was well cared for. His job made him move to a salt water environment and for the next 4 years he had a constant headache due to parts replacement because of the new salt water dockage.

Bayliner of that era were one of the worst boats ever made.

I wish you well, but if the bat were offered to me for free I would decline.

Yesterday you said the boat isn’t running. Today you say you started it. What changed? I would not have tried to start/run it with 3 year old gas. You may have created more problems.
You say you can’t get it out of the water. How you going to rebuild this project without getting it out of the water? Added expense of buying a trailer?
It’s an old boat, more problems than anyone can ascertain and Bayliner isn’t exactly a top of the line boat. (Nothing wrong with bayliners just saying they are not high end boats.) The boat is 34 years old and stored in saltwater . I’m thinking you could probably buy a fairly new bayliner in good running condition cheaper than what you’ll spend to restore this derelict. Not to mention the thousand plus hours you’ll spend on the project. If you absolutely have to have a project boat get something that you know what you are getting. If it were me I’d walk away this. Actually I’d run from this.

Lou C said:

And having done a partial rebuild on my present boat (18 years ago) I would NEVER not EVER do it again. I would rather do engine work, outdrive work, even rebuild a salt water used trailer before I would do any involved fiberglass work again. Nasty, toxic, time consuming, no way.

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Me and you both!

Sprig said:

Yesterday you said the boat isn’t running. Today you say you started it. What changed? I would not have tried to start/run it with 3 year old gas. You may have created more problems.

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I'm pretty sure that I said that I had a mechanic come look at it this morning? So it got started this morning. Mechanic used fresh gas and piped it right in (bypassing the tank). So.... I guess what changed is that a mechanic came

Sprig said:

You say you can’t get it out of the water. How you going to rebuild this project without getting it out of the water? Added expense of buying a trailer?

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It can come out of the water to rebuild... once I own it, obviously I would have it towed to the nearest launch ramp and trailer it to my property, I just can't do that before I own it because the closest ramp is quite a ways away So my problem is that the PO (understandably) doesn't want me towing to a ramp and pulling it out and possibly towing it back. But I would do that if I were to rebuild it!

Thanks for the questions

Sounds like you are bound and determined to get this boat. So go for it. Give us progress reports and post pics. I wish you good luck and good fortune with the project.

Sprig said:

Sounds like you are bound and determined to get this boat. So go for it. Give us progress reports and post pics. I wish you good luck and good fortune with the project.

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Hm. Respectfully, I see things a little differently... I am, at the moment, pretty neutral—but given my individual goals, budget, risk tolerance, etc. there are certain pieces of information that I need in order to make a fully informed decision.

I think if you read back through the thread, I had pretty specific questions because I was seeking the information that I personally wanted in order to make a decision. Most of the responses I got were some variation of "run away" which is *probably* the right answer for the people who are posting it, but is *not necessarily* the right answer for me So I did what I think is the right thing to do in these situations: I provided additional context and additional information, corrected (reasonable) misconceptions and (understandable) assumptions where I saw them, and am actively trying to make sure I get the information I personally need in order to make the right decision for me.

I don't think that fighting for the specific answers I feel like I need in order to make a good decision is "bound and determined to get this boat." I would say I'm "bound and determined to get the right answer for me and my individual situation" I'm not sure why that is seen as a bad thing on internet forums sometimes, but I'd rather keep asking the questions and get all the information to make the right decision than blindly listen to a blanket answer that, while no doubt well intentioned, might be missing context! I think that's fair, right?

aspeck said:

We need actual pictures of the transom and boat in general to suggest anything other than speculation. One person's clean is another's immaculate. Also, where is this boat located? Are there large temperature swings? Is it a northern or a southern boat? The elements have a big impact on the vessel.

The fact that it is a '91 Bayliner is suspect. They were not the best built boats on the market. Personally I would only consider owning a Bayliner that old if I knew all it's history and it was a freshwater boat and kept in a garage or temperature regulated covered storage when not in use (And I would still want to drill test holes and check for rot in the wood).

Sitting in the water and not moving for 2-3 years, I would assume the transom is rotted and also the stringers. I would not be considering this boat unless I was willing to do a FULL restoration.

Click to expand...

Lou C said:

It does suggest that the gelcoat might not be as oxidized or the vinyl won't be as dried out and cracked as it would normally be but a boat that old, exposed to moisture with wood structural members under the 'glass is ALWAYS SUSPECT. And I'm telling you if you are used to working on an aluminum boat, a 'glass boat is a whole nother world of problems, mostly because the type of construction used has a service life of approx 15 years in a normal climate, in a desert region is stored out of the sun they can last much longer, but just the moisture in the air with the right temperature, is perfect for the growth of microorganisms that literally eat the wood inside, and then, it's a disaster. And when it gets to that point, it is about the most labor intensive thing you've ever done. Dusty, itchy smelly, not good for you stuff, imagine yourself in a full tyvec suit with a 3 M full face shield. For hours. In the heat.

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Hm. Is this a bayliner specific thing, or are all glass boats not great after 15 years or so? That seems... not ideal. Like it's just not worth looking at a glass boat older than about 2010? I feel like there are a lot of 90s, 80s, even 70s boats running around out there. Should I be avoiding most or all of them? Thanks

I'm curious what they want for it now. Might seem a little unreasonable to want much under the circumstances (not willing to have it removed for inspection and that). And I wonder what it's cost them in rent/fees for the time it's just been sitting.

A general observation (in OP's favor), is some people might enjoy working on stuff more than actually using it. I've run across that with motorcycles. Definitely not me (although there's a certain satisfaction in getting your own [basic maintenance/repair...] work done successfully), and the assumption here is probably that boating is the goal : ). Maybe it's not...

tabletop said:

Hm. Is this a bayliner specific thing, or are all glass boats not great after 15 years or so? That seems... not ideal. Like it's just not worth looking at a glass boat older than about 2010? I feel like there are a lot of 90s, 80s, even 70s boats running around out there. Should I be avoiding most or all of them? Thanks

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My boat is mid 80's ,4.2m fibreglass and apart from being covered in dust and cat paw prints its like new hull wise.

tabletop said:

Hm. Is this a bayliner specific thing, or are all glass boats not great after 15 years or so? That seems... not ideal. Like it's just not worth looking at a glass boat older than about 2010? I feel like there are a lot of 90s, 80s, even 70s boats running around out there. Should I be avoiding most or all of them? Thanks

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bayliner build quality was junk in the 80's and 90's. in the early 00's the 25' and smaller bayliners are built in mexico on the same floor as searays

most boats are designed for 15-20 year life expectancy. https://forums.iboats.com/threads/perspective-of-fiberglass-boat-design-life.683703/

service life is a function of maintenance and repair.

tabletop said:

The boat is a 1991, so pretty old. What do you mean, age-based deterioration? Do you mean that the transom on 20+ year old boats is basically bad no matter what?

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pretty much states it right there. consider this to be true until proven otherwise

consider any boat older than 15 years to be a project unless it is proven otherwise. boats built prior to 2010 most likely have wood in them (many still do) its not a bad thing, its a what can the customer afford thing.

consider any bayliner built in the 80's or 90's to need a full restoration unless it has just come out of a documented restoration.

a 1991 bayliner sitting unused in the marina...... dont walk away.....run

I own a mid 90’s fiberglass boat. It is in good condition with no soft spots in floor, stringers, or transom. But it is kept in a temp controlled garage when not in use. Most 20 year old fiberglass boats that are not maintained and kept outside have some rotten wood in them. I would think you are going to have to rebuild the transom, but until you get it out of the water where you can inspect it, it is just high probability, not a fact. Being an early 90’s Bayliner only increases that probability.

At least a 15 minute test ride some at WOT. Then a stop at dock and several restarts.
Might get lucky. Have to be real lucky. Depending where in the country the boat was .docked