140 RUNNING (& DYING & SCREECHING) AGAIN

[SSTKO81]

Hello boys and girls. After a long out of body experience my 140 is back in the hull where it belongs. Had everything realigned and reconnected by a real live boat mechanic and it was probably the easiest $500 I ever spent. Got a new Optima battery yesterday and went to fire it up for the first time since the trial start up on the engine stand. On the stand it worked great. Ran it for about 3-4 minutes, set the timing and shut it back down (as I didn't have water running through it at the time). It sat for about 2 more months before I put it back into the boat, and another 2 months up to this point. So yesterday I started it and it would only run for maybe 10-15 seconds at a time and was accompanied by a horrendous screeching chirp (couldn't tell where it was coming from; maybe the front end?) Checked the oil and it was maybe 1/4 qt low. And actually sounded smooth for that short time other than that terrible chirp. -not a belt screech either in case you're thinking that. Has anyone else had this issue or have any thoughts, ideas, suggestions? Thanks

 

[Fishermark]

With it on the boat you supplied water to it at that time correct?

How's the oil in the outdrive?

Did you check the gimbal bearing when you had the drive off?

 

[SSTKO81]

YES, GOOD AND ITS NEW.
Had the muffs on the outdrive this time. I know water was getting as far up as the inlet hose because it had a little leak (which i'll have to fix).
Oil in the out drive was new 2 seasons ago and hasn't been run since. its not leaking... and when the outdrive was off the gimbal was replaced. The shop I was at was asked to check the new bearing for proper install and operation before putting the new drive on. So the ASSUMPTION is that its in good shape at this point. (though the thought did cross my mind)

 

[Fishermark]

Run it without the belt and see if the sound goes away. Could be a bad circulating pump or alternator. While the belt is off turn the pump and alternator by hand to see if either feels rough or loose.

 

[SSTKO81]

I've gone out and run it without the belt on. -didn't make a difference. I cant keep the motor running for more than 15 seconds at a time, so I cant even adjust time. The noise I'm hearing sounds like a metallic noise and I may even be hearing some knocking. Last thing I did to the engine before putting it back in the boat was replace the front crank seal because it was leaking. -this meant pulling the balancer and then having to press (see dead-blow hammer) it back on. It was suggested by a friend of mine that I may have damaged the thrust washers.
-I've attached a video for your consideration.

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipNU0vaM6B-WoMi0BcFuBl8g9X0IBC4HW5zUnn1-

 

[SSTKO81]

https://goo.gl/photos/Y44G2b2wQ6pLoxVDA

 

[SSTKO81]

back to top

 

[Fishermark]

I watched your video - not sure what to say. How's the fuel? Try running it on the fuel you used when you had it on the stand. The chirping / screech is still there when you run it without the belt? The little puff of smoke from the carb suggests a timing issue to me as well.

 

[SSTKO81]

I watched your video - not sure what to say. How's the fuel? Try running it on the fuel you used when you had it on the stand. The chirping / screech is still there when you run it without the belt? The little puff of smoke from the carb suggests a timing issue to me as well.

I work for Toyota as a service advisor and one of my techs here at the shop had made the same suggestion; and I hadn't considered it.... The fuel in there is probably 2-3 years old. I siphoned about 5 gallons out last fall to run my lawn mower and power washer, but hey, this is no briggs and Stratton. So I will drain the fuel and try again. If it is fuel what causes the noise? Yes, it continues without the drive belt and the timing is definitely wrong, but I cant fix that if I can't keep it running.

 

[Fishermark]

I would suggest getting an outboard motor gas tank and plumbing it to the fuel pump. This is temporary and just eliminates the fuel from the equation. If it runs on the outboard tank with fresh fuel, then you know you have a fuel problem.

You can set the static timing by putting the timing mark where it is supposed to be and making sure your rotor points at #1 cylinder. (Rotate engine till you are on the compression stroke for #1, then watch as the timing mark approaches TDC. Before it gets to TDC it will get to your timing mark - which I don't know for your engine specifically - probably around 8 degrees before top dead center.

 

[SSTKO81]

I'll do this ASAP. I've got only a short window of time to get back on the water this season. I'll empty 2 bottles of champagne to Poseidon if he'll just help me out here. I suppose detonation and bad timing could cause any number of issues. so i'll see how this goes

 

[SSTKO81]

Now that winter is thawing I'm getting back into this. I noticed over the winter when I went out to winterize that I couldn't hardly shift into reverse. Checked my lower shift cable and I cant find where its going back into the hull.... So now I'm thinking, and stay with me here, maybe when I put the engine back in I squished the almost brand new shift cable under the rear mount. This also means that when the lower unit was put on the dog ear may've been misaligned and is possibly keeping the drive engaged even when its not. So I can crank it , but it wont start because of the drag of the bottom end.....
This is all pillow theory. I'll have to pull the whole stinking drive off or cut the shift cable to know for sure. This all sounds like a lot of work...

 

[Grub54891]

I'd get the timing correct before going any further in to it. I think it's firing way to early. test the shift, motor off and try fwd/reverse and turn the prop and see if it locks up properly.

 

[achris]

Could the new harmonic balance be rubbing on the front engine mount?

Chris.........

 

[SSTKO81]

Could the new harmonic balance be rubbing on the front engine mount?

Chris.........

I had considered that. -I cheaped out and kept the old Harmonic balancer. I only put it on as far as needed to line up the pulleys....

As far as timing it is close enough that if its gonna start it will. But ive got to get it running for more than 15 seconds to do it right. I swear it sounds like its a metal on metal drag, but it ran ok when out of the boat.

 

[thumpar]

You could pull the drive off and run it to rule that out completely.

 

[SSTKO81]

You could pull the drive off and run it to rule that out completely.

I think that's going to be my plan.

 

[SSTKO81]

Just an update here. Started to pull the drive off yesterday and found the Lower shift cable way out of adjustment. So I fixed that and have full movement as far as forward and reverse, but its still chirping like a nightmare not while cranking, but once it actually starts trying to run on its own. Tonight I'll dump fresh gas in and see how that goes. Next step after that will be to go ahead and pull the drive.
The words BEARING and COUPLER keep running through my mind and its making me so anxious.....

 

[Rick Stephens]

I gotta agree with thumpar, pull the drive now, stick a cutoff garden hose into the bellhousing water passage hole and fire the motor up alone. There is no purpose in any testing until you test the motor by itself.

On another note, anytime you have a motor out of the boat and are set up to fire it up, it is dog easy to plumb water to it and bench run it long enough to have certitude that the motor is mechanically ready to rock and roll. Tuned, timed and adjusted. Firing it up without water and trying to get everything set in a few minutes is a study in half measures.

 

[SSTKO81]

UPDATE: I pulled the drive off yesterday afternoon and it was a struggle requiring a lot of grunting and a pry bar.... -not a good sign. Found quite a bit of water in the drive bellows even tho it hasn't been in the water. -not sure on that one. Also noticed a little black soot or oil floating on the water. Its been raining a lot lately and but that just doesn't make sense... Anyway. I'll turn the motor over this evening and let you know what happens