1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

[jdeboxtel]

My friend has a '77 Evinrude that screams hooked to a water hose on land in gear and neutral but, when in the water, it stalls when placed in gear. It runs perfect in the water as long as it's not in gear. This started after we rewired the boat and the gear and throttle cables were disconnected and reconnected. The next trip to the lake the motor would only "creep around". We tried to adjust the throttle cable and have had no luck. Now it dies after we try to run it in gear (only when in water, still runs fine out of the water) and won't restart until many minutes later.

 

[Hooty]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

It sounds to me like the engine is only running on two or three cylinders. When a 2 cycle loses a cylinder (or two), it doesn't have that "dead miss" sound a four cycle has. I'd start by looking at the spark plugs of each cylinder and see if there's any difference in any of them. Maybe one is wetter then the rest or a different color. If you can't see any difference in the plugs, start shorting them out, one at a time, until you find one that doesn't make any difference in the way the engine runs. You can also go up to the FAQ which is the subject right above this one on the menu. It'll have some more pointers that'll help you.<br /><br />c/6<br />Hooty

 

[jdeboxtel]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

Thanks Hooty.<br /><br />I have been trying to get him to buy four new plugs. He just bought this boat and the plugs in it are very weird. They are called "high speed" or something like that. They fire all the way around the tip instead of just on the tip. I just talked to him and he said one plug is dark black when he looks at them and the others are a golden color. He is going to go get four new NGK plugs tomorrow so we can rule that out. I don't care for these "high speed" plugs. We will see what happens.

 

[Salty Sal]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

I know most Evinrudes call for Champion plugs.<br />He should also examine the head gasket(s) to see if water is entering a cylinder.(telltale sign is that the plug looks cleaner than the others) Check the compression. An engine will sound ok and run fine until its put in gear (under a load)<br />IT DEFINITELY NOT RUNNING ON ALL CYLINDERS.<br />He should also make sure he is getting a spark<br />to each plug.

 

[Salty Sal]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

My mistake. The fact that one plug is black sounds indicative that there is no spark. Brownish color is normal. I misread the post.<br />I don't think water is the problem.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

You are also indicating symptoms of throttle advance, before timing advance which will also create the same problems you list.<br />And yes, install new QL82C or QL77JC4's at .030-.035. If you still have a wet plug, remove and reinstall the plug in the boot, ground and turn over to check primary spark...If no spark, check that coil wires and sender wires are connected to coils. If this still doesn't help, change coil position and see if problem follows coil. If the same cylinder remains wet (plug) you may have very low or zero compression in that cylinder. If the problem follows the coil, well you have the answer. New plugs may fix it though. <br />With good plugs, and compression, I would be looking for a "DRY" plug, light in color....If this is not the case either, you need to perform a link-n-sync, which is simple to do with a manual at hand. If the throttle opens even .005 before timing advances, it will kill it when put in gear in the water.<br />BTW, the plugs you are reffering to are "Gapless" plugs that foul VERY easily and are made for continuous wide open throttle operation for extended periods..very poor idle charactoristics though.

 

[jdeboxtel]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

Walleye,<br /><br />There is no "wet" plug. There is one plug that is very dark while the rest are a golden brown color.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

That dark plug may indicate lower compression on that cyl.<br />I'd rather hear "Brown" than golden brown but thats better than light tan....<br />I would HIGHLY recommend a compression check on all 4. Not saying compression is the only issue, as I think you have linkage adjustment problems as well. <br />Comp test would answer several questions though.<br />Don't waste time with unknown age plugs either...spend the 10-14 bucks and get a new set...Plugs can, and do cause more false symptoms than you can imagine.<br />Keep us informed!

 

[jdeboxtel]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

Thanks for all the input. The linkage answer makes a lot of sense combined with the spark plugs being designed for high speeds for long periods of time. He was having problems getting the boat to run correctly at low speeds and it wouldn't idle to save it's life. He did try to advance the throttle so it would idle. So, putting all this together...maybe if he puts in the correct plugs and sets the throttle back to where it was, it just may run right. We will see. It's not a great day here today so we are going to try tomorrow when the weather is better.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

The throttle pick-up cam rides on a nylon roller.....in neutral, make sure this roller has about .010 clearance from cam. This allows timing to advance slightly before throttle plates open and is needed to continue running. <br />Also, make sure the idle plates are sync'd by checking to see if they are both closing fully. There is a coupler between the linkages to each carb with a screw in it...loosen this screw and that will allow the spring loaded return to close the throttles. Carefully tighten the screw. The idle timing screw has a jambnut and the screw points to the rear. When you are sure both throttle plates are closed completely, disconnect the throttle cable (from the control box) at the engine. start engine with muffs or in tank, lake etc...RPM on muffs should be in the 900-1000 RPM range and if in the tank or lake, the RPM should be set to 750RPM. When you hook the throttle cable back up, when the pin lines up screw the trunion nut 1/2 more turn to load the throttle to idle and install the cable.<br />To get an understanding of this, a manual is gonna be required to go much farther.

 

[jdeboxtel]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

He put in the new plugs today. The engine still would not idle. He says he had to advance the throttle or it wouldn't run long enough for him to put it in gear to try it out. With this setup, the motor now screams at mid to full throttle. The bottom end spits and sputters a little and, it won't idle hardly at all. He says he has two plugs that are dark and wet after running it. These two cylinders are running from the same carb. He did check the compression on all four cylinders and they check out fine. This is a 140 by the way. Any suggestions?

 

[y not]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

"He says he has two plugs that are dark and wet after running it. These two cylinders are running from the same carb" If thet are as he says the carb is doing its job & getting fuel to them. So get him to swap ignition leads or coils from 2 that are ok to the two that are dark & wet. See if the fault swaps cylinders. Still sounds like lack of spark

 

[walleyehed]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

What did the other 2 plugs look like????

 

[jdeboxtel]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

Just a lighter brown color.

 

[walleyehed]

Re: 1977 Evinrude 140 Stalls in gear (run in neutral)

I'm gonna agree with "Y Not" on the ignition test....the 2 light brown indicate proper ignition/fuel.<br />If this is a 4-coil ignition, check the coil grounds on the questionable cylinders....If those wires are loose, or oxidation has formed under the coil mount, it may have fried the coils..