1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

[vahunter]

I got 1979 19' Sportcraft sportsman with a '79 Johnson 115hp in 2008 that had been sitting for about 3 years probably. I rebuilt the boat and the motor runs but it wont shift. Its not the cable. I can manually shift the lever on the motor to forward and reverse but with the cable adjusted (by thumb screw) in midrange of gears. I can turn it slightly one way and get reverse and adjust it other way and get forward. I did notice the lever at the motor way fairly sloppy and it had a grease fitting but it instantly oozed out of the back. I can shift with the control and if it doesnt go in gear i can wiggle that arm and it engages. It almost seems as if the control box lever is not moving the cable enough but the internals look good so im pretty sure thats not the case.

So im not outboard mech but it seems as if my only culprits may be:

the "clutch dog" being worn(how would i check/fix that)???

Is it possible the shift rod is out of adjustment (how long does it need to be and how do i check that. Pretend that i know nothing about outboards)???

or could it be a worn bushing in the shift lever (where motor end of shift cable attaches)

I have done a lot of online research and have seen a lot of similar cases but i cant find a fix.

I have been rebuilding this boat for over a year and I want to finally enjoy it...haha i havent been able to yet but this seems to be the only thing hold me back


Thank you so much,
Buddy

 

[Rodneys]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

You really need a manual for this. I think you need a special tool to get that out. You can buy a manual here on Iboats.com.

 

[ezeke]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

The shift rod is raised and lowered by turning it. On your motor it needs to be set at 21.834" +/- .036" for a long shaft (20") or 26.834" +/- .036" for the extra long shaft motors. 21.834 is about 21-27/32 if that helps.

The shift rod length is measured with the gearcase in neutral (propeller turns freely), measuring from the mating surface of the gearcase to the center of the hole at the top of the shift rod. The offset should face forward.

You can make a fairly accurate meauring device with a couple of yard sticks and crosspieces. Measure with you most accurate measuring device to the correct length, then attach the crosspiece at the marks. Click the thumbnail, please.

Once you have the shift rod measured, set correctly, and re-attached to the linkage under the carburetor, you will need to set the shift cable.

Remove the spark plugs and disconnect the shift cable from the shift lever at the engine.

Shift the gearcase into reverse using the shift lever only, you may need to turn the propeller. The propeller should turn counter-clockwise when the flywheel is turned clockwise.

Shift the gearcase into forward, you may need to turn the propeller. The propeller should turn clockwise when the flywheel is turned clockwise.

Shift the gearcase into neutral and leave it. The propeller should turn freely.

Now move the remote control arm fully forward and back to neutral and determine that the neutral lock is set by releasing your grip on the handle and trying to move it.

Using the black trunnion wheel at the engine end of the cable, adjust the cable until it will easily slip onto the shift lever without any further adjustment of the cable or the shift lever and reconnect.

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

im sorry but do i take out the shift rod? Im not picturing how i can measure it with it installed. I am a machinist for a living so precise measuring is part of my daily life. Got that part covered.

Do I remove only the little access plate on the side?

Again sorry just want to make sure i understand.

Thanks a lot

Buddy

 

[ezeke]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

You don't remove the shift rod, you just set it to the right length before remounting the gearcase. Turning it clockwise shortens.

You measure from the outer edge of the top of the gearcase (the mating surface where it joins the midsection) to the center of the hole in the top of the shift rod. The measurement needs to be set with the gearcase in neutral.

To remove the gearcase requires disconnecting the shift rod from the top under the carburetors. The screw (a slotted hex) is removed from the starboard side, facing you from the side.

The gearcase is bolted to the midsection with a total of seven bolts to be removed, one being the one holding the trim tab. The trim tab hides a bolt above it so you have to take the trim tab off to get to the last mounting bolt. Be sure to mark the trim tab before removal so that you can replace it as it was.

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

Great instructions! I checked the length and it was within tolerance. So i am still having the same problem. I paid a little more attention to the amount of play from the "cable cradle" bolted to the "shift arm" to the shift rod and with a combination of the slop in the shift rod pin, the bushing for the "shift arm", and the "cable cradle" you can wiggle the cable end 1/4inch. Would that be a problem?

So we knocked of the bad cable possibility, lost gear possibility, cable adjustment wrong and the possibility of the shift rod being the wrong length, what could be the problem?

Could it be the clutch dog? (If its a possible problem, how do i get to it and check it?)

Thanks a lot for your help,
Buddy

 

[iwombat]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

If you can shift it manually, but not with the remote it's your cable, or your remote or both. A worn clutch-dog would show it's symptoms while running.

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

I checked the remote and looks pretty good. Shift lever makes the cable move smooth and nothing looks broken or worn. And theres a brand spanking new cable on it and it operates the same as the old cable

 

[noelm]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

I really hope you find a fix for this, it is very common, I have a pair of Motors now that are starting to show this problem, one is worse and reverse is almost now impossible to select, I have repaired it before (on other motors) by replacing the gears in the control box, but it is not the problem this time, I have a new cable, know how to adjust it, have repaired gearboxes and controls before, but this is tricky, and I have yet to solve the problem. So lets hope some guru has the answer for you (and me)

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

do you think it would be more likely to be the 1/4" of slop in the linkage or more likely to be some thing in the remote

 

[F_R]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

do you think it would be more likely to be the 1/4" of slop in the linkage or more likely to be some thing in the remote

I'd be looking at getting rid any slop wherever it is. Does your remote control require spacers where the cable trunnion is secured in the box?

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

which part is the trunion? And where would the spacers be

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

do you think that OMC designed the shift arm wrong? Because if i move the pivot point of the cable craddle closer to the pivot point of the shift arm it would take less throw of the cable to move the shift rod more though it would take a small bit more effort to throw the shifter. Would that completely solve the problem?

 

[Bsquared]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

I have seen the two O-rings in the shift housing plate on the lower unit ('96) get frozen to the shaft. The rod then doesn't want to move up and down. On mine, you could put enough tension on the rod via the shift cables to either get reverse or forward, but not both, and the lever never really "popped" into gear. New O-rings were a very cheap fix!

In this case, if you can shift the lever by hand, the rod is probably moving freely, and bad o-rings is not the cause. I'm inclined to believe that it's too much free play. Could try drilling a new hole lower on the shift lever arm so the cable attachment gets more throw.

Could also adjust so you always get reverse, then tie a long string to the shift lever so you can pull it at the helm to get forward

 

[ezeke]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

If you have play in the shift cable after adjustment you can try to center the cable connection to adjust for the backlash.

Assure that both the remote and the shift lever are in neutral position and then disconnect the cable;

Pull the casing guide away from the cable trunnion wheel and note the position, then push the casing guide towards the cable trunnion wheel and note the position.

If there is too much play, turn the cable trunnion wheel to center the play so that the casing guide slides on the shift lever without moving the lever or turning the trunnion wheel further and reconnect.

If you find a large amount of play, you may wish to take up the slack by adjusting the cable length within the casing guide; opposing set screws are provided for that purpose, but follow the manual directions carefully or you can easily cut the cable.

Make sure that the warm up lever is in the run position when making any adjustments.

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

Drilled a hole about 1-1/2" lower and it helped a lot but still tries to pop out of gear. So I guess that didnt fix it. This sucks so bad because i cant find a fix and i dont have anymore money to spend on the boat. What could it be?
Would rebuilding the lower unit fix it?
Thanks,
Buddy

 

[noelm]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

pretty tricky this one huh? I still have not been able to fix mine, not too sure drilling holes in the lever is the answer, more just a "cover up" I am still following this in hope, don't think it is cable adjustment, I have done hundreds, it is a funny fault that will take some sorting out or maybe a guru that has seen it before and knows the fix!

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

eventually ill figure it out. Im starting to get a little frustrated but ill fix it. i hope! haha

 

[vahunter]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

Does anyone know how to remove the "shift lever" or "shift arm" (whatever its called?) Im not talking about the shift rod. Im talking about the 'L' Shaped rod that rides in a bushing that connects to the shift cable bracket on one end and the shift rod on the other? I want to go ahead and replace that bushing. Thanks,

Buddy

 

[ezeke]

Re: 1979 115hp shift problem...not the cable??

Please click the thumbnail.

#58 in the diagram is the Shift Lever.

# 60 is a bushing - part # 315101

# 55 is a bushing - part # 312708

loosen # 113 to release the shift lever from # 45, the shift rod lever.