Re: '87 Force 125 tilt and/or trim?
I have a Seloc manual for this motor, it's been of little use here.
I got a chance to get into the wiring today, when I put this in gear, with the motor running, I loose all power to the green and blue wires, (the power lead to the switch looses its 12V feed). I can prevent this loss by removing the micro switch on the shift linkage under the hood, but if I leave it this way, it will not crank if I shut down the motor. I take it that the switch doubles as a neutral safety switch and tilt cutout switch somehow. The wires from the pump head into the main harness inside the hood, they exit the hood and enter through the splashwell out of site. The only wires I can get to at the rear are those actually at the battery, they disappear into the foam below deck and head forward near the steering cable from the battery box. They are not green and blue at the switch, which is on the dash next to the lanyard switch and ignition switch.
I cut and spliced a direct power supply and new, temporary switch at the pump with a fused lead to the battery for power. The tilt motor will run anytime the switch is applied now, but the motor still will not stay up when in gear and running. Even though the pump motor is running. There is no hydraulic action at all when the motor is in forward.
Something I did notice while running it on the ears today, with the motor running, and the motor tilted well off the trim ram in the center, the trim ram is full extended, when I put this in gear, that trim ram retracts as the motor drops to it, it's fully in long before the tilt ram drops.
I'm not sure if this ever had a shock? There is no through shaft like on the one on eBay, the shaft don't go all the way across. I now have two parts motors here, one does the same thing when in gear, but that motor is pretty tired and the pump sounds noisey and both rams are wet, the other it apart, missing the two lines to the rams. The motor in question here has a complete, new old stock pump/motor/housing assembly, and a new old stock tilt ram. The lines also look new, out of stainless steel. The trim ram is also brand new, I have a receipt which lists the following part numbers:
F17563 ($479), FA17559 ($355), F449545-2 ($235), F449010 ($49), FA449015 ($112), FA449149 ($145), F449632 ($42) plus a handful of one to three dollar seals and o rings and a misc. charge of $15 for hardware and fluid. This receipt is from a Mercury dealer about 2 hours north of me, there is also a fuel pump, thermostat, two batteries, and impeller on the same invoice. The total invoice was over $4200 but he also had all new rollers put on the trailer and a new bimini top at the same time. My guess is that after spending all that money, the boat still wasn't right, so he got fed up and bought something else rather than to toss more money into what he saw as an unrepairable problem. This was all done last May, I bought the boat in September, but he apparently had it for sale all summer. I paid less than a quarter of what he had in the repairs for the whole rig, he had originally had it listed at "$2500 needs TLC" with no takers.
I pretty much bought this with the assumption that the motor was junk, he told me it ran but had issues that no one could fix, he said he had gone round and round with the same issues for years, but finally just go too old to take any chances and went out and bought a new boat, (he was over 90 years old). Once I saw it had good compression, I figured I'd see what I could to with it. Its not the prettiest motor but it should be functional.
I was hoping that I would be able to get this going for the remainder of this season but that's not looking good right now. I still need to figure out an intermittent miss which will most likely require new coils I have the wires coated with dielectric grease for the time being. I can steal the coils from the one of my parts motors but I don't suppose the wires are in much better shape since they are all original too.
The only ram that doesn't look as if it were sold whole is the trim ram, I guess that's the place to start. I'll open that up first.
I've rebuilt dozens of OMC brand tilt units over the years with no problems and have dealt with hydraulics for years.
The only parts I don't understand are the three other wires, one goes to the tilt ram, to a single pin stud near the top of the ram, another to a spade connector on the side of the pump housing next to the pressure line, that looks to be a sensor held in with a circlip just like on an early OMC add on tilt and trim unit, and the third, goes to a wire which apparently is attached to the trim cylinder somewhere, I can't see where it goes exactly without removing the ram. The boat does have a trim gauge, which seems to work fine. Its the only standard type gauge on the console. All the rest are those cheap looking Bayliner gauges.
I just can't see how putting the motor in gear can release the trim cylinder even if the motor is not in contact with it? Its retracted well before the trim cylinder drops the motor to the point where it would normally contact that piston.
I believe these pumps may be the same as the early OMC Prestolite pumps that were used on the older dealer add on tilt and trim, if so, I have several new ones here from years gone by.
If I have the motor running, in gear, pump engaged and working, I can here the pump motor gain pressure or slow when I put the motor in neutral. It again speeds up the minute the shifter hits forward. With the pump direct wired, the motor will tilt and trim in reverse, where as before it wouldn't run at all in reverse, and nothing changed in Neutral. As it sits right now, I have a spare trim switch wired at the pump, direct to the battery. It still drops in when put in gear.
I'd swear if I didn't know better, it acts as if there's a hydraulic pressure release solenoid which is activated by the shift lever. It's that exact every time.
I guess if I can find nothing else, I'll have to pull the whole mess apart. I know the pump works, the areas of concern have to be the two rams. Its my guess that the problem pretty much has to be in the trim ram since I take it it can't be electrical.
The motor not running in gear through the factory wiring is one thing, but even that won't drop the hydraulics when the motor is put in gear. The motor by not running can't release pressure from what I can see?
