a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

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axeman1988

Seaman
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
well a little background took my 76 eska out to day on the big lake for the first time. it ran fine on the smaller lower elevation lakes around. but when i got it up there it would not idle to save my life. kept cutting out.its a tecumseh power head, thinking the carb is too but probably not. i have a feeling it is flooding itself out cause if you barely block the air inlet to the carb and i'm talking barely it would sputter and die. it also seemed to miss thinking the oil mix might be to rich i added some gas. still same problem. i'm thinking the carb is out of adjustment and need some information on how to adjust the fuel and air mix. also i'm thinking of pulling the carb and giving it a good cleaning to see if there is anything that could be the culprit for it flooding out. but am currious if i can without replacing any gaskets? or will it be okay with the existing? really any help would be greatly appreciated, cause i'm stumped need some friendly advice and again for any infomation thank you
 
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mrcrabs

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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

axeman there is only so much one can say about re using gaskets...good luck and hope they don't tear taking the carb off.
Now on to your real problem, you only have one adjustment on the 76 model becuase its a emissions carb and that would be your low speed idle adjustment....I have never had a Eska emissions carb that would not run regardless of the idle setting although a very high altitude may be a problem and may require a diffrent jet size, but normally when they flood its rebuild time...now that being said 3 things come to mind regarding flooding....1 sticking float....losen float bowel turn it a little then turn it back and retighten # 2 the viton seat that the float needle closes against is bad and # 3 the fuel pump element is split and you need a new one....so just do a complete rebuild, replace all gaskets and if that don't do it then its altitude so you may try closing the idle adjustment completly shut which depending on model may take some knowlage of how that needle works and is set.
 
A

axeman1988

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Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

thanks alot mrcrabs for the information. well i took it off and it was clean as a whistle really clean the diapham was oka and the gaskets didn't tear, so i put it back together. when i did i took the fuel air mix screw and seated it and turned it 2 and a quarter turns. first was two and it was doing the same thing like at the lake in a tank of water dying under a load. a quarter turn later it was fine adjusted the low speen idel ontop and it was normal, didn't die under load. any suggestions.
 
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mrcrabs

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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

sounds like you have a non emissions carb, what model eska do you have?
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
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Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

its a 1976 sears ted williams model # 217/58631-1 its tecumseh powered. where do i find a rebuild kit for the carb? sears? to better clairify what it was doing when in neutral it would run fine no missing no sputtering or anything of that nature, but when put in to gear forward or reverse, it would miss sputter and die. but when i got it home, i took the carb off, put it back on, seated the screw on the side, which i believe is the fuel air mix, and backed it out 2 and a quarter turns. and it started on first pull, idled fine and when put in gear it didn't miss sputter or die. hope that clairified thanks mrcrabs.
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
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Jul 25, 2011
Messages
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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

well it is similar, but it is not brass it looks like stainless steel, like the oregon float valve and seal set, any suggestions why?? i'm thinking the previous owner may of had the carb rebuilt already, if its the stainless one would that be a safe asumption? or did they come that way from the manufacture, to me it seems they would of used brass not stainless. anyway thanks mrcrabs your a life saver, i think i'm just going to have to take it out again and see what she does, if she does it again i'm going to rebuild the carb.:facepalm:
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
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Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

oh i don't have a carb manuel but i got a blown up diagram of its parts from sears. thats what i use to get by it works better than being in the dark when it comes to tearing into the thing. :)
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
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Jul 25, 2011
Messages
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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

thanks a lot mrcrabs i put an application to join the group, thanks for the e-bay one but my eska's a 15horse, not a 5 , but thats my mistake for not telling you sorry, does that guy have a carb for a 15? probably huh? thanks alot mrcrabs you are a life saver, axeman:D
 
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narwhals

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jun 19, 2011
Messages
154
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

hi axeman, you might try www.discountmarineparts.com for a rebuild kit. i don't know about availability but there parts number for your carb would be DI-52027 rebuild kit.if you have no luck at all finding parts worst case scenario you could try a basic rebuild kit from oregon 49-978 that would have the "bowl gasket, needle and seat, welch plugs and bowl nut gasket". good luck on getting it up and running. you found the right individual in mrcrabs for knowledge on these things.
 
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mrcrabs

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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

Wow how come I got the idea you had a old school viton tiped needle carb??, I don't know how I got this turned around...LOL...you do have an emissions carb and that basic carb on ebay is a carb that can be made to fit your 15 buy changing out shafts, now that being said by all means rebuild that carb you have, but I highly recommend www.certifiedpartscorp.com for parts source since you will spend alot less money for your parts becuase they are the ones who own this whole tecumseh thing to begine with and they supply everybody in the biz including sears and discount and Eskaman ect, ect ect ( call them with your sears part numbers) very frendly and helpful ladys there.......I have a long history of buying goodies from them and there oh so fare when it come to price and shipping, be sure to replace the fuel pump element!! and remove the welch plug and clean the jets...behind that welch plug is your main jetting....I like to untwist some primary ignition wire and after a good 2 day soak in 87 ethanol gas use that wire to clean them jets and use compressed air and blow out ever orface over and over until your a beliver, follow the carb manual although sync is not nessesary for your 15 although timing could be a problem. you will need to turn down a flat punch to set your viton seat....I just chucked up a flat punch in the cordless and used some emory until I got the exact fit.

your adjustment screw is simply a idle adjustment nothing more( just lets more gas in at idle)...intial setting is 1 full turn from soft bottom but altitude and compression plays a big role in that.

PS discount marine will teach you the value of your money....LOL...no disprespect narwals but ask around others have learned that lesson the hard way and so have I 30$ for a set of rings, 10$ for a fuel pump element and your first born for shipping.
 
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narwhals

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Messages
154
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

non taken mr crabs. i get my parts through my friends shop so i usually get parts at cost, as far as shipping i try to piggy back an order so i don't pay for shipping. thats why i recommend small engine shops for the carb rebuild kits as they usually have them in stock and the guts are the same "gaskets needle seat welch plugs".i haven't found a kit with the correct high and low speed jets, but if i come across one i'll post it. i usually clean up the needles with some fine steel wool and replace them, i've got the tecumseh tool that has the pick on one side the set tool on the other and in the middle the float set.that goes into the special tool slot in the tool box. as far as the pump element i get that from cpc although i did find a kit from oregon 49-239 that has the pump element in it and the diaphragms fit my snowblower so i get a 2for1. taking my daughters out on the lake this afternoon so i hope we don't have any problems with the eska, thats what paddles and a trolling motor are for.you might not like small engine shops but i find them a comfortable place of enjoyment.
 
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mrcrabs

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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

i've got the tecumseh tool that has the pick on one side the set tool on the other and in the middle the float set.that goes into the special tool slot in the tool box
Click to expand...

now I'm jealous :cool:




I buy the cheapest stens kits from ebay usally about 2$ free shipping I can find for needle and seat and bowel washer....I use J/E welchy plugs because there exactly the plug size that came stock, thickness wise
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

well i got two issues one i pulled apart the carb last night to find that the fuel screen in the tank failed and my pump sucked up sand silt and bits of mesh screen from the tank that i had no ideal were in there. then i take the fuel pump off the carb to find that it is on the screen to the inlet in the carb, i clean all of that away and clean the carb really good put back together to find that it still does the same thing. i'm thinking is it worth rebuilding if it had sucked up silt into the carb/. if not i'm going to junk it and find a replacement somehow. also another question how does one remove the welch plugs, also does one really need to do that? i hear you only replace if they have a hole, am i'm going to have to due to the silt that may possibly be in the carb?? any information is greatly appreicated thanks to mrcrabs and narwhals you guys are life savers.
 
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narwhals

Petty Officer 2nd Class
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Jun 19, 2011
Messages
154
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

yes a complete rebuild is required, do exactly as mr crabs describeb in an earlier post. removal of welch plugs is easy i do it with a sharpened punch hit at an angle into the welch plug 'going straight in can damage the carb' after you get a good bite on the plug give it a pry and it should pop off for you. the other way is a self tapping sheet metal screw can be screwed into the plug and with a pair of vice grips or pliers it can be removed. follow all of the instructions posted by mr crabs earlier in his post for all cleaning procedures. to reset the welch plug i use a punch about half to 3/4 size of the welch plug and give it a good smack with a hammer, it should flatten out and apply a small amout of clear nail polish around the plug to complete the seal. if you need some part numbers for the screen in the fuel pump i can get back to you in a day or so or if you need a valve flapper, let me know good luck on your rebuild sounds like you need a new tank and hose as well.
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

well guys still having trouble. mrcrabs i tryed to call certifiedpartscorp.com there number is always busy, i've tried at all times of the day 6am to 6pm. also i'm going to upload a picture of my carb so ya'll can take a look and give me some feed back, cause it don't look like any carb i've found for these tecumseh. again thanks for the info guys i'm hoping to get her running before my birthday, its weird i found a list of the tecumseh parts dealers, and none of these guys have ever even seen a tecumseh outboard i'm going to go to a shop near me that says he has a lot of tecumseh parts, plus i think he want's to see it cause he's never seen one before, hoping he has a carb kit that will work, and not the basic, i want a complete. any expaination why the number is always busy, its really frustrating. thanks guys your life savers... axeman
 
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mrcrabs

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Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

1800-356-0777, I just called and talked with Vern (heck of nice guy) I curious about you carb that maybe some one has done a transplant or something??? wierd,

I'm heading out to the lake today to bass fish so I won't be around....grandson and I spent the day fishing for cat on the Ohio yesterday from our big boat....we had 1 10lb channel cat and a 5lb blue cat in the basket and grandpa forgot to pull the fish in before we moved....I fire walled my 70hp looper and thought??? somethings not right....40 mph and I look back and see a empty fish basket flailing about, those cats ripped the bottom release right out of the basket :facepalm:
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

oh wow i'm sorry that sucks major, i had a incident like that the other day when i hooked into a nice 20 inch bow and he spit the hook just as i was going to net him he was a goodin' well i'm going to try and post some pics. but more info i went to a shop and bought a basic rebuild kit for the tecumseh carb new seat, needle bowl gasket and bowl nut gasket. 5 buck so i figure i couldn't go wrong, i assembled everything, and put it on need less to say it seemed to do the same thing so for the past 4 hours i messed with the float level and about 30 mins ago got it to run, it ideled for me, it went into gear and didn't die, and would throtle up to about 4-5 thousand rpm. and it ran for like 20 mins in a big barrel fine, i was runnin 32-1 to in it its all i had i run in my weed eaters,(one of my line trimmers is 15 years old, needless to say rich in oil don't hurt) but i'm still on the quest to get a hold of certified parts corp, i tryed calling again and still busy, i'm callin from my celly maybe my house line will do better.
 
A

axeman1988

Seaman
Joined
Jul 25, 2011
Messages
58
Re: a bad day at the lake! need help!! carb issues info appreciated

View attachment 107558View attachment 107559

these are the pics i could get the first one is the side where the fuel pump is conected its run off of crank case pressure, and has a diaphram inside that pumps the fuel into the carb. the other side has the idel screw. so like i said it doesn't look like the carb thats in the sears diagram for my motor, maybe its a california thing, don't know the guy at the shop i went to works on small engine's ie.. the carb kit, he said he found the part number for the diaphram, wich was 632259a or 631555 he told me to try and get it through certified parts corp if not he might be able to get it through his parts dealer, again i am unable to get in touch with them.
 
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