An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

[EarlyWood]

I resorted to using the hydraulic cylinder/block of wood pressure to remove the upper end after other attempts (wedges, come-along) failed to move it any more than 3/8". Look what happened.



I suppose the retaining ring, laying separately, was between the ripped out piece and the gimble bearing??

Is the hole on top of what used to be retaining the gimble bearing a set screw??

Can I just remove and repair my old transom plate if that is a set screw??


thanks for any replies. I did some searching and have yet to find the gimble bearing being ripped out like this

 

[Bondo Again]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Ayuh,.....

That's 1 Stuck Gimbel Bearing,......
Were Both of those Snap-rings in there,..??

As for the Hole,.....
My WAGuess is,...
Somebodyelse had a bearing stuck in the Housing,+ Drilled it out.....
I've Never seen a Set-Screw there.....

 

[45Auto]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

That's not 2 retaining rings Bondo, it's 1 retaining ring and the piece of aluminum that the retaining ring broke out of the transom when it was being ripped out.

Never seen a set screw there either. Does it go all the way through??

If the "set-screw" hole doesn't go all the way through, you may not have to worry about any repairs on the transom. Don't think Mercury has used a retaining ring on the gimbal bearing in 10 or 15 years? The tight fit in the transom is all that holds them in.

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Ayuh,.....

That's 1 Stuck Gimbel Bearing,......
Were Both of those Snap-rings in there,..??

As for the Hole,.....
My WAGuess is,...
Somebodyelse had a bearing stuck in the Housing,+ Drilled it out.....
I've Never seen a Set-Screw there.....

See, that's the thing..only one of those is a snap ring. The other piece that looks like a snap ring got ripped from it's home. See in the second pic the rough circular tear that would be in front of the gimble bearing?? That other piece that looks like a retaining ring used to be one with that. I'm guessing the retaining ring was behind that lip (that's no longer a lip).
I'm new at this. I'm doing searches but still haven't found anyone who has pulled it out this way. I don't advise it. (however the ram pressure method only took me about 15 minutes to find a block of wood, position it, get in boat trim up and, pop, it was off. This was after about three hours the day before of prying and pulling to no avail. Now what do I do?

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

That's not 2 retaining rings Bondo, it's 1 retaining ring and the piece of aluminum that the retaining ring broke out of the transom when it was being ripped out.

Never seen a set screw there either. Does it go all the way through??

If the "set-screw" hole doesn't go all the way through, you may not have to worry about any repairs on the transom. Don't think Mercury has used a retaining ring on the gimbal bearing in 10 or 15 years? The tight fit in the transom is all that holds them in.

I'm liking the sound of this. I read that also about the retaining ring being dismissed after @'72. Mines a '73 (or maybe not)
I don't know about the screw/ hole...got tired of being in there and just came in to post pics and ask questions.
I hope I don't need to repair/buy transom..

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

45Auto,
I just stuck a wire in the hole..it goes three inches before hitting anything. I'm getting excited about your mention of going without a retainer or repair. Can anyone else verify something like that??

One more question regarding the rubber bellow.. is there supposed to be wire(exposed) keeping that thing in shape?? cause there is and i just want to make sure..there's a loop on one end that kinda sticks up, thought it weird.

 

[jerryjerry05]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

The hole is a passage way into the motor area. It usually gets clogged with grease. It is there to let any oil/water out of the gimbal area. It will leak into the motor compartment to show the owner there is a leak.(bad bellows or seal)
That gimbal when it came off took the snap ring boss off the gimbal housing.
That's the first time I saw that.
To fix it correctly you need to replace the outer transom assymbly.
To use the boat take the old gimbal off and discard replace the new make sure you line up grease holes and J.B.Weld the heck out of it. It might last a day or 5 years.
Some bellows have wire in them some don't. Jerry

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

That's the first time I saw that.

that's really what I meant when saying I haven't found anyone who has pulled it off this way. The hydraulic wood block trick, I picked up here.

if I don't replace and just go for a compression fit, what can go wrong? where can the gimbel bearing go? thanks for humoring me until I see reality, cause I really don't want this to cost me more time and money.

 

[Bondo]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Ayuh,.....

I'd put it back together,.... And Run it.....

The Snap-Ring isn't needed,... That's why it was dropped in later production....

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

I appreciate everyones info. I think I've just heard what I want to here.
Thanks.
Now I have to remove the old bearing from the drive shaft.
Another question. I've read about alignment tools for aligning the gimbel bearing. If this thing is a compression fit, how would it be possible to not be aligned properly when pushing it in?

 

[Bondo]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Now I have to remove the old bearing from the drive shaft

Ayuh,....

4" Grinder,..?? Cuttin' Torches,..??
The condition of the Splines might warrent Replacing the shaft....

I've read about alignment tools for aligning the gimbel bearing. If this thing is a compression fit, how would it be possible to not be aligned properly when pushing it in?

Ayuh,....
The Bearing is Gimbeled in it's housing,...
If your's wasn't so Boned Out, It would swivel in the outer housing....

Bottom line is,....
You Absolutely, Positively Need an Alignment Bar to properly do what you're trying to Do...

 

[45Auto]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

As Bondo says, it's the bearing that's gimbaled. The outer housing (the aluminum piece with the corrugated take-up ring on it) is what's a tight fit into the transom. The whole thing comes as an assembly because the bearings are match-fit to the housings.

You really need an alignment tool or you'll be re-doing your new bearing very shortly. You also need a bearing installation tool that will install the new bearing by driving on the outer housing, NOT the inner bearing race.

You also ought to replace that seal behind the gimbal bearing. It's not looking so hot in your pics!

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Splines? Where are these? I searched the drawings and don't see any splines.
I've been looking at the picture of my removed shaft with bearing stuck to it.
Can I put the new bearing on the shaft just like the old one is stuck and then insert the whole unit? Wouldn't that align the bearing. I don't understand the alignment thing yet.

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

As Bondo says, it's the bearing that's gimbaled. The outer housing (the aluminum piece with the corrugated take-up ring on it) is what's a tight fit into the transom. The whole thing comes as an assembly because the bearings are match-fit to the housings.

You really need an alignment tool or you'll be re-doing your new bearing very shortly. You also need a bearing installation tool that will install the new bearing by driving on the outer housing, NOT the inner bearing race.

You also ought to replace that seal behind the gimbal bearing. It's not looking so hot in your pics!

I was typing and didn't see this. Thanks. I'll start digesting this.

 

[ziggy]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Splines? Where are these? I searched the drawings and don't see any splines.

.... i sure hope that ain't the case... in yer first pic. the part of the drive shaft ya didn't include in the pic is where the splines are.... the splines on the drive shaft fit into the coupler that's bolted to yer engines flywheel. it's the drive line. i hope ya see some splines..

do ya have a service manual. they sure are a big help... especially the oem manual...

as for the install of the gimble brg. and alignment. ya have to do it the proper way. that's installing the brg. and carrier, aligned with the grease hole previously talked about. theres an mercruiser gimble brg. driver tool to do that with. then ya use yer alignment bar to align the gimble(d) brg. to the coupler....

man, that sure looks like the hard way to get yer gimble brg. out. bummer. bet that took some serious force from the trim rams to snap off the boss...... get down man....... agree with others there too. the snap ring is obsolete in later drives and is irrelevant...... sure is nice to have some kinda luck...... and ya didn't even need to purchase nasty big snap ring pliers to remove the snap ring.... right on man... a new snapring removal method....

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

oh, those splines..

so it's the grease hole that makes the alignment thing so critical...i'm gettn the picture

thanks

 

[ziggy]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

the grease hole just needs to be aligned so ya when ya grease it. ya are really greaseing it....
as for alignment... maybe this will help....

http://www.mercstuff.com/alpharemoval.htm

if ya aint' got the service manual...... get it and read away.... mucho info... ya need #1

http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=251571

confirm it's the proper manual by s/n.......

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

You also ought to replace that seal behind the gimbal bearing. It's not looking so hot in your pics!

Do you that because of it's concave shape? It's pretty soft. Is this a big job to replace?

Ziggy, thanks for the links and to Don for doing that. I tried to download but my browser unexpectedly quit about 1/2 way thru.. I'll try again. Apparently I've failed at posting pics since all I see are question marks where the pics used to be, unless logged on and then only the thumbnails are available..

Thanks for all you help. I'll be back with the horror story.

 

[45Auto]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

I can see your pics fine.

New seals aren't concave and don't have those raggedy looking edges!

It's easy to replace, pull the old one with a seal puller or some vise-grips, drive the new one in with the right size drive tool.

Can I put the new bearing on the shaft just like the old one is stuck and then insert the whole unit? Wouldn't that align the bearing. I don't understand the alignment thing yet.

The grease holes must be aligned, but when people talk about "alignment" using the tool they are talking about this:

http://www.outdriveshop.com/engine_alignment.html

The gimbal bearing MUST be aligned with the coupler or you'll either eat your new gimbal bearing (if you're lucky - at least you won't have to pull the engine to replace it) or destroy the coupler. If you lose the coupler you have to pull the motor.

Alignment changes over time as motor mounts and hull sag, etc. Usually good to check it once a year and grease everything up.

DO NOT install your new bearing by driving on the inner race!! Quickest way known to destroy a bearing! Get the correct diameter (on OUTER housing) drive tool so there is no load on the inner race.

If you want it to last get the manual and follow the steps. There's a reason they are there!

 

[EarlyWood]

Re: An Upper end removal failure '73 Mercruiser 120/140

Today, major break getting the stuck gimbal bearing off the drive shaft. That took forever. The drive shaft, at the bearing location (at the two channels..what are they for?), is slightly pitted. No camera at the moment. Running a finger over that location reveals very slight burrs.
I'm ready to move forward but with the tools required and the time, I might see if a mechanic would entertain putting a new gimbal in without the snap ring. Remember, the housing is broken (but a clean break) as seen in the pics above.
I just talked to a mechanic who is concerned that the snap ring kept the bearing in alignment with the grease hole and that the snap ring filled a void or a necessary tolerance. He's concerned the without the snap ring, the bearing might move. Anyone here have experience with the old gimbal vs new gimbal requiring different tolerances?
I know yur all out boating(you guys need a different emoticon)
Who's willing to take a chance on what gimbal bearing I need based on the only serial number found (on the upper end)? #3564850