any theorys??

[ralphl]

26 ft rented sailboat,10 aboard,retractable keel possibly not down, turns over in calm water, no collision, sinks, 2 fatalities. San diego. What could have caused it??

 

[smallboatlover]

Re: any theorys??

ran aground with out knowing. had a small leak that over came the boat.

 

[ralphl]

Re: any theorys??

middle of a harbor deep enough for aircraft carriers, rental sailboat!!

 

[QC]

Re: any theorys??

I'm reading 35 ft. Also saw a pic of her turtled and there is no keel showing at all.

LA Times Article

 

[flashback]

Re: any theorys??

probably riding pretty low with 10 souls aboard, maybe it got swamped by a passing ship, rolled over, if the keel wasn't locked there is a good chance it would sink..my2

 

[ralphl]

Re: any theorys??

facts are few and far between. Latest is none aboard spoke English,needed translaters for the rescue. Maybe they didnt understand how to drop and lock the keel. I heard 26 ft in which case 10 aboard is a definate overload. Rental outfit may have a problem

 

[captmick39]

Re: any theorys??

facts are few and far between. Latest is none aboard spoke English,needed translaters for the rescue. Maybe they didnt understand how to drop and lock the keel. I heard 26 ft in which case 10 aboard is a definate overload. Rental outfit may have a problem

Ya Think?! Most 26' sailing vessels, including those for charter, even configured for day sailing & no cabin are overloaded w/6 adults. It seems like at least 1 person would have been required to speak english, and then again, it's San Diego. Even the charter operator might not speak English. I wouldn't take out 10 people on my 43' LOA Sloop! You'd be bumping in to bodies, Every-Where! As for trying to SAIL, manage Your sails, and SEE where You're going...that's pretty close to impossible w/this many people aboard (even on a vessel the size of mine) as well.

As for what Caused the capsizing, it could have been almost anything, but most likely they were (or were close to) overloaded on weight and were broached. The vessel shouldn't have turtled (tits up) shy of the swing keel retracting and that wouldn't have happened shy of folks clinging to the mast once partially sunk.

My bet is that they didn't have sufficient life jackets either...as it's pretty difficult drowning while wearing one. & then again, if You have TEN Souls aboard, it's pretty difficult to MOVE about with that many bodies, all wearing life jackets, on a 26' (or even a 35') sailboat. If they didn't have sufficient life jackets...charter operator is in (Further) deep chacha. Looks like bareboat charter operators will be paying significantly more for ins. premiums soon;

1 idiot can give the whole industry a bad name, and worse, obviously cost lives.
jmho,
-Mick

 

[captmick39]

Re: any theorys??

PS: after reading the story and watching the video, I don't believe there's any way that's a 35' sailing vessel.
More like 25'.

 

[ralphl]

Re: any theorys??

Latest...........,,Mag 26, water ballast, 10 aboard. Says wind cought jib???????

 

[Bob_VT]

Re: any theorys??

Those boats have a bad reputation in VT as I mentioned two weeks ago in an earlier thread. http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=463168

The operator's manual is on the net for these boats and here is an excerpt

STABILITY.
Unless the water ballast tank is completely full, with 1000 pounds
of water ballast, the sailboat is not self-righting. Without the
water ballast, the boat may not return to an upright position if the
boat is tipped more than 60 degrees, and can capsize like most
non-ballasted sailboats.
The MacGregor is big, but relatively light, and excessive crew
weight can overpower the basic stability of the boat. For this reason, we have placed the restrictions on crew capacity, shown in
the preceeding section.
OPERATING WITHOUT WATER BALLAST.
There may be times when you wish to operate the boat with an
empty ballast tank. For example, when pulling a water skier,
when trying to conserve fuel, when a faster ride is desired, or
when you are in the process of filling the tank. Since only a few
miles per hour are lost with a full tank, we recommend that most
of your use of the boat be with a full tank. If the tank is empty,
carry no more than 4 persons, or 640 pounds.


Here is an accident with the same exact model in VT http://www.ne-ts.com/ar/ar-407capsize.html

 

[okam]

Re: any theorys??

KEEL not down, possibly set jib did not set and caught a wake from power boat sail caught water weight on wrong side of boat.

 

[Wall eye]

Re: any theorys??

not sure

 

[doehunter]

Re: any theorys??

That boat was a charter, not a rental. The "captain" really messed up, I'm sure he's going to be in a lot of legal trouble for a long time.
I have the same boat. It is a Macgregor 26s model. It is 1650 lbs dry, and carries 1200 lbs of water ballast, for a total of 2850 lbs, plus everything that's added to the boat. It's the water ballast that makes it self righting. The keel is a "swing keel". It can pivot up into the hull for shallow water, or trailering. IT DOES NOT LOCK DOWN.
It also does not have any lead weights in the keel. It's only for making the boat track while sailing. I have had 5 adults on my boat in 15-20 mph winds and no issues. I think that is all I'll ever carry because it gets too crowded, but the boat feels like it could do more.
That guy had 10 people on board. DUH!. I saw a picture of the boat from the day before the accident, and it didn't look right. Like it was listing really bad under power and the jib, no main. The charter people say the boat is moored in the water, so it doesn't seem likely that the ballast tank was empty, but the boat could have been taking on water, making it unstable.(one would hope that if they used it a lot they would know it had a ballast tank!)
Under normal circumstances, it takes a couple hundred pounds of down force to hold the mast over to water level. (you can see the video on the net from Macgregor advertising, on U Tube) When released it pops up really fast. It does not turtle. Not even close.
There was definitely something wrong with the boat in addition to being grossly overloaded. If it would not have been full of water, and the ballast tank full, it would have righted itself after everyone fell out, and it didn't.
There is nothing wrong with these boats, and the swing keel and water ballast allow you to do things that fixed keel boats just can't do, like use a standard boat ramp, and go right up to a beach for camping. Not to mention it's a 26 ft boat that you can trailer with a mid size SUV. I pull mine with a Ford Explorer, with a 6 cylinder motor.
Jim