Bad fuel pump? *video*

[71Windsor]

Hey every one. More fuel problems for me.

My 150TXCEM 1989 Johnson 150 v6 vro (disabled) engine last year would draw the primer bulb flat. After countless hours of hunting I have finally solved that problem.

Now this year totally different issue. Went out for the first time today. And it will not draw enough fuel. The ball is going soft but not flat at all. First I thought I had to be getting air some where. So I double checked everything . I just put a brand new racor 320r-01-1 filter and housing on. I however did not prefil the filter befor I installed. I know you have to do this on the diesel trucks but didnt think it was a big deal for my boat seeing how I had no problems drawing the fuel up with the bulb. Came home pulled the fuel line from the carbs and put it into a container. Im getting little to no fuel while cranking the engine over. If I prime it obviously it just runs through and into my container. So fuel is passing through the pump. But when I crank it over It seems like there is very insufficient fuel (a very like trickle)

So summary:
New filter not topped off but appears to be full
Ball primes up very firm but after running a few mins softens
Ball is NOT giong flat so engine is not sucking it dry
If I pump the ball engine runs great
Removed carb fuel line turned over, little to no fuel
Primed ball and fuel passes through carb no problem at all.

Bad fuel pump right?
What is the replacement I need to do away with the vro side of the fuel pump. Its not needed as it has been removed for years now. I have the 150TXCEM model. I know theres a difference between the TX and CL and SL models.

Thank you in advance!

Frank
Pennsville NJ

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Ball doesn't stay hard after priming ... completely normal.

You can check fuel pump output pressure with a pressure gauge. I'm guessing you need to see 3 to 6 psig. Alternately, you can crank the engine over with the output hose disconnected. You should get strong steady pulses of fuel. Anything less and the pump's bad. Make certain to pull the safety lanyard before cranking to make sure the engine can't start and use a remote starter switch.

I've never had to fill separator filters before starting. The engine will fill the housing quickly.

Either of these pumps may work:

Sierra 18-7352 only two hose nipples, in, out, pulse from the back.

Sierra 18-7353 has three hose nipples, one incoming fuel, one outgoing fuel and one for the hose for the pulse.

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Nope. No fuel as its cranking.

I have my answer. Just now need to see where I can get just a fuel pump without vro. any help on that?

and ill have to research some more on making the conversion and what to do with the pulse line and such.

Lots of work ahead of me I suppose.

Thanks for the quick reply!

Frank
Pennsville NJ

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

You may need to make a pump mounting bracket, but that's about it, other than tubing connections. Very simple.

 

[kenmyfam]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Option is 2 of these.
Look up a 1982 150hp V6 here and see for yourself. I use 1 of them on my 140HP V4. It gives way enough for me but I would recommend 2 on a V6 motor. Extra carbs to feed !!!

http://shop2.evinrude.com/Index.aspx?s1=efc0365efcb88e6578bf0a457053cd34&catalog_id=5&siteid=1

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

making a bracket is not a problem at all.

so i pull the pulse line off the pump and plug it. and the rest i can completly remove and plug as well? is this correct?

so what pump would i need to use? all i can find on brp's website is the complete vro2 assembly nothing about a stand alone fuel with with no vro.

any suggestions on years or part #'s i can check into?

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

kenmyfam

i checked that out. it has a upper and lower fuel pump? what your saying is I would need to buy both those sets twice for 4 pumps? or do you mean I will buy 2 of the uppers?

and what powers these pumps? are they electric? im not to certain on how this works. please bear with me.

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Kenny, I seem to remember ready somewhere that the Sierra pumps are good up to 155HP, but my memory may have failed ... wouldn't be the first time! I think Kenny was suggesting using a BRP non mix pump. Either Sierra or BRP should be fine.

http://www.iboats.com/Fuel-Pump-for-Johnson-Evinrude-433386-438555-Sierra/dm/view_id.174138

71Windsor, I think the second choice would be the better one, unless your existing pump bolts to a boss where it picks up vacuum pulses to run. Vacuum pulses are all that drive these pumps.

If you use two pumps, you need to come up with the plumbing to run the pumps in parallel ...
since the OMC parts are NLA, you could use two tees, one for the inlet and one for the outlet of the pumps to manifold them together.

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

and just going to throw this out there. this pump of mine is not serviceable at all or rebuild able is it?

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

ok so the second choice being the sierra 18-7353 pump. i think ill go with that.

i hope you memory serves your right and i only need one.

so the pulse line that i have it actually what drives my pump that i have now.
and the second option has a fuel in fuel out and the third is for the pulse correct?

that makes more sense to me. i get it now. any way to determine is one pump will be enough? could i call sierra and ask them?

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

The fuel side of your pump may be rebuildable. Try here: http://www.maxrules.com/fixomcvro.html/[/url]

This would be a no risk deal if you do have a VRO/VRO2 pump.

 

[ezeke]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

The VRO/OMS pumps are rebuildable on the gasoline side. The oil side of the pump and the electronics for the warning system are not rebuildable.

The conventional lift pumps are not adequate for your engine unless you use two of them.

There is a very powerful VRO look-alike for premix only - part #5007422 - you would only need one of those.

The kits to rebuild the gasoline side of the VRO/OMS pumps contain two part numbers: 0435921 and 0436095.

Instructions for rebuilding may be found on Bill Kelly's site (see "Pump Repair Tips): http://www.maxrules.com/fixomcvro.html

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

thank you ezeke for that information. seems like a very straightforward rebuild. just read through the pages and checked the pictures hes posted. really doesnt seem like much can actually go wrong in there. so i am going to take mine apart and see what it looks like. could it be possible the rubber plunger has gone brittle? any way. im going to take it all apart and see exactly whats going on in there. i wonder if some debris has made it way in and and stopping something from working the way it should. if i see no problems in there and everything looks to be in working order should i reassemble and try it again?

also where can i look those part #'s up who is the manufacturer of them?

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

They're BRP pn's. You already know the pump doesn't work. Taking it apart and reassembling won't fix it. Probably has a hole in the diaphragm, but who knows?

 

[tuscaloosa]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Just completed switch to 2 fuel pump system on 89 model 175. It really is not that hard to do. There should be a place on your intake to mount both of these pumps, just above your vro mounting bracket. Also rebuilt gas side of vro pump on my motor. Be careful if you do this when you tighten the screws on the housing as they are easy to strip.

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump?

Re: Bad fuel pump?

i went and took it apart. and what i found was actually interesting.

1st findings are that this is a very simple machine.
2nd i found a rather large piece of plastic in there. i checked every inch of that pump and cant seem to locate where it came from. so my guess would be when i broke the fuel inlet elbow a few years back a piece went up and not down. who know. but its not from the pump.
3rd the large rubber washer has a nick taken out of it. very small on the edge. i took pictures of both items.

and lastly i shot a short video to show the flow that im now getting through the pump which is indeed more than i had before. but still seems like not enough. please view the video and let me know what you think.

thanks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTmbF1bNcTo

 

[wilde1j]

Re: Bad fuel pump? *video*

That's not much fuel.

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump? *video*

what about the line to the crank case there is a pulse limiter in the middle what does that do and can it in theory go bad?

 

[71Windsor]

Re: Bad fuel pump? *video*

tuscaloosa you said you rebuilt your pump. how did it go? what did you pay for the kits? im assuming it didnt work since you did the two sierra pump setup

 

[ezeke]

Re: Bad fuel pump? *video*

If it's the black pulse limiter it should have been replaced with one that is blue and gold. If it's blue and gold, clean it and test it. It should close under quick higher pressure to prevent damage to the pump membrane.

List price for the VRO two part rebuild kit is around $100. US Total; On-line discounters sell them for a little less