benefit of bolt on finns on motor

amitropo

Cadet
Joined
Jan 19, 2004
Messages
24
Hi, can anyone please explain what the advantage of installing motor fins are ?. I have a 15ft fibreglass half cabin with a mercury 45hp classic 50. Will it make a difference ?......
 

stauter99

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Jan 20, 2003
Messages
130
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

It makes your boat plane faster and stay on plane at lower RPMs. it supposedly helps fuel consumption. I have one on my 25 yamaha and it helps the first two issues mentioned above.
 

cjflanagan

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 1, 2003
Messages
168
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

Hi,<br />I have a Glastron Futura 227 SL. With fuel it weighs the happy side of 2900 lbs. When I bought the boat it had one of those hydro fins on. I tend to have great appreciation for simplicity, so I took it off, figured it was just for looks. Bad idea, even with a powerful 7.4 liter V8 and proper trim, all I could see was sky before me, and a huge wake behind me. It was pretty much dangerous without it, the difference was huge.
 

KeltonKrew

Lieutenant
Joined
Jul 31, 2002
Messages
1,325
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

Do a search on smart tabs....iBoats sells them too....<br /><br />Don't limit yourself to the fins on your outboard!
 

cobra 3.0

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jul 31, 2003
Messages
1,797
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I use a hydrafoil too. Yes they work and no it doesn't save any gas...unless your setup was a real mess in the first place (wrong pitch prop, wrong motor angle, etc.)
 

JasonB

Lieutenant
Joined
Feb 10, 2003
Messages
1,455
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I use the fins on my 15' tri-hull with an 85hp with great success. Dramatically reduces time to plane, planing speed, and keeps the boat from sliding out in a turn. I tried them on my 19' stern drive with v8 and took the off after the second run. Didn't have a positive effect. FOr that boat I ended up with a set of smart tabs. Much better for that hull.
 

ThomWV

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Dec 19, 2003
Messages
701
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

The last two posts are very good.<br /><br />Here's what I've generally noticed, they work pretty good for boats up to about 20 feet (better with smaller boats) but after 20 they are basically worthless. That is just a general statement though.<br /><br />A couple of things about them, and this is about outboard applications, not I/O's. First off its pretty obvious they don't do anything unless the boat is moving. What is not so intuitively obvious is that they don't do anything at all when the boat is up on plane or if they are doing anything its not something good. <br /><br />The reason I say that is that if an outboard is properly mounted its cavitation plate will be right at the water's surface or slightly above it when up on plane. So at that time the fin is out of the water. If its out of the water its not doing a thing. That should be pretty obvious. So, in the alternative, if the engine is mounted to low, then if the fin is in the water its adding extra drag. That extra drag will cost you fuel economy and at the same time it absolutly has to slow you down. There goes the myth that a fin will either increase your speed or improve fuel economy. Neighter is true.<br /><br />So what are they any good for? Well they effectively vector thrust. Huh? It means that at lower speeds where they are quite properly submerged they will all your trim to work better. That can be helpful for maintaining plane at a lower speed (but not by much at all) and it can help you force the bow down at low speed in a chop so you don't get beat quite as badly. What it will absolutly never do for you is improve fuel economy.<br /><br />Thom
 

deofc

Seaman
Joined
Nov 8, 2003
Messages
61
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I have them on my 15 !/2 tri hull 70 HP. They allow the boat to plane at slower speeds (like several other posters say). Before I installed them the boat would not plane at all at slow speeds -- I had to stand up to see over the bow. With them I can run at slower speeds the boat planes out better as speed increases.
 

Jdeagro

iboats.com Partner
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
1,682
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

This is from another post but applicable!<br />I am assuming that your first goal is to get the boat on plane easier, and stay there at slower speeds. Any time you add more planing surface to the hull it will plane sooner. However, please understand that the surface area of the additon (trim tabs or hydrofoil) needs to be in proportion to the size of the boat. Small boat small tabs. Big boats ig tabs. In most cases the hydrofoils are not large enough to give the best results, although they will give some results, which may depend on the balance of the boat. If the boat is only a little out of balance then the hydrofoil will seem to be very effective, but if it is a good deal out of balance then the results will be less effective at slower speeds.<br /><br />More importantly the hydrofoil lifts the boat by the engine, and from the center. Lifting from the engine adds stress to the cavitation plate, motor mounts, and mounting hardware. Lifting the boat from the center creates port to starboard handling problems at higher speeds, especially on V bottom boats.<br /><br />Additionally any fixed trim device, (hydrofoils, fixed plates, hooks in the hull, etc) will provide some lift at slower speeds, but continue at an increasing rate to provide more and more lift as the boat speed increases(even after planing). This is why most hydrofoil users will say the low end performance is better but "they create drag" at higher speeds and slow the boat. I would like to agree and disagree with this "Drag issue".<br /><br />What realy happens is that the extra lift on the stern also rotates the bow down, and in this position the boat is not at an efficient running angle (too much boat in the water). If you have electric tilt trim on the motor, you adjust the trim to raise the bow. This means that you are using the prop to adjust the attitude of the boat. This is not the job of the propeller, it should be left alone to simply propell. If the prop is running through the water at an angle to lift provide lift to the bow ( insted of perpendicular to the water) the prop thrust is not at its max effeciency. Results - Slower boat, Waisted Fuel, Poor handling especially in turns.<br /><br />If the boat is drastically under power and has a top speed of less than 25 mph, you may not see some of these problems, since the excessive lift only occurs as the boat inceases in speed.<br /><br />The most effective thing you can do to increase the boats performance is to have a variable hull design, so that the changing conditions can be compensated for by a changing hull design. For example,if on Sat. you wish to ski, then change the boat into a ski boat, and on Sun. you wish to hall 5000 Lbs. of rocks over to the breakwall change the boat to a barge. A little bit radical, but adjustable tim tabs simply chang the hull design to make the boat perform better, over a larger variety of conditions. <br /><br />Nothing will do the job better. Given the size of your boat , your best solution is Smart Tabs (either ST980-40 or ST1290-60 depending on the Hp of the motor). Do a search on this site to see what others are saying about Smart Tabs.
 

andrewkafp

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 15, 2003
Messages
1,668
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

have a 14 ft Halfcab and a 50hp Merc. The reason for the tail was to control the direction of the boat at low speeds. It solved that problem.<br />Seems to have taken up that delay, when you turn the wheel.<br />Noticed NO difference in any speed or ride capabilities..<br /><br />Nothing ventured.. nothing gained.. <br /> :D
 

Jdeagro

iboats.com Partner
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
1,682
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

uNIcorn;<br /><br />How slow was the sloppy stering giving you the problem? Where you on plane yet?
 

andrewkafp

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Mar 15, 2003
Messages
1,668
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

Fairly new to boating (1 year).. but leaving the ramp and going at 5 knots, it was like there was play in the steering. (But it's spot on tight).<br />I learnt that boats are not like cars, and have a small delay in the steering when going slow. I really couldn't tell you about planing.. as I really don't know whether it planes or not.But, it did around 30 knots WOT before and still does, but I now notice that when I steer at slow speed, it reacts instantly which makes it easier the bring in to the jetty. It is purely a fishing boat and speed is not an issue with me.
 

Solittle

Fleet Admiral
Joined
Apr 28, 2002
Messages
7,518
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I have a them on my 23' CC with twin OMC V4s & they work fine for me.
 

Ralph 123

Captain
Joined
Jun 24, 2003
Messages
3,983
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I have them on my 28' Formula w/ twin 350s and Alpha 1s. They made in enormous difference. I pop right out of the hole now and plane at a much lower speed. I also have tabs but the tabs do not provide the difference in performance that the hydros do for me. Here is what Davis says Doel-fins, the ones I use, will do for you:<br /><br />
Doel-Fin is the original hydrofoil developed by an aeronautical engineer to improve overall performance on all boats with outboard motors or outdrive units. Molded in two pieces of guaranteed unbreakable, high-strength plastic, each foil is designed to flex independently to absorb shock. The positive effects include greater stability, consistent planing at lower RPM, faster out-of-the hole performance, steadier turns, higher top-end speeds and lower bow rise at all speeds.
To me, it makes sense to try a hydrofoil for less than $50 and see it works for you. If it doesn't take it off and try tabs. I like to start with the easiest & cheapest solution first and work my way to the harder ones.
 

MarkAB

Seaman Apprentice
Joined
Dec 30, 2003
Messages
47
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

The debate hydrofoil vs smart tabs is an interesting one with most opinions that tab's are the answer. I have a 10ft tri hull and initially had a 8hp yamaha which did not plane. After numerous posts, advice and experimentation, I went for the cheaper option and invested in a hydrofoil. The change was immeadiate and the boat got out of the hole. I upgraded to a 25hp and the first run out scared me badly. The boat was unstable and handled badly. I took the hydrofoil off the 8 and put it on the 25. I was most impressed with the change in handling. Granted, I lost some top end but the trade off was worth it. I suggest that if your pocket can handle it, go the smart tab route. If not, I'm sure the cheaper hydrofoil will be worth it.
 

Jdeagro

iboats.com Partner
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
1,682
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

Hi Ralph;<br /><br />If I remember correctly you have Hydraulic trim tabs on your boat, which you do not use very much.<br />I can understand that they take some "getting use to" but even in the horizontal position you have extended the running surface of the hull. By adding the fins to the motor, you have added more running surface and lift to the hull. This may have been just enough to push you over the performance edge during acceleration to plane, making it more noticable. However this tells me that your plates (Trim tabs) are too small for the boat ( they are probably 12" x 9" or smaller) and chosen because the twin engines did not allow for wider plates. If this was a factory set up, they took the cheep way out. What you should have is either wider or longer plates to gain the additional surface area.<br /><br />The hydrofoil is not a new concept (and neither are Trim Tabs), and even used on large military vessels, but when the manufacturer (quote) talks about the fact that the two piece design reduces "stress" it should indicate that it is a concern. Many cavitaton plates have been cracked because of these stresses. These things lift the boat by the motor (s) and not the hull. This is not going to help the the longevity of the motor mounts, bracketry, etc. <br /><br />We may always disagree on this issue, but please understand that I do appreciate the opportunity to chat. By the way we do not make Smart Tabs for boats above 22' so your 28' is not a candidate even in my opinion.<br /><br />Again Thanks!
 

keelhauled

Petty Officer 2nd Class
Joined
Oct 5, 2003
Messages
172
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

Are the stories I have heard about hydrofoils breaking cases/cavitation plates true? A friend gave me a stingray hydrofoil, but I filed it into the back of the closet for fear I'd be asking for trouble.<br /><br />Thoughts?
 

cobra 3.0

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Jul 31, 2003
Messages
1,797
Re: benefit of bolt on finns on motor

I have a Stingray hydrofoil on my boat. It hasn't broken anything. There are thousands of these out there being used. If they were anything near as bad as what you think they are, would so many of them be in use?
 
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