Braking while in reverse...

[64osby]

When on Ice or packed snow if I brake while in reverse the front end get pulled all over the place. No control unless the vehicle is put in neutral.

Happens with both RWD vehicles I have. Is this telling me the rear brake adjusters might not be working or something else?

 

[Scott Danforth]

or you have the wrong tires for snow.

 

[tpenfield]

My take is that the front wheels are locking up, as they are pretty much free to do so. The braking action on the rear wheels are off set to some extent by the force of the engine turning those wheels. Additionally, much of the braking ability is typically on the front wheels.

 

[64osby]

Tires are M&S on both, Goodyear and Michelin.

Typically "they" say front to back is 70/30 for the brakes.

I'm just wondering if maybe these rears are so low as to not engage enough brake to slow or stop the rear wheels from spinning while in reverse.

 

[Tnstratofam]

Could be that your rear brakes aren't engaging. I grew up driving stick shifts so when I got my first automatic I learned real quick to put the car in neutral when I'm sliding for control. At this point I think It's almost something I don't even realize I'm doing. It has become part of my driving habit in bad weather.

 

[Bondo]

Tires are M&S on both, Goodyear and Michelin.

Typically "they" say front to back is 70/30 for the brakes.

I'm just wondering if maybe these rears are so low as to not engage enough brake to slow or stop the rear wheels from spinning while in reverse.

Ayuh,... If yer brakes work properly in Forward, it's yer drivin' habits, not the brakes, in reverse,....

As noted, kick it into neutral,....

 

[Tnstratofam]

Something else that just dawned on me. Do your vehicles have rear anti lock brakes? That could be why your fronts are grabbing sooner.

 

[dwco5051]

This can also happen in a RWD while going forward on ice. The reason it shows up more in reverse on vehicles with drum rear brakes that they are not self energizing when backing up. I have seen reports of several parking lot mishaps that occured when the front tires are locked up but the rears are still moving the car.

 

[nwcove]

M&S tires are not necessarily " snow " tires ...and there is no such thing as a true all season tire for areas that have winter. if they dont have the snowflake or possibly the mountain stamps on em.....they are not winter tires....just three season tires. true winter tires may not solve yer problem, but they absolutely make a HUGE difference on ice and snow.

 

[Scott Danforth]

M&S tires are not necessarily " snow " tires ...and there is no such thing as a true all season tire for areas that have winter. if they dont have the snowflake or possibly the mountain stamps on em.....they are not winter tires....just three season tires. true winter tires may not solve yer problem, but they absolutely make a HUGE difference on ice and snow.

Exactly

If it doesnt show this symbol, it is NOT a snow tire

 

[64osby]

Could be that your rear brakes aren't engaging.......

They work but I wonder if they are not adjusted properly ( need to engage sooner). I know the neutral trick as mentioned in my first post.

 

[64osby]

Ayuh,... If yer brakes work properly in Forward, it's yer drivin' habits, not the brakes, in reverse,....

As noted, kick it into neutral,....

The problem is not my driving habits. I know about neutral as mentioned in my first post. I'm thinking the rear brakes are not self adjusting and therefore when in reverse the fronts engage but the rears don't, or not enough to allow control

I'm trying to figure out the issue so my wife and 16 year old daughter can back up on ice without having an accident of going in the ditch.

 

[64osby]

This can also happen in a RWD while going forward on ice. The reason it shows up more in reverse on vehicles with drum rear brakes that they are not self energizing when backing up. I have seen reports of several parking lot mishaps that occured when the front tires are locked up but the rears are still moving the car.

This is what happens while in reverse. Both vehicles are rear drum.

What reports?

 

[64osby]

I do put snow tires on my wife's car.

 

[dwco5051]

This is what happens while in reverse. Both vehicles are rear drum.

What reports?

In my previous life I had access to such accident reports. they weren't a published thing. Now the local PD will not do a report unless one of the vehicles is not drivable. However our local newspaper did have an article on this type of accicent during an extra icy winter. Most are minor fender benders or scrapes. My best source came from my wife who used to have a mint mid-60's shelby mustang. She still tells the kids about her thrill ride in the local market lot one winter when she was backing out from between two parked cars with no steering and somehow missed both cars.

 

[dwco5051]

This also explains why you have to set your parking brake tighter when your headlight are pointing uphill. (Maybe on a launch ramp)

 

[no704]

Drum brakes are made to work going foreward. I have a 1959 Dodge that had continus contact drums on the front, no idea how it was never wreaked f'ing death trap. Replaced with disks and got rear ended. Go figure?

 

[Tim Frank]

Are you running 4-wheel snows?

 

[rbh]

It is a natural problem, front brakes engage harder than back brakes (70% front to 30% back??+-) so you are going to lock up the fronts in slick conditions.

Find a iced up parking lot, do a straight run backwards and apply the brakes, then do the same run with the wheels turned 1-2 degrees.
It does not take much to get the vehicle to slip over one way or the other.

 

[64osby]

It is a natural problem, front brakes engage harder than back brakes (70% front to 30% back??+-) so you are going to lock up the fronts in slick conditions.

Find a iced up parking lot, do a straight run backwards and apply the brakes, then do the same run with the wheels turned 1-2 degrees.
It does not take much to get the vehicle to slip over one way or the other.

So based on this it is just something that can't be changed and deal with it.