Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
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15
Sorry for the long winded prelude. I have a 1992 Chappral with the Yamaha 4.3L. Before taking on first trip this summer, I replaced plugs, plug wires, distributor cap and button, coil, coil wire, fuel water seperator, and oil filter and oil. Did not check my timing which I believe may be the problem. Beging of season's first trip, the boat ran better than it ever has. After about two hours on the water, the tach dropped from 4,600 to about 4,000. I dropped back to idol and could hear a definate skip. I continued on our way, hoping maybe a it would clear it self out. After another five minutes it dropped again from 4,000 down to 3,300 and the boat stopped plaining. Relizing I had a definate problem, we headed back to the dock. 3 min. later the motor quit completly as if the key had been turned off. .....Back at the house, I removed the sparkplugs and found the ends complely melted off of 1 2 and 3. I did a compression check and the results were as follows,<br />cly. <br />1 0 psi<br />2 10 psi<br />3 15 psi<br />4 120 psi<br />5 118 psi<br />6 was so pissed off didn't bother.<br />I removed the heads and found the intake valves collapsed on 1 2 and 3 and starting to on 4 5 and 6. I talked to my dealership and had them examine the motor for a cause. They said the 4 possible causes for detination are: timming off, running rich, clogged exhaust system and running hot. According to the temp guage it was running between 140 and 160 (and it is working). What confuses me, and them, is how it went that wrong in less then 2 hours of run time (and part of the time was spent swimming and just idoling around). I checked my exhaust manifolds and there is some build up in them but they are still pretty open. No rust, just gunk buildup. There was also very little if any carbon build up in the cylinders. I plan to rebuild the motor myself, but want to find and fix the problem, not just the effects. Any input is appreciated!!
 

I/O WALDO

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Nov 16, 2005
Messages
320
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

How long were you runnin at 4600 rpm?Heavy load? Lean,heavy load can suck valves,(don't know bout rich).Advanced timing can also cause high combustion temp./detonation,without high coolant temp.
 

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
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15
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

Were we wakeboarding with 4 people in the boat for about 30 or 45 min. while waiting on some other people to get there. So yes there was a load. Your right lean, not rich. I plan to have the heads rebuilt, rebuild the carb, have the manifolds and risers washed in this high pressure acid bath machine we have at work, drop to a cooler plug and double check the timming. I think that should cover all my bases. I just want to double check any other possibilities.
 

ron7000

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Jul 10, 2004
Messages
498
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

what spark plugs did you use?<br />melted spark plugs means excessive heat in the cylinders, which can be caused by a few things if not improper heat range plug- lean fuel mixture by out of tune carb or a vacuum leak, too much timing advance, wrong type fuel or additives in the fuel, and also by running the sh1t out of the engine. If you routinely run the motor at 4600 rpm, or wide open, for extended periods of time you may have just exceeded the life and limits of the valvetrain- the boats a 1992 what has the maintenance history been? By collapsed valve, do you mean collapsed lifter? Or broken valvespring? How is your oil pressure at and idle of 600-1000 rpm after running 3000+ rpms for a while? What oil brand and viscosity do you run?<br /><br />Running at high rpms like you mentioned, it wouldn't take long for many things to go wrong and if not caught quickly to cause engine damage. 2 hours I think is quite a while.<br />If your thinking of doing the rebuilding yourself, and want to run the engine at 4000+ rpms a lot, look into better valvetrain parts: fulcrum roller rockers, better valvesprings and lifters and pushrods. A phone call to crane or comp cams would be a good idea.
 

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
Messages
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Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

I unfortunately don't know the maintenance history. I bought the boat from a dealer begining of last season. They did the oil change and tune up before I bought it, and then I did it again this season before I blew it up. The plug I used was an ACDelco .R44TS. Collapsed valve was the term the dealer used when they looked at it. The bottom of the valve (the end in the cylinder) is dish shapped when you run your finger across it. You also mentioned fuel additive... I did put a can of sea foam in the tank to help clean out the carb. 1 can was mixed with I believe 30gal. of gas. And the station I went to started using 10%Ethanol mix. Is it possible the sea foam and Ethanol played a part???
 

I/O WALDO

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Messages
320
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

Sounds lean to me.Carb?Fuel quality?Maybe Mr.Tune-Up set the timing too high.
 

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
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Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

Easy now!! I am the Mr. Tune-up on this boat.
 

calwldlif

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Aug 16, 2002
Messages
348
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

Sorry to see your motor died.<br /><br />"the boat ran better than it ever has"<br />More than 1 person has said that,<br />usually right before it breaks.<br /><br />It looks like only 1 bank melted. #1,#2,#3 cyl<br />or is it #1,#3,#5 cyl.<br />1 head in other words. <br />thats curious but makes sense if 1 side of you carb was plugged, jetted different, water didn't<br />flow well.<br /><br />Is 4600rpm the low max wot? That would be the <br />"lugging" side of the rpm curve. This will<br />contribute to possible "detonation"<br /><br />Fuel additives, Low octane gas, lugging rpms, possible carb lean condition, timing, possible water flow problem through head<br />Having too much fun:)<br />can and do add up to failure.<br /><br />Is the dealer helping? are they going to<br />inspect and determine cause?<br />Will they makes changes or upgrade when<br />repairing. <br />Hope you figure it out.<br />Please post back when you do,<br />Good luck
 

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
Messages
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Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

It is both banks. 1 and 3 is on the left side and 2 is on the right (If looking at the front of the motor. The dealer isn't doing any work, just using them for parts and advice.
 

calwldlif

Petty Officer 1st Class
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Aug 16, 2002
Messages
348
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

OK I see now.<br />I forgot how intake manifolds<br />crossover for even vacuum.<br />Check you runners and see if they<br />share a common side of the carb.
 

Nappy426

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Mar 29, 2006
Messages
15
Re: Causes of Collapsed Valves (Intake)

The dealer and I looked at that, and they do share the same side. I plan to get a rebuild kit and just clean and rebuild the whole carb to get rid of any questions in that area.
 
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