cracked engine, needs replacement

[santa666]

I have a freeze cracked (OMC)307 I'd to replace with a rebuilt (MARINE) 350 from someone like JASPER, etc... How hard a job is this? <br /><br />#1 I have been told the (new rebuilt) 350 engine(s) will fit the old style OMC stringer mounts and the OMC 800 drive perfectly- thoughts? I see where the engine mounts to what looks like 2 bolts L, R, and 2 L,R on the back. Does the drive shaft assembly just slide into the splines of the drive shaft coupling (OMC PART 314683)? I hope the headers, starter, balancer, flywheel, water pump, oil pump, intake manifold, etc fit too...<br /><br />#2 what is the MAX H.P. these 800 drives take. Here's why: I can buy an engine with anywhere from 230 to 400 H.P. and want a good running and RELIABLE rig. My rig was 215 H.P. and fair, not great, making 27 MPH @3000 RPM W/3500# boat. I'm thinking a MARINE 350 W/270 H.P. @ around $1500.00 (to my door) is as good a deal I'll get in Chicago. My (hired) labor cost looks like about $600-$800<br /><br />has anyone has any experience with these?<br /><br />P.S. the rest of the boat is in A+++ shape, so I won't be switching.

 

[bluewater19]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

I know that the 307 and 350 interchange so it should not be a problem getting it to fit in your boat. I do not know about the out drive though. I imagine that you wont have any problems with that small of a power increase. You might have to change your prop to one with a litlle more pitch though.

 

[CCrew]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Dunno about the stringers, but the Cobra's use a different gear set in the O/D with a 350 because the powerband is different. <br /><br />Other than that, Small Block Chevy is small Block Chevy, bellhousing pattern hasn't ever changed, everthing bolts up the same, but rear crank flange you have to make sure is the same.. There were some differences in the 1 pc vs 2pc rear main seal block cranks. <br /><br />Mine started life with a 305, and has a 350 now. I didn't own it w the 305, and even with the 350 (260hp) and the 305's gearing (21/17) and a 19P prop it's a 50mph boat. <br /><br />-Roger

 

[Walt T]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Personally I would be reluctant to put any money into a boat with a stringer drive.

 

[Boomyal]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

I beg to differ re the OMC 800 outdrive. The local outdrive guru has no trouble getting parts for them and from what I've seen, on this forum, they are a lot less trouble than the mercs and cobras. That includes my 24 y/o 800 stringer.

 

[rodbolt]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

hello<br /> make sure the 350 is a pre 1985 with a two piece rear main seal. what intake do you have now? you really should call jasper and discuss with them what you are doing as they will be the holders of your warrenty if anything is wrong. I would do it by fax so as to keep a written record. not knowing where you are from I dont know the mechanical shape of your drive. but inspect all the ball gears closely and when the engine is out check the slines on the drive shaft and engine coupler.<br /> good luck and keep posting

 

[santa666]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Re: Drive and engine-<br />Yes, Its a pre-85', (1971) That means that it has a 2 piece seal. I am planning on changing the ball gears at the same time, and will do a spline inspection,(change if needed), as well. <br />The engine sellers websites spec out the YR., main bolt style, (2 or 4), and the 1 or 2 piece seal requirements...<br /><br />I've got FULL manual set from OMC for the engine/drive and follow the exploded views for visual clues, and parts numbers...<br /><br />It looks like the drive coupler bolts onto the flywheel...How does the shaft connect to it? Just splines, or is there a CIRCLIP?, or...<br /><br />As for the intake manifold it is the standard OMC intake for that year, part#3958624 sitting under the rochester carb.

 

[Doug Durako]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Santa----hope you are going to keep this boat forever, cause you will never get your rebuild costs back out of that new motor connected to that drive.<br /><br />They are a smooth drive, no question. I ran one for many years.<br /><br />Search this post, however, and you will see that most of the people still working on Stringers "inherited" the boat or had it "given" to them with that drive.

 

[John Carpenter]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

If you buy the correct year range block, most of your "hidden" problems will vanish. Sheet metal has to bolt up..dipstick on correct side etc. The coupler does bolt to the flywheel & the correct year block will have the right bolt pattern for it to do so. This is a great upgrade and very easy if you have the correct block...make sure.

 

[Bondo]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

I Agree with DieselWalt on this 1..........<br />Around here, if you had 2 Exact copies of the Exact Same boat.... 1 with an OMC drive,+ the other with Any Other Drive.... The OMC would be Worth Exactly 1/2 the Value of the other boat.....<br />Boomyal, You've just been Extremely Lucky you found a Wrench willing to work on them........<br />The Stringer Drives were a POS the day they were Built..... And it Doesn't get any Better after that day.....<br /><br />As far as your engine, Yes, Any SBC of the Same Vintage will Bolt Right Up......

 

[santa666]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

sorry about not being able to reply yesterday, the system had problems logging me in...<br /><br />Dear ddboater, No I was not "given" or "inherited" this boat, I bought it, after a complete and proper inspection (is there any other way?). The marina manager said after the inspection (A+) "If you don't buy this boat I will". All the systems were in superlative shape from the bottom of the trailer tire treads to the chrome on the top of the mast navigation light.<br />The compression tests were all 155-165 P.S.I on all 8 cylinders. <br /><br />The original owner ordered this boat piece by piece from a slickcraft factory dealer and upgraded many of the systems from the get-go. I think he was an eccentric lawyer, or businessman who spent his summer weekends on Lake Geneva.<br /><br />His best upgrade was ordering a dual air horn system complete with compressor, and scuba style resevior tank, what a blast. The hull, stringers, fiberglass cabin liner, seats, radio(s), dash, Burmese teak trim, cabin sole, et al. are too cool. The whole thing is a true 1970's time capsule! <br /><br />The engine and drive were spotless. He put on extras like a full camper top, bigger bilge blower motor, extra fuel filter, folding swim ladder, depth sounder, VHF radio, stereo, power inverter, in dash compass, interior lights, and a really nice shore power system. He even bought matching mooring lines, bumpers, and 2 nice anchors, even flags for the bowsprit and stern jackstaff. <br /><br />I can see him now- Mr. "Captain anal retentive swinging 70's boat owner" at the helm, in his blue blazer, ascot and white admirals hat. The bright Lake Geneva sun glinting off his gin and tonic..."tally-ho!" he cries as he eases the throttle forward...Yeah, he was into it...<br /><br />I'm sure it was just like that, At least that's the impression I get from the 3 HUGE boxes of documents he kept detailing EVERY nut, bolt, and oil and lube change that went into this boat. <br /><br />He had a matching custom bar suitcase made with spaces for whiskey, vodka, gin, mixers, tools and glasses too. It slides neatly underneath the helm station floor. <br /><br />He even WAY overspent on the trailer, rigging it with extra gear boxes, tilt bed, heavy duty lights, brakes and even an extra built in gas tank with electric pump for refueling his baby. It also has cast bronze eagles on it(hah!)The trailer shouts "GOD BLESS AMERICA!"<br /><br />It ran like a dream this last season and it is my aim to get that back with a little more power...<br /><br />I can see where other iboaters have had less than satisfactory boating experiences with older boats. I am very disapointed to have to upgrade the engine as the whole boat has 587 (or so) lifetime hours, but that's why I'm here,to get help.<br /><br />(lets all hold hands and sing kumbyah now)<br /><br />santa666

 

[CTD]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Where is your old engine cracked, its possible it could be repaired easily. I've seen water jsckets epoxied that lasted, cracked cylinders that could be bored and sleeved etc.

 

[santa666]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Good question, Cracks are left and right side, right side being bigger.. It starts and runs fine, but theres copious clouds of exhaust coming from the block on the right side... No oil, no water just nice puffy exhaust.<br /><br /> santa

 

[Badger99]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

I know this sounds cheezy but most of those freeze cracks can be fixed with a cheap weld or in fact Marine Tex. If you don't have water in the oil chances are it's fine to just seal the crack with Marine Tex. You can't do any more harm to it by doing the quick fix and running it that way and it may well last for years like that. If it goes kerplunk what have you lost?

 

[CTD]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

I found this page that shows a cracked hemi and its repair. http://www.castmetalwelding.com/Automotive.htm This would probably be too expensive to make it worth while having done but its possible and it wouldn't hurt to call some local machine shops to get an idea of price. If at all possible before spending any money on a repair like that I would try using a top grade epoxy for a repair, and run the engine a little to be sure there are not other problems.

 

[santa666]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

CTD, badger99, <br /><br />Yes, I have considered one of those processes, and am going to do more research in the area. The link above to crow welding looks like an excellent resource. I am going to call them early next week. (stay tuned on that one). If they are not too far,(where is hudson Wisconsin?)It may be worth the trip.<br /><br />HOWEVER, I have some very grave safety concerns over "going the cheap way". I boat exclusively on Lake Michigan, often going beyond site of land (12,15,18,20 miles). I will seek professional analysis of the cracks in the block and proceed from there. I have (greatfully)never had to deal with something of this magnitude before and hope to not have to issue a "MAYDAY" distess call over this issue (however I resolve it)... <br /><br />I have heard of poorly remanufactured engines failing outright as well, so I must, as the Kung-fu master says- "choose wisely"...<br /><br />santa666

 

[Lou C]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Although it is best to start with a newly rebuilt engine, I would wonder about the wisdom of going that far offshore with a drive system that is of that age, even if it is apparently in good shape. If you had a kicker that would be one thing. I hear the Great Lakes can be treacherous. If I had to have an older boat and was going to use it that way, it'd have to have a modern OB on the transom, not something of that age which may be just fine on a smaller lake where a breakdown is not potentially live threatening (bad weather comes in too fast to get home).<br />It is only 8-9 miles from my home port to Conn (LI Sound) but I don't think I will take my 88 Cobra across anytime soon.

 

[Badger99]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

We take my buddies 1985 351 mercruiser 60 miles offshore to the Baltimore Canyon for Tuna. But make sure you get an unlimited tow package from Boats US. It's the best Hundred bucks you can spend. We broke down once and they paid a $1700.00 tow in full. Now that is money well spent.

 

[santa666]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Going offshore used to FREAK ME OUT! <br /><br />Having said that, I calmed down ALOT after I learned about what conditions I can fish in, and how the boat handles... I look at the forecast and the waves, yada, yada, yada... My boat is a full on Deep-Vee hull and there's days I'll just stand on the dock and say to myself "its a good to go to brunch". it pisses off my guests something fierce, but reading the lake firsthand is always best.<br /><br />I feel sorry for the families of these bassboat knuckleheads (not that all bass-boaters are knuckleheads)I see WAY out on Lake Michigan in a ranger, or skeeter! So much water So, little freeboard- A high ranking Coastie @ Michigan City almost lost his job over a newspaper quote about some "stupid" boaters (his words) who died, (in a bassboat), over there...I've even seen a guy and a (LARGE dog)in a canoe with a 3 H.P. They were close-in, but still...<br /><br />Yeah, I have faith in the drive as it has been rebuilt recently, and is in great shape. <br /><br />Badger99, It took me a while to realize "just slap marine-tex on it" was your signature. Must also be a philosophy. I love that stuff too, every time I use it I get a craving for mashmallow fluff, (is that wrong?)<br /><br />I'm thinking of making my signature in the form of a question: "If HUFFY made a plane would you fly in it?" I saw this in a bike store years ago and it stuck with me... Its an amazing commentary on quality, or the lack thereof. <br /><br />That's why I'm leaning towards the rebuilt engine, plus the H.P. gain!<br /><br />Thanks again for your helpful advice, but I still have yet to figure out how exactly the drive shaft coupler attaches to the shaft when installing the new engine. I have a good idea about bringing the new engine down onto the mounts. I have been told the old flywheel will bolt onto the new crankshaft end (if the engine was ordered properly), and the coupler will bolt onto the outside of the flywheel, and the shaft should already be on the coupler, but when the engine is lowered into place does the flywheel/coupler assembly just slide onto the drive shaft slines, or what?<br /><br />Do I have to get under there and torque the 6 coupler bolts into place (which seems IMPOSSIBLE from that angle), or is it a simpler thing to do? <br /><br />All of the auxillary bolt-ons do not bother me as its just R and R-<br /><br />Santa666<br /><br />P.S. Next question is how should I re-prop to handle 50 or so more ponies? I will look at the existing prop for its size/pitch for future reference soon.

 

[Doug Durako]

Re: cracked engine, needs replacement

Santa---sounds like a beautiful boat---who forgot to put that anti-freeze in the block?<br /><br />In two years of reading this forum I have yet to see bad advice from Bondo or Dieselwalt---and they have given volumes of advice.<br /><br />One thing my OMC I/O taught me---never trust a boat dealer any farther than you can throw 'em.<br /><br />Good luck in your adventures on the big lake!