First start takes about 10 pulls. Next starts 1/2 pull. Anything wrong?

[777funk]

I just got a 69 Johnson 4HP. I cleaned the carb and tore down and inspected the fuel pump (looks very old but seems to work without leaks) then set the points (had new coils, points, and condensers) using the ohm meter method (set to the tick mark before zero on the timing plate). It starts GREAT once primed. Very happy with how it starts. BUT... before it's primed for the day it takes around 10-15 pulls. Maybe this is normal.

 

[sutor623]

I just got a 69 Johnson 4HP. I cleaned the carb and tore down and inspected the fuel pump (looks very old but seems to work without leaks) then set the points (had new coils, points, and condensers) using the ohm meter method (set to the tick mark before zero on the timing plate). It starts GREAT once primed. Very happy with how it starts. BUT... before it's primed for the day it takes around 10-15 pulls. Maybe this is normal.

I had 3 of those motors. They run great and are like little sewing machines. So smooth. Way nicer than a 1 cylinder.

Anyways, with my motors it took me about 3-4 pulls to get them started. What I learned to do was pull slow and steady the first 2-3 times to prime the fuel pump. Then I would pull hard to get it to start and it worked like a charm. There is also a chance that your primer bulb has an issue with its valve. Sometimes when you pump a bad primer bulb it feels like it is priming but its just pushing gas back down to the tank.

Oh, and I also had to keep the throttle up pretty high, like 1/3 of full throttle. Maybe you arent throttling up enough for that first start. Not sure if yours is the same, but mine didnt have neutral, so that was always interesting..........

 

[777funk]

... mine didnt have neutral, so that was always interesting..........

Yep, in gear full time! I haven't had it on the lake yet but it'll be on a canoe (big wide one with a big square back) so I'm guessing this will be fun upon startup (1/3 from full throttle). lol. I've heard these old engines (and the Evinrude LightTwins were called "Dock Busters". My other engine (a Yamaha/Mariner 2HP) is the same way (as far as always in forward gear).

And like you mention it, the Johnson IS so much smoother than a 1 cylinder. Such a nice purr to these OMC engines. The sound is such a nice sound. Reminds me of fishing with my dad as a kid. And I'm sure it reminded him of fishing with his dad and grandfather.

 

[nwcove]

did you do a compression test ?

 

[777funk]

Yes I did. 55 psi hot both cylinders. The only time it takes a bit to get started is the first start (like it's not priming). After that half a pull and of it goes.

 

[sutor623]

Yep, in gear full time! I haven't had it on the lake yet but it'll be on a canoe (big wide one with a big square back) so I'm guessing this will be fun upon startup (1/3 from full throttle). lol. I've heard these old engines (and the Evinrude LightTwins were called "Dock Busters". My other engine (a Yamaha/Mariner 2HP) is the same way (as far as always in forward gear).

And like you mention it, the Johnson IS so much smoother than a 1 cylinder. Such a nice purr to these OMC engines. The sound is such a nice sound. Reminds me of fishing with my dad as a kid. And I'm sure it reminded him of fishing with his dad and grandfather.

Wow, yea this thing on a canoe is going to HAUL!!!! I had mine on a 16' boat for backup and trolling. That thing would idle down so low it was almost like it wasnt even on. Here is a video of it actually.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIEuD0-LAMc

 

[nwcove]

Yes I did. 55 psi hot both cylinders. The only time it takes a bit to get started is the first start (like it's not priming). After that half a pull and of it goes.

compression is on the low side of just ok. i'd try an aggressive decarb on it , just to see if those #'s come up a bit.

 

[racerone]

Advance the throttle some more on cold start.---That way the engine will pull a low pressure on the fuel and it squirts into the carburetor throat from the bowl.----Or test by squirting a fuel mix into the carburetor to see if indeed it is a " no fuel " issue on start-up.

 

[777funk]

... to see if indeed it is a " no fuel " issue on start-up.

Thanks! What else could it be out of curiousity? I noticed two things when I went through this engine:

1. Lower compression than I'd like
2. Reed valves spit a little and I could see the right two reeds weren't closed 100% (more like 90%) at rest

As far as compression, the bores looked nice and smooth with no scoring and the head gasket also looked great. I guess that leaves rings as the problem?

Does a de-carb make a big difference? NWCOVE, I notice you mentioning that. I'm one who has yet to experience bottles of mystery tonic making much difference... but that's in cars, I'm new to outboards so I don't know much yet. My dad swears that Seafoam will clean any carb... I find that sometimes elbow grease and tear downs are the only way to remove gunk. I sprayed some Kroil in one cylinder over night at TDC then let a little transmission fluid sit in there for an hour or two and I didn't notice a difference in compression.

 

[nwcove]

jmo, but i dont believe that seafoam will " clean" your carb, but it will stabilize the fuel, and help keep the carb clean. a decarb can make a noticeable difference, especially with a motor that spent most of its running hrs at or near idle. seafoam will get the job done, but if you do it, be prepared for a cloud of smoke!

 

[sutor623]

777, just FYI, a good decarb typically will bring up your compression numbers a bit because it can free up stuck rings. And it is hard to get a nice high compression reading with a pull start motor. We all pull at different strengths, and I always feel like I will snap the older pull ropes so I don't pull super hard. I think that you may have pulled the head for no good reason. But, seeing as you did pull the head, and the bores look good, I think you are good to go. Just do a decarb, give it a few primer pulls and more throttle when starting her up.

 

[racerone]

Those side recoils are known to be weak.--Best to develop the technique to get it started in 3 pulls the way one of those will start !

 

[777funk]

I should try a decarb and see what happens. sutor623, I pulled the head because one of the plugs had some rust near the electrode. I was figuring head gasket leak but it didn't look like it when I pulled the head. The bolts were a bit stuck so it was good to get them free and clean them off anyways for me or whoever pulls the head in the future. Took about 30 minutes to pull the head with the stuck bolts. Next time (if there is one) it'll take 5 minutes.

 

[777funk]

I think my problem was I'd forgotten that I'd put an ounce or so of transmission fluid in the cylinders and let it set for a few days. I did remember to dump it (vs hydrolocking) but it didn't click that it'd take a while to start after.

The next cold start was 2-3 pulls. Starts SUPER easy when warm. The timing (set by points and an ohm-meter) is right at the edge of the two notches (as advanced as possible in spec). Starts great, not even a full pull warm!

I saw a video of a guy starting a 7.5 by flinging the flywheel with his hands. I couldn't get mine to start like that. He must have the touch.