For those thinking about an engine swap...

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
I'll just start out by saying unless you are infatuated with the boat and can't stand to replace it, you are much better off looking for the same boat with the power you want. Mine being an 84, there are few and far between that are still this clean and would have the power I want. So enter my insanity and swapping engines. I went from a 3.0l to a 4.3l.

The job really isn't bad if a few chance things line up. First, my boat was available from the factory with power up to a 350 MAG. So the bilge was already able to accommodate it. I took a bunch of measurements and compared them to the Mercruiser dimensional drawings to make sure I'd have the room. The dog house fit fine, the only modification that had to be made was my back trim panel had to be widened for the manifolds and elbows. Peel back vinyl and trim plywood. Nothing crazy.


Once I confirmed it would fit, I found a engine and all accessories. You need at a minimum the complete engine, Y-pipe, and drive for your transom assembly. I retained my original Alpha 1 assembly as he had a decent drive. I decided to delete power steering for now at the time, the pump that was on the engine had a front seal weep and I didn't want to deal with that mess. If I felt it needed power steering, I could easily add it back. Just so we're all clear, I am not adding it back, it is perfectly manageable without. Also saves a couple pounds on the ass end. I also decided to replace the input yolk seal on the new drive as it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea. I actually ended up swapping my lower onto the correct ratio upper as the one included was pretty beat up and mine was... well... pretty nice. I was hoping to not have to do that as my lower is a preload pin one. I do have a near perfect alpha 1 case in the garage that I will eventually build for this boat. This was the easier route for now.


So now the actual swap could begin since I had the engine, drive and exhaust figured out. First step was to pull the 3.0l and drive. I ended up reusing my entire transom assembly as there was no real need to swap it. Now the actual “swap” work began. From the day I pulled the engine to the bay test with the 4.3l was about 10 days. And that was only working on my days off. It was a total of 4 working days if that. Maybe 20 hours of labor. Now I’m not saying it was easy, it’s just that this kind of work isn’t something I’m unfamiliar with so most of the leg work was done measuring out and prepping prior to pulling the engine or obtaining a 4.3l. So once everything was confirmed to fit, I measured out and glassed in engine mounts and notched the stringers to fit the Y-pipe.
I hadn’t found this out until I was about to drop the engine in, but the stringers were a little too narrow to allow the Y-pipe to fit in on the transom. Dad’s knee jerk response to that was “dual 4” straight out the back.” To which I stared at him and he just laughed. So we notched and glassed out the top inch of the rear of the stringers so it would drop down the rest of the way. I came to later find out looking at photos of the same boat with V8 power that they stepped down the stringer for clearance on the V powered boats for the last 6 inches.


The last day was spent making all the wiring checked out, I actually replaced my ignition plug as the original to the boat had rotted out many years ago and all the wiring was hard wired. It is nice having the plug on top of the engine that you can just disconnect if you need to pull it.


The following day we went for a bay test. Originally I was extremely disappointed. Boat picked up maybe 1 MPH at cruise and only 1 MPH up top. I was not in a good place. Then I got thinking... this was a thunderbolt V ignition. What are the chances that this guy didn’t set base timing correct? Lucky me that was the case. It had 2 degrees of retard instead of the recommended 10 degrees BTDC in base timing. So I figure at wide open I was missing some 13 degrees of initial advance. Boat picked up 6 MPH up top with that one adjustment, which is more what I would expect.


So, the before and after? With the 3.0l she would top out 36-37 MPH on the best of days atmosphere wise but typically was all in at 35 MPH on most days. Cruise was 23-24 MPH at 3000-3200 RPM. I tend to run out with dad a lot and his 330 cruises near 30 MPH. So to keep up with him I was always running it hard wherever we went, needed to run 3800 RPM to do those speeds and those 3.0s aren’t exactly quiet at those speeds. Now with the 4.3l cruise is 29 MPH at 3300 RPM and it tops out at 44 MPH on good atmosphere days, 42-43 MPH on all others. I’ve found doing the rough math that my best overall range is to actually run 3700 RPM at about 35 MPH. The hull and everything handling wise feels awesome in that 32-35 MPH slot. And my fuel use for anything between 28-35 MPH nets me about the same distance traveled. Obviously filling up after running a whole tank at that speed isn’t perfect but it gets close enough for decent judgment.


The two biggest things I can take away from this swap is this: for how much quieter it is alone it was worth the cost. And the fact it hops on plane with 5 guys in the boat faster than the 3.0l did with just me and a quarter tank is completely worth it too. Is fuel consumption higher? Yes. But I am getting everywhere significantly quicker so over the whole days outing, it really ends up being a near wash. I do however think I will be adding the optional larger tank the boat could have come with as 20 gallons of usable fuel, even with the 3.0l, went very quick. Having 32 gallons I can use will be a nice addition this winter along with the other work to be done. My math on the 3.0l always put me around 4.2 MPG or ~5.5 gallons per hour at cruise. Currently I am seeing about 4.0 MPG at cruise or about 7.4 GPH. That is also 23 vs ~31 MPH. It takes me just under an hour to reach my usual spot now where it used to take almost an hour and a half prior. So over that same distance I was using nearly the same 7 gallons. This isn’t for everyone.


For me, the swap was 100% worth it. Hell, I may look into a 4 barrel conversion and see if I can snag a little more top end come next season. I may also try a 21p prop as I should still be able to swing 4600-4700 RPM loaded. The 3.0l always put up better numbers with wide open 45-4600 than 4800 which is why I kept the 19p. As long as I am getting into the proper WOT range with the 21p I'll leave it alone for just me.

It did suck the used “fresh rebuild” ended up being a dud but now I have an engine I 100% can trust for years to come. (you can see my popped through the intake thread for that journey...) Now for the overall cost? Well... lets just call it $8000. That includes the rebuild and all the miscellaneous parts involved in the swap plus replacing the “new” GLM manifolds that leaked that came with the engine originally with a new set of OE mercruiser ones. That also includes the original purchase price of the 4.3l and extra transom assembly, power steering and drive... Cheaper than new but when it was all said and done an alpha 4v 4.3l is $9500. Finding a boat in as good of shape that I actually like with the power I want would’ve been around $20,000. So I am ahead. But this is not for everyone. I am very happy. I will also add that we repowered to the 3.0l in 2003 for about $2200. We put over 700 trouble free hours on that engine. I pulled it out and listed it for sale just to see what would happen... guy offered $1500. That was a great investment in my book.

I'll also add, last weekend I was out and blew past my friend. He called me and thought I was running balls out but was just cruising around 33. His exact words were "I can't believe how much of the boat is out of the water, it looks really cool like that." I am looking forward to next season.
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
pics or it didnt happen......
Which part? :p

I honestly really didn't take all that many pictures through the process... I wanted a bay test before memorial day and that'd have just slown me down but here are the few I did snap...
20230519_193819.jpg20230527_122631.jpg20230527_122644.jpg20230531_103331.jpg
This winter will be pulling the deck, there are 2 spots that are showing signs of some water intrusion. We pulled up and inspected all the areas we could and everything we checked was fine. So it's now just a matter of pulling the deck seeing what all needs to be done and doing that. Being all the carpeting and flooring is the original 40 year old pieces at this point I would say it's had a good service life. Over the last 3 years the stuff really started to get bad. The bulk head at the end of the engine bay is rotted but that isn't structural in any way. I suspect I could be in for a surprise but I still think it'll all get done by summer. Luckily with my schedule I always end up with 5 days off every other week. I don't have a ton to keep up with over the winter so I can dedicate what is needed to the project... it'll be fun but it'll be good as new too.

Girlfriend gave me the green light for it too so I'd say she's a keeper!
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
the floor is always the last to rot. be prepared for a big restoration project.
Yeah I know. We did do a few core samples on the stringers around the fuel tank and they all came out clean and solid... but that is much further up than the soft spot. I'm mentally and financially prepared for a full gut and replace but we won't know until it's open. My plan is get it in the garage in the next couple weeks and keep some heaters under the hull for a couple weeks then assess the situation.

We also did some test holes in the transom then glassed over them. They came out dry on all of them at all the problem areas around the transom assembly, garboard and tow hooks. So that is promising. I also borrowed my friends moisture probe to confirm what I was seeing. The notched part of the stringer for the Y was also still solid and dry. So the problem areas may be pretty isolated. Or I open it up and go what the hell did I get myself into. Either way, I'm going to have fun with it like the psycho I am lol.
 

Scott06

Admiral
Joined
Apr 20, 2014
Messages
6,722
I'll just start out by saying unless you are infatuated with the boat and can't stand to replace it, you are much better off looking for the same boat with the power you want. Mine being an 84, there are few and far between that are still this clean and would have the power I want. So enter my insanity and swapping engines. I went from a 3.0l to a 4.3l.

The job really isn't bad if a few chance things line up. First, my boat was available from the factory with power up to a 350 MAG. So the bilge was already able to accommodate it. I took a bunch of measurements and compared them to the Mercruiser dimensional drawings to make sure I'd have the room. The dog house fit fine, the only modification that had to be made was my back trim panel had to be widened for the manifolds and elbows. Peel back vinyl and trim plywood. Nothing crazy.


Once I confirmed it would fit, I found a engine and all accessories. You need at a minimum the complete engine, Y-pipe, and drive for your transom assembly. I retained my original Alpha 1 assembly as he had a decent drive. I decided to delete power steering for now at the time, the pump that was on the engine had a front seal weep and I didn't want to deal with that mess. If I felt it needed power steering, I could easily add it back. Just so we're all clear, I am not adding it back, it is perfectly manageable without. Also saves a couple pounds on the ass end. I also decided to replace the input yolk seal on the new drive as it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea. I actually ended up swapping my lower onto the correct ratio upper as the one included was pretty beat up and mine was... well... pretty nice. I was hoping to not have to do that as my lower is a preload pin one. I do have a near perfect alpha 1 case in the garage that I will eventually build for this boat. This was the easier route for now.


So now the actual swap could begin since I had the engine, drive and exhaust figured out. First step was to pull the 3.0l and drive. I ended up reusing my entire transom assembly as there was no real need to swap it. Now the actual “swap” work began. From the day I pulled the engine to the bay test with the 4.3l was about 10 days. And that was only working on my days off. It was a total of 4 working days if that. Maybe 20 hours of labor. Now I’m not saying it was easy, it’s just that this kind of work isn’t something I’m unfamiliar with so most of the leg work was done measuring out and prepping prior to pulling the engine or obtaining a 4.3l. So once everything was confirmed to fit, I measured out and glassed in engine mounts and notched the stringers to fit the Y-pipe.
I hadn’t found this out until I was about to drop the engine in, but the stringers were a little too narrow to allow the Y-pipe to fit in on the transom. Dad’s knee jerk response to that was “dual 4” straight out the back.” To which I stared at him and he just laughed. So we notched and glassed out the top inch of the rear of the stringers so it would drop down the rest of the way. I came to later find out looking at photos of the same boat with V8 power that they stepped down the stringer for clearance on the V powered boats for the last 6 inches.


The last day was spent making all the wiring checked out, I actually replaced my ignition plug as the original to the boat had rotted out many years ago and all the wiring was hard wired. It is nice having the plug on top of the engine that you can just disconnect if you need to pull it.


The following day we went for a bay test. Originally I was extremely disappointed. Boat picked up maybe 1 MPH at cruise and only 1 MPH up top. I was not in a good place. Then I got thinking... this was a thunderbolt V ignition. What are the chances that this guy didn’t set base timing correct? Lucky me that was the case. It had 2 degrees of retard instead of the recommended 10 degrees BTDC in base timing. So I figure at wide open I was missing some 13 degrees of initial advance. Boat picked up 6 MPH up top with that one adjustment, which is more what I would expect.


So, the before and after? With the 3.0l she would top out 36-37 MPH on the best of days atmosphere wise but typically was all in at 35 MPH on most days. Cruise was 23-24 MPH at 3000-3200 RPM. I tend to run out with dad a lot and his 330 cruises near 30 MPH. So to keep up with him I was always running it hard wherever we went, needed to run 3800 RPM to do those speeds and those 3.0s aren’t exactly quiet at those speeds. Now with the 4.3l cruise is 29 MPH at 3300 RPM and it tops out at 44 MPH on good atmosphere days, 42-43 MPH on all others. I’ve found doing the rough math that my best overall range is to actually run 3700 RPM at about 35 MPH. The hull and everything handling wise feels awesome in that 32-35 MPH slot. And my fuel use for anything between 28-35 MPH nets me about the same distance traveled. Obviously filling up after running a whole tank at that speed isn’t perfect but it gets close enough for decent judgment.


The two biggest things I can take away from this swap is this: for how much quieter it is alone it was worth the cost. And the fact it hops on plane with 5 guys in the boat faster than the 3.0l did with just me and a quarter tank is completely worth it too. Is fuel consumption higher? Yes. But I am getting everywhere significantly quicker so over the whole days outing, it really ends up being a near wash. I do however think I will be adding the optional larger tank the boat could have come with as 20 gallons of usable fuel, even with the 3.0l, went very quick. Having 32 gallons I can use will be a nice addition this winter along with the other work to be done. My math on the 3.0l always put me around 4.2 MPG or ~5.5 gallons per hour at cruise. Currently I am seeing about 4.0 MPG at cruise or about 7.4 GPH. That is also 23 vs ~31 MPH. It takes me just under an hour to reach my usual spot now where it used to take almost an hour and a half prior. So over that same distance I was using nearly the same 7 gallons. This isn’t for everyone.


For me, the swap was 100% worth it. Hell, I may look into a 4 barrel conversion and see if I can snag a little more top end come next season. I may also try a 21p prop as I should still be able to swing 4600-4700 RPM loaded. The 3.0l always put up better numbers with wide open 45-4600 than 4800 which is why I kept the 19p. As long as I am getting into the proper WOT range with the 21p I'll leave it alone for just me.

It did suck the used “fresh rebuild” ended up being a dud but now I have an engine I 100% can trust for years to come. (you can see my popped through the intake thread for that journey...) Now for the overall cost? Well... lets just call it $8000. That includes the rebuild and all the miscellaneous parts involved in the swap plus replacing the “new” GLM manifolds that leaked that came with the engine originally with a new set of OE mercruiser ones. That also includes the original purchase price of the 4.3l and extra transom assembly, power steering and drive... Cheaper than new but when it was all said and done an alpha 4v 4.3l is $9500. Finding a boat in as good of shape that I actually like with the power I want would’ve been around $20,000. So I am ahead. But this is not for everyone. I am very happy. I will also add that we repowered to the 3.0l in 2003 for about $2200. We put over 700 trouble free hours on that engine. I pulled it out and listed it for sale just to see what would happen... guy offered $1500. That was a great investment in my book.

I'll also add, last weekend I was out and blew past my friend. He called me and thought I was running balls out but was just cruising around 33. His exact words were "I can't believe how much of the boat is out of the water, it looks really cool like that." I am looking forward to next season
did a repower when I got my new boat. Old one had a 3.0 it was louder than my new one with a 5.0

previous owner cracked the 4.3 so I swapped in 5.0 because that is the biggest engine that model was offered.

it’s unfortunate but your experince buying a used engine is typical. Unless you know who rebuilt it you have to consider and pay for any engine as a core. i did my repower before prices got stupid (2015) but I am glad I got a new base engine. Been trouble free for 7 years.

Hopefully you like the boat and it serves you well.

i would second Scott’s comments on checking out the structure. Probably would have been better to do this before the repower, hopefully you won’t find too much rot. Usually it goes the other way
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
did a repower when I got my new boat. Old one had a 3.0 it was louder than my new one with a 5.0

previous owner cracked the 4.3 so I swapped in 5.0 because that is the biggest engine that model was offered.

it’s unfortunate but your experince buying a used engine is typical. Unless you know who rebuilt it you have to consider and pay for any engine as a core. i did my repower before prices got stupid (2015) but I am glad I got a new base engine. Been trouble free for 7 years.

Hopefully you like the boat and it serves you well.

i would second Scott’s comments on checking out the structure. Probably would have been better to do this before the repower, hopefully you won’t find too much rot. Usually it goes the other way
I've loved the boat for the last 27 years of my life. And hopefully the next 27 lol. The real reason for doing the swap prior to tearing into it was to have the foot print of where everything needed to be when I do it. Back asswards for sure but everything will line up and I'll know it'll all be in the right spot. I'm pretty well convinced I'm going to be in for an absolute **** show... but I've already committed to doing it no matter what. I want to. But I'm just trying to be positive. And then you all get to follow along when I rip into it. :)

I genuinely don't think the guy knew there was an issue with the engine... it really did run too well until it got hot and popped. I originally was looking for a core to build up but people wanted just as much for crap that was quite literally locked up. It sucks but you live and learn. People really think they're sitting on gold with any little thing that says marine.
 

Scott06

Admiral
Joined
Apr 20, 2014
Messages
6,722
I've loved the boat for the last 27 years of my life. And hopefully the next 27 lol. The real reason for doing the swap prior to tearing into it was to have the foot print of where everything needed to be when I do it. Back asswards for sure but everything will line up and I'll know it'll all be in the right spot. I'm pretty well convinced I'm going to be in for an absolute **** show... but I've already committed to doing it no matter what. I want to. But I'm just trying to be positive. And then you all get to follow along when I rip into it. :)

I genuinely don't think the guy knew there was an issue with the engine... it really did run too well until it got hot and popped. I originally was looking for a core to build up but people wanted just as much for crap that was quite literally locked up. It sucks but you live and learn. People really think they're sitting on gold with any little thing that says marine.
At least you have some attachment to it, assume it has been in the family?

Had a similar experience with my grandfathers boat ( 1966 ish Penn Yan) that he gave my brother and I after he paid $1800 to have the outdrive rebuilt ( this was in early 90's). He said you guys can have the boat but if something breaks I don't know you... We kept it going for a few more years but when a crack indicative of bad stringers showed up in the hull we let it go. Point being don't get into it such that you have to keep throwing money at the hole and you loose the delta between what you have in it and what you could buy a similar decent condition boat for.

When I did my repower by the time I purchased the boat, new partial from Michigan Motorz ($5k with exhaust at the time), replaced entire surge brake system and tires on trailer, a couple props etc I was in it for $10,800 bucks. Backing out what I sold my old boat for (25 yr olf 17 ft /3.0 Sea Ray 170) an parts I sold total was about $7300.

I did it because although the boat was 11 years old it only had 37 hrs on it so everything else (interior, canvas) was in very nice shape. Similar boats in working condition at the time were $17/18k maybe $20 at a dealer, so there was enough delta to justify the repower which as you outlined is not really a ton of work. First 5-6 seasons were no issues, just routine maintenance and an impeller. Since then I have done bellows (orig lasted 18 years), one trim cylinder, and this fall got fishing line in my prop seal so drive is torn down at moment. Basically worked out perfect for how we use the boat, have two now college age daughters who are avid boaters.

Funny you mentioned the 4.3 Alpha 4V crate motor-The PO of my boat bought it at a used car lot, used it three weeks found out block was cracked when milk came out the valve covers... Got a repower estimate totaling $11k 9he was not a wrench turner) - the estimate included the 4.3 4V merc bobtail 3yr warranty. At that time the engine was $6300 vs the $9500 now. New GM base engines from Mich Motorz were about $2900-$3400 depending on if it was a 4.3/5.0/or 5.7. I think my partial was $4200 - with base engine, intake, eddy 1409 carb, and TB distributor and module. By the time I bought exhaust manifolds, risers and shipping it was like $5k-5200. (2015 dollars...)

I did a 5.0 because that's what my Sea Ray 200 sport was offered with. If I knew then what I know know I would have done a 5.7... The 5.0 works great and was well worth the work over the 4.3 that was in it, but a 5.7 for the same cost except getting a new upper for drive ratio would have been perfect when I have 6-7 people in the boat and one on the tow rope...

Hopefully your soft spots are the rare ones where the entire stringers don't need to be cut out
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
At least you have some attachment to it, assume it has been in the family?

Had a similar experience with my grandfathers boat ( 1966 ish Penn Yan) that he gave my brother and I after he paid $1800 to have the outdrive rebuilt ( this was in early 90's). He said you guys can have the boat but if something breaks I don't know you... We kept it going for a few more years but when a crack indicative of bad stringers showed up in the hull we let it go. Point being don't get into it such that you have to keep throwing money at the hole and you loose the delta between what you have in it and what you could buy a similar decent condition boat for.

When I did my repower by the time I purchased the boat, new partial from Michigan Motorz ($5k with exhaust at the time), replaced entire surge brake system and tires on trailer, a couple props etc I was in it for $10,800 bucks. Backing out what I sold my old boat for (25 yr olf 17 ft /3.0 Sea Ray 170) an parts I sold total was about $7300.

I did it because although the boat was 11 years old it only had 37 hrs on it so everything else (interior, canvas) was in very nice shape. Similar boats in working condition at the time were $17/18k maybe $20 at a dealer, so there was enough delta to justify the repower which as you outlined is not really a ton of work. First 5-6 seasons were no issues, just routine maintenance and an impeller. Since then I have done bellows (orig lasted 18 years), one trim cylinder, and this fall got fishing line in my prop seal so drive is torn down at moment. Basically worked out perfect for how we use the boat, have two now college age daughters who are avid boaters.

Funny you mentioned the 4.3 Alpha 4V crate motor-The PO of my boat bought it at a used car lot, used it three weeks found out block was cracked when milk came out the valve covers... Got a repower estimate totaling $11k 9he was not a wrench turner) - the estimate included the 4.3 4V merc bobtail 3yr warranty. At that time the engine was $6300 vs the $9500 now. New GM base engines from Mich Motorz were about $2900-$3400 depending on if it was a 4.3/5.0/or 5.7. I think my partial was $4200 - with base engine, intake, eddy 1409 carb, and TB distributor and module. By the time I bought exhaust manifolds, risers and shipping it was like $5k-5200. (2015 dollars...)

I did a 5.0 because that's what my Sea Ray 200 sport was offered with. If I knew then what I know know I would have done a 5.7... The 5.0 works great and was well worth the work over the 4.3 that was in it, but a 5.7 for the same cost except getting a new upper for drive ratio would have been perfect when I have 6-7 people in the boat and one on the tow rope...

Hopefully your soft spots are the rare ones where the entire stringers don't need to be cut out
Yeah, dad more or less got it when I was born. Though he cites me as the reason he had to sell his favorite boat. (17 foot invader with an I6 merc.) He had a few boats in that middle year between the invader and when he got the 4 winns we have now... fiber form, fiesta, a little Grumman, and a few others. The 4 winns was one that one of his customers owned at the time, used for a few seasons then sat on the hard in the boat yard for like 6 years. So at the time it had maybe 100 hours on it and he knew the majority of the maintenance history. Called up as he stopped making storage payments, guy didn't want it and the rest was history. So I basically grew up on this one. He built the original drive for the 3.0l back in 96-97 from parts bin stuff laying around in the shed. You all know how that is, stuff you save because you wouldn't put it in a customers boat but may be good enough to use in an emergency for something of yours.

In 2010 when he got the 33 I assumed control over the 4 winns. And the rest is history.

I'm typically not lucky when it comes to these things though... So I'm not holding my breath. Luckily dad did enough of them to guide me through the process if need be, though it seems straight forward... put it back the way it was or better. I also have a resource in you guys and the fact I'll have a heated garage to work in all winter is a huge leg up.

All in all, it's a 40 year old boat. It is going to more than likely have 40 year old boat problems. But if I do this and get another 20-30 years out of it, if I can even use it that long because who really knows, then I feel it would have been worth it. I'm in that odd place where I've run a lot of other boats and just haven't found something I really loved. If that makes sense.

And as far as service, that 3.0l and alpha configuration went through 1 set of bellows in 27 years, 1 lower shift cable, 1 original trim ram hose, and oil changes... Obviously the repower in 2003, the original 140 rotted internally and had a water leak into the oil, something dad had seen happen on a bunch of 140s of that era. And 1 manifold/elbow in 2012. Being entirely salt used I wasn't complaining about anything. It was water kept for that whole time on the original manifold/elbow. So as far as cost of ownership it was about $100 to get it set up for the season. The original 84 trim pump is still ticking away but now that I said that will probably die... I do have a new spare I got for free...

Its going to be a fun winter. I don't expect to ever get a ROI on it... I just want to enjoy it and know it'll all be good.
 

nola mike

Vice Admiral
Joined
Apr 22, 2009
Messages
5,407
What vintage 4.3 did you go with? What's your WOT rpm? You should have at least had to reprop if you kept the old drive.
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
What vintage 4.3 did you go with? What's your WOT rpm? You should have at least had to reprop if you kept the old drive.
2003 vortec. I kept the lower but used the new to me 1.84 ratio upper for the 4.3l. I get 4700 on the tach but seeing as I've hit the rev limiter not much above that with a different prop, I have reason to believe it is actually 4900, so it reads 200 RPM low. I have a digital shop tachometer I just never remembered to take it with me to check once I started testing for WOT on the rebuild.
 

tank1949

Lieutenant Commander
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
1,911
I'll just start out by saying unless you are infatuated with the boat and can't stand to replace it, you are much better off looking for the same boat with the power you want. Mine being an 84, there are few and far between that are still this clean and would have the power I want. So enter my insanity and swapping engines. I went from a 3.0l to a 4.3l.

The job really isn't bad if a few chance things line up. First, my boat was available from the factory with power up to a 350 MAG. So the bilge was already able to accommodate it. I took a bunch of measurements and compared them to the Mercruiser dimensional drawings to make sure I'd have the room. The dog house fit fine, the only modification that had to be made was my back trim panel had to be widened for the manifolds and elbows. Peel back vinyl and trim plywood. Nothing crazy.


Once I confirmed it would fit, I found a engine and all accessories. You need at a minimum the complete engine, Y-pipe, and drive for your transom assembly. I retained my original Alpha 1 assembly as he had a decent drive. I decided to delete power steering for now at the time, the pump that was on the engine had a front seal weep and I didn't want to deal with that mess. If I felt it needed power steering, I could easily add it back. Just so we're all clear, I am not adding it back, it is perfectly manageable without. Also saves a couple pounds on the ass end. I also decided to replace the input yolk seal on the new drive as it probably wouldn’t be a bad idea. I actually ended up swapping my lower onto the correct ratio upper as the one included was pretty beat up and mine was... well... pretty nice. I was hoping to not have to do that as my lower is a preload pin one. I do have a near perfect alpha 1 case in the garage that I will eventually build for this boat. This was the easier route for now.


So now the actual swap could begin since I had the engine, drive and exhaust figured out. First step was to pull the 3.0l and drive. I ended up reusing my entire transom assembly as there was no real need to swap it. Now the actual “swap” work began. From the day I pulled the engine to the bay test with the 4.3l was about 10 days. And that was only working on my days off. It was a total of 4 working days if that. Maybe 20 hours of labor. Now I’m not saying it was easy, it’s just that this kind of work isn’t something I’m unfamiliar with so most of the leg work was done measuring out and prepping prior to pulling the engine or obtaining a 4.3l. So once everything was confirmed to fit, I measured out and glassed in engine mounts and notched the stringers to fit the Y-pipe.
I hadn’t found this out until I was about to drop the engine in, but the stringers were a little too narrow to allow the Y-pipe to fit in on the transom. Dad’s knee jerk response to that was “dual 4” straight out the back.” To which I stared at him and he just laughed. So we notched and glassed out the top inch of the rear of the stringers so it would drop down the rest of the way. I came to later find out looking at photos of the same boat with V8 power that they stepped down the stringer for clearance on the V powered boats for the last 6 inches.


The last day was spent making all the wiring checked out, I actually replaced my ignition plug as the original to the boat had rotted out many years ago and all the wiring was hard wired. It is nice having the plug on top of the engine that you can just disconnect if you need to pull it.


The following day we went for a bay test. Originally I was extremely disappointed. Boat picked up maybe 1 MPH at cruise and only 1 MPH up top. I was not in a good place. Then I got thinking... this was a thunderbolt V ignition. What are the chances that this guy didn’t set base timing correct? Lucky me that was the case. It had 2 degrees of retard instead of the recommended 10 degrees BTDC in base timing. So I figure at wide open I was missing some 13 degrees of initial advance. Boat picked up 6 MPH up top with that one adjustment, which is more what I would expect.


So, the before and after? With the 3.0l she would top out 36-37 MPH on the best of days atmosphere wise but typically was all in at 35 MPH on most days. Cruise was 23-24 MPH at 3000-3200 RPM. I tend to run out with dad a lot and his 330 cruises near 30 MPH. So to keep up with him I was always running it hard wherever we went, needed to run 3800 RPM to do those speeds and those 3.0s aren’t exactly quiet at those speeds. Now with the 4.3l cruise is 29 MPH at 3300 RPM and it tops out at 44 MPH on good atmosphere days, 42-43 MPH on all others. I’ve found doing the rough math that my best overall range is to actually run 3700 RPM at about 35 MPH. The hull and everything handling wise feels awesome in that 32-35 MPH slot. And my fuel use for anything between 28-35 MPH nets me about the same distance traveled. Obviously filling up after running a whole tank at that speed isn’t perfect but it gets close enough for decent judgment.


The two biggest things I can take away from this swap is this: for how much quieter it is alone it was worth the cost. And the fact it hops on plane with 5 guys in the boat faster than the 3.0l did with just me and a quarter tank is completely worth it too. Is fuel consumption higher? Yes. But I am getting everywhere significantly quicker so over the whole days outing, it really ends up being a near wash. I do however think I will be adding the optional larger tank the boat could have come with as 20 gallons of usable fuel, even with the 3.0l, went very quick. Having 32 gallons I can use will be a nice addition this winter along with the other work to be done. My math on the 3.0l always put me around 4.2 MPG or ~5.5 gallons per hour at cruise. Currently I am seeing about 4.0 MPG at cruise or about 7.4 GPH. That is also 23 vs ~31 MPH. It takes me just under an hour to reach my usual spot now where it used to take almost an hour and a half prior. So over that same distance I was using nearly the same 7 gallons. This isn’t for everyone.


For me, the swap was 100% worth it. Hell, I may look into a 4 barrel conversion and see if I can snag a little more top end come next season. I may also try a 21p prop as I should still be able to swing 4600-4700 RPM loaded. The 3.0l always put up better numbers with wide open 45-4600 than 4800 which is why I kept the 19p. As long as I am getting into the proper WOT range with the 21p I'll leave it alone for just me.

It did suck the used “fresh rebuild” ended up being a dud but now I have an engine I 100% can trust for years to come. (you can see my popped through the intake thread for that journey...) Now for the overall cost? Well... lets just call it $8000. That includes the rebuild and all the miscellaneous parts involved in the swap plus replacing the “new” GLM manifolds that leaked that came with the engine originally with a new set of OE mercruiser ones. That also includes the original purchase price of the 4.3l and extra transom assembly, power steering and drive... Cheaper than new but when it was all said and done an alpha 4v 4.3l is $9500. Finding a boat in as good of shape that I actually like with the power I want would’ve been around $20,000. So I am ahead. But this is not for everyone. I am very happy. I will also add that we repowered to the 3.0l in 2003 for about $2200. We put over 700 trouble free hours on that engine. I pulled it out and listed it for sale just to see what would happen... guy offered $1500. That was a great investment in my book.

I'll also add, last weekend I was out and blew past my friend. He called me and thought I was running balls out but was just cruising around 33. His exact words were "I can't believe how much of the boat is out of the water, it looks really cool like that." I am looking forward to next season.
I am surprised that old of a boat didn't have transom rot.
 

Pmt133

Senior Chief Petty Officer
Joined
Jan 6, 2022
Messages
728
I am surprised that old of a boat didn't have transom rot.
Yeah... Doesn't mean there aren't spots with problems I can't see... But everything above the floor and around the transom assembly was good as far as drilling sample holes....
 
Top