Hard Starting Force

[Backlash]

Hi Guys,
A buddy has a '88 85hp Force with the following symptoms:
On the first start of the day, or after it has cooled down on the water, it won't start without first spraying pre-mix into the carbs. Once started it runs great.
He has rebuilt the carbs, checked the fuel system from tank to carbs & fuel is getting to the carbs, floats are not sticking closed.
Any ideas out there? Thanks in advance for the help.
Backlash

 

[rudedude]

Re: Hard Starting Force

It wont start after he pumps the fuel bulb?

And does the bulb get hard after pumping it up and stay hard?

Does the choke work?

 

[JB]

Re: Hard Starting Force

Sounds like a choke/procedure problem to me, Backlash.

If choke, check to see that the choke disk is closing completely when cold starting. If it is an electric choke it could be dead or sticking.

 

[Backlash]

Re: Hard Starting Force

Thanks for the replies.
Yes the bulb gets/stays hard. The electric choke works and closes completely when the key is depressed. Not sure what procedure he uses when starting......maybe that's where the problem lies. He claims that even after cranking for some time and then checking the plugs, they're dry indicating no fuel getting into the cylinders. I asked him about his starting procedures and he pumps the primer bulb until hard, sets the throttle about half open, depresses the key (activating the choke) and attempts to start. He further states that there's no primer system involved with choking. He has run a compression check which he reports as being "good" but didn't have the numbers. I'm kinda stumped.
Backlash

 

[roscoe]

Re: Hard Starting Force

May just need to advance the throttle a bit further, 3/4 is common.

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Hard Starting Force

With that engine, on a cold start, you MUST pull out the control handle OR press the center button and advance the throttle until the handle stops. Anything less, and you will not get advanced timing and carb opening to start the engine and warm up at about 1500 rpm.

If someone has had a poor idle and monkeyed with the idle stop screw and advanced it too far, then you will not get any advance no matter what you do and you must re-synchronize the carbs and timing.

 

[Backlash]

Re: Hard Starting Force

Many thanks to all who replied. I'm going to suggest that he follow the starting procedure Frank posted.
Backlash

 

[Frank Acampora]

Re: Hard Starting Force

Sometimes it takes a little while for things to percolate in my mind-- If the carbs have been removed and rebuilt, there is a possibility that the lower carb roller is not contacting the advance cam properly. This black roller is on an eccentric screw and should just touch the cam in neutral. If it is not touching the cam, then the carbs will not open that little bit for cold start. It is also imperative that the aluminum link bar is adjusted so all three carbs open equally.


And PLEASE---do not set the idle mixture screws too lean. They should all be equal and at LEAST 3/4 turn open from lightly seated--even if the idle is a little poor. Anything leaner (while it may improve idling) invites piston melting at full throttle or near full throttle positions.

If you need to re-synchronize carbs and timing, 36 bucks for a Clymers manual will be an excellent investment.