House Electric Question

[SlowlySinking]

In a house with 2 conductor wiring can you legally (NEC) install 3 terminal outlets if you add a jumper from the neutral side of the outlet to the ground terminal? The jumper would be solid conductor and the same size as the 2 conductor wiring and obviously inside the outlet box. Thanks, Ken

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

NO!!!!!, What is the type of wiring? is it a metal sheathed cable? romex?, knob/tube? Do not do what you suggested..

 

[craze1cars]

Re: House Electric Question

I believe one acceptable solution if you need a 3 prong is to install a GFCI outlet. But others here who are licensed may correct me.

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

Originally posted by craze1cars:<br /> I believe one acceptable solution if you need a 3 prong is to install a GFCI outlet. But others here who are licensed may correct me.

That is an option, but rather costly and might not be necessary depending on the type of wiring.

 

[deputydawg]

Re: House Electric Question

Yes you can run the wire like you asked.....but I would move far away right after doing this. Bad things could happen. <br /><br />You will be better off running new 3 terminal wire, or maybe run a third wire from the outlets to the breaker box.

 

[SlowlySinking]

Re: House Electric Question

The reason for doing this is to avoid using those 3 to 2 wire plug in adapters. I thought about checking the NEC but that's a tough book to follow, so, I wired outlet. When I flipped the breaker there was no flash, fire, or smoke, so far so good. Then I plugged in one of those 3 wire outlet checkers and the green lights said, no problems. Thanks to everyone who took the time to reply. Ken

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

when you start getting zapped by metal appliances, aluminum siding, or any metal object that is in contact with anything grounded you will want to undo what you just did. Please dont touch anything metal when using gardenhose or any sink or tub. Dont touch anything metal attached to the house while standing outside on the ground. please dont use anything with a 3 prong plug and exposed metal parts. I highly recomend you undo this before someone gets killed. There is a reason the neutral only gets bonded to the ground at the main panel. you have just induced current to ground. it will vary...but with certain normal houshold items plugged into that outlet or circuit....more than enough to make your ears smoke. Since you have no ground in the outlet...you become it. PLEASE undo and do correctly.

 

[deputydawg]

Re: House Electric Question

99 out of 100 things plugged into it will probably maybe not be so shocking, but that one time will be it. <br />I may be wrong, and someone correct me if I am but I believe this is how those stories about people getting zapped in the shower start. It will not be a serious shock, feels like each drop of water is a needle sticking you, but then again it could be, and has been to some people, fatal.

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

I went to a house bout a year ago....the guy did it to his outside outlet. It was a metal box mounted on alum siding. when he plugged in a weedwacker...sometimes he would get zapped when he touched the siding. I checked the voltage....90 volts from siding to ground. The whole outside of his house was energized. If he was bare footed....standing on damp ground....goodbye. you will get the same affect inside the house. picture an old metal toaster with a 3 prong plug. the current that used to go through the nuetral, back to the panel, then to the ground now has another path. Its going to take the easiest one. If you touching the metal sink and the toaster, and the sink has less resistance to ground than the multiple splices, and that old groundrod, you will get zapped.

 

[treedancer]

Re: House Electric Question

Slowly sinking you might want to read the bottoms of Deputy dogs post.

 

[stl]

Re: House Electric Question

I ran electric over to my work bench in the basement. I jumped off a ceramic light fixture. There was just a hot and neutral. I put it in a junction box. and tied the new ground to a water line. Everything tested just fine this has been two years ago. After reading this thread I got a little worried. Is this a dangerous scenorio?

 

[springhead]

Re: House Electric Question

Neutral must be isolated from equipment grounds,<br />Please for your safety undo that wiring now.<br /> An example of how small an amount of current it takes to kill; a 15 Watt night light draws about 125mA. <br />With the neutral hooked up to the ground, when you turn on whatever you have plugged into that outlet you will be sending current to the equipment.

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

Was the light fixture mounted to a metal box connected with metal conduit? If so, just attach it to the metal box with a screw. Make sure the conduit eventually makes it back to the panel unbroken. You can test this also by putting a volt meter on the hot, and the metal box, you should get 120v. If not, please describe in more detail.

 

[crab bait]

Re: House Electric Question

slowly sinking,, what you did is cool.. you outsmarted the tester-lite-thingy..<br /><br />an you created the ULTIMATE practical joke.. <br /><br />it'll be sooooo funny when kids,house guest, relatives go to use an appliance an WHAP dead.. <br /><br />it'll be sooo funny..!! stand back an clap with glee.. for you got them.. an got them good.. <br /><br />they never even saw it comming,,ha ha..

 

[stl]

Re: House Electric Question

It is in a metal box, but there was not metal conduit. The original wire just had a hot and neutral, with no ground. With the new wire I attatched the hot to the hot and the neutral to the neutral. This junction just so happened to be a half inch from the main water line so i attatched the new ground to the water line. If this is really that unsafe I will take it down, and think of something else. I thought this would be better than having an open ground, or running a two prong outlet with no ground.

 

[craze1cars]

Re: House Electric Question

Holy crimony! He did it anyway! Gotta love it when people have the intelligence to ask for advice, get a very firm and clear answer about possible death, and then promptly ignore the advice. <br /><br />Darwinism at work, maybe. Unfortunate reality is that an innocent bystander will be the most likely vicitim...<br /><br />Makes you really wonder how many homes out there are booby trapped much like this one. This post really underscores the importance of paying for a complete professional home inspection prior to buying your next home...

 

[stl]

Re: House Electric Question

Originally posted by craze1cars:<br /> Holy crimony! He did it anyway! Gotta love it when people have the intelligence to ask for advice, get a very firm and clear answer about possible death, and then promptly ignore the advice. <br /><br />Darwinism at work, maybe. Unfortunate reality is that an innocent bystander will be the most likely vicitim...<br /><br />Makes you really wonder how many homes out there are booby trapped much like this one. This post really underscores the importance of paying for a complete professional home inspection prior to buying your next home...

What are you talking about. This was something I did a couple of years ago. I didn't say I was not going to follow advice given here. A previous poster asked me to expand, so that is what I did

 

[Bondo]

Re: House Electric Question

Originally posted by stl:<br />

Originally posted by craze1cars:<br /> Holy crimony! He did it anyway! Gotta love it when people have the intelligence to ask for advice, get a very firm and clear answer about possible death, and then promptly ignore the advice. <br /><br />Darwinism at work, maybe. Unfortunate reality is that an innocent bystander will be the most likely vicitim...<br /><br />Makes you really wonder how many homes out there are booby trapped much like this one. This post really underscores the importance of paying for a complete professional home inspection prior to buying your next home...

What are you talking about. This was something I did a couple of years ago. I didn't say I was not going to follow advice given here. A previous poster asked me to expand, so that is what I did

stl,.......<br />He's talking about Slowly Sinking,...... Not You......<br /><br />I Think that in Your Case,........ It'll be Fine,......<br />You went to a True Ground with Your ground leg,.... Not back to the Common leg........

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

double post....MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!!

 

[divo]

Re: House Electric Question

Originally posted by divo:<br />

Originally posted by stl:<br /> It is in a metal box, but there was not metal conduit. The original wire just had a hot and neutral, with no ground. With the new wire I attatched the hot to the hot and the neutral to the neutral. This junction just so happened to be a half inch from the main water line so i attatched the new ground to the water line. If this is really that unsafe I will take it down, and think of something else. I thought this would be better than having an open ground, or running a two prong outlet with no ground.

Turn Light on, Take a volt meter and put one lead on the metal box ( make sure contact with metal), then take the lightbulb out and CAREFULLY touch the other lead to the center tab in the lamp socket without contacting the threads. If there is 120v there, connect ground wire to box. If no voltage, take lead off center tab and touch to the threads the bulb screws into. If it reads 120v, the fixture is reverse wired. Flop the wires on the fixture and connect ground to box. If no voltage in either test, the box isnt grounded. To do properly, and avoid any hassles in the future, this should be fixed. IMO this would be a inexpensive and easy fix that should be done.