Houston, we have a hull of a problem

[jgoeden]

While working on the trailer this past week, I noticed 2 major problems down low on the bottom side of the hull. *See the attached pics.

The one without the rollers is apparently from a screw that the previous jack*ss owner screwed down the doghouse with.

The second one with the roller confirmed my suspicion that roller trailers are junk and do not properly support the weight of the boat.

So, I'm converting to bunks and will need to get this repaired when I get the rollers off and have access to it. I'll be doing all of the repairs from underneath the boat.

My question is, will Marine Tex White do the trick for both of these. I have absolutely no glassing experience except from reading.

Another note, I only need this to last one season. The wife and I are buying a newer, nicer boat probably this winter so I just need my first "Starter" boat to last me one more season.

Advice???

 

[proshadetree]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Looks like glass work to me. No way I would try to half patch it with Marine Tex. Maybe some one else will be of more benefit than I. Looks like you need a full inner and outer repair to make that right.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Its not really how long your keeping the boat..one year..fix up then sell to someone else with a family kinda thing that bothers me..

So far from your pics it looks like the gelcoat on the bottom is WAY too thick..and cracking ( could be also that they missed the window of gel to skin coat ).

There is no real way to tell untill you start grinding.

I would investigate the cracks with grinding one edge of the cracks..about 3" down to raw glass ( get all that crap gel outa there ). Acetone wipe to see what your glass looks like under that gelcoat.

I will not go further into detail without pics of that.

YD.

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Well, thanks for your opinion YD that is an assumption that I am going to try and rip somebody off. I really appreciate you belittling me to that. I'll have you know that when I sell this crap boat (IF I do, I might run it off a cliff) I plan on being very thorough and honest. Or here's a thought, I could sell it to someone who wants to restore it or fix it up as a father-son project. Just a thought, so watch your comments.

Basically you want me to go grinding 3" deep into the bottom of my fiberglass hull before you give me advice on how to fix it. Hmmm, I doubt the fiberglass is even 3" thick.

Thanks for all your help. You might or might not be dang good at what you do, but I'm still trying to figure out what I did/said to warrant a response such as yours.

 

[Silverbullet555]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

I'm not a glass guy so I can't be sure, but it looks like those areas might have been exposed to water for quite some time. If this was something that just happened, I would be more along the thought process of a simple patch. With the exposure to water there are a lot of variable. The one on the keel doesn't look like it was caused by the rollers. More likely from beaching on rough beach that eventually caused a crack in the gel which eventually got bigger and bigger until a piece came out. Again, water instrusion and delamination is a serious concern which is why grinding is probably the best way to go.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Another note, I only need this to last one season. The wife and I are buying a newer, nicer boat probably this winter so I just need my first "Starter" boat to last me one more season.

No need to be offended jgeoden..

It just Ive seen that " I only need it to last a season" too many times. IF your going to fix it..it Will last more than a season .

As far as attacking/questioning your integrity with me saying "Its not really how long your keeping the boat..one year..fix up then sell to someone else with a family kinda thing that bothers me.." .. dont sweat it .

Your right.. it reads as if I dont trust you. Its not that I dont trust you..or that YOU would just fix and flip it to some unsuspecting family. I sometimes dont type out exactly what Im trying to convey.. sorry I have offended you.

Now..back to your repair .

I didnt mean to grind 3" deep lol.. 3" round grinding off the gel to the glass. This way you can see if it was damage from impact or just thick gel cracking.

No matter what..your going to be doing a repair thats going to last more than a season.

YD.

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Thanks Doc,

I accept and respect your apology. I was a little snippy too. This whole thing just has me so frustrated because I'm a decent honest person and I got hosed by a jerk in buying my first boat. So much crap I didn't notice. But also yeah you're right, if I get this fixed and my transom doesn't go out, it'll get me through a lot more than I want it to...

Anyways as you can tell, the rollers are covering it up right now, so as soon as I can get the new bunks on and access to it, I'll let you know what's going on and get some more pics.

Thanks again for the first steps, I'll report back soon. Might be a while though, full time school + working nights isn't a good mixture for doing stuff around the house and on the boat!!!

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

So...

To YD and all of the other glassers on here... just trying to get an idea of what I'm up for. (Please tell me small fiberglass repairs are/can be easy!!!)

I still have to get my bunks installed and the gelcoat grinded down so I can get you guys more pictures, but on a basic sense, is a "typical" (is there such a word in boating?) fiberglass repair done by me buying a nice Evercoat repair kit, grinding down into the glass a little, soaking some glass strips, laying them, let them cure, lay some more, add some filler, then spray/roll some gelcoat?

I've just been trying to do some reading and it sounds too simple for a complete/full-strength type of repair. As far as the issue with the screw coming through, if it is this simple, is the basic process to get that screw removed, grind a little down, wet some glass and pack it up in the hole?

Just trying to get some ideas of the most basic process of what I'm up against.

 

[vandentr]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

jgoeden,

Give it up, it ain't worth the hassle!

Go to Craigslist and find somebody that does glass/gel work on the side. These guys know lots of tricks and can deal with the issue much more efficiently and properly than most of us weekend handymen types - especially when the issue is below the water line.

Trust me on this, the peace of mind you'll have is worth every penny...

-TVB

 

[bonz_d]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

jgoeden, sorry to hear of your mislead purchase. It's always been buyer beware. Not everyone is always truthfull when trying to sell something. Hopefully you can get this sorted out, repaired, or as hard as it is to maybe just walk away from it. The limited pictures you posted do not show or tell the whole story of the condition of this boat. Though the ones that you did post, to me at least shows that this boat was not properly maintained and mostly abused. I also agree that the keel damage does not look to be the result of the trailer.

From my point of view there is not a thing wrong with roller trailers and have their advantages and disadvantages over bunk trailers. Either one can be improperly fitted or adjusted to the boat that they are supporting. Then when you ad in a boat that has been abused, left full of water or whatever and the structure of the hull starts to fail the type of trailer it is on has no bearing as to whether it is a good or bad design. Over the years I have seen so many mismatched boats and trailers that it makes me wonder how people get them in and out of the water yet alone how they get them down the road. But then this is a whole different discussion.

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Bonz, yeah I definitely have my moments and just want to sink this boat. Yeah this damn thing, come to later find out through investigating the titles and such, was donated to some place up in Wisconsin, then later auctioned for $800, then my seller bought it for $1200, did a couple hundred bucks in work to hide most everything and sold it to me for an even trade on my 2008 four-wheeler (valuing $2500 or more).

yeah it was definitely used and abused, lesson learned though. I just wanna get through 1 or 2 more seasons then I wanna buy a nice 21' deckboat I saw at the boat show!!

 

[bonz_d]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Yes a sad lesson. Over the past few years I've seen a number of boats advertised on graigslist and other places that were in such sad shape that they should have been retired and burned years ago. Others that had been so hacked up that there was no way they were seaworthy, such as your case were they would require more repair than they are practically worth. Sorry to say but as you've already figured it, you got the bad end of a deal. I do feel bad for you! Was this your 1st boat?

So the question remains, do you repair it or walk away. Post some more pictures and some of these fine people here could give you a better idea of what you've gotten into. Everything is repairable but at what cost I guess is my point. As a matter of fact I have a small glass rowboat here that I picked up as a project and am now pondering whether it's worth the effort and expense.

 

[Yacht Dr.]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

jgoeden .. Yes some repairs are simple to glass..others are not.

Your on a keel so that should be simple. I would stay away from "boxed" repair kits ..there not really intended for anything other than small jobs.

Not to say yours is Big ( that has to be determined yet ).

The screw repair.. Die grind the dead gel and tip of the screw below the surface and fill with Mohair or some kind of marine grade fiberglass filler. Then finish that off with gel.

YD.

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Thanks YD, that's some good news.

I've seen a repair kit that has 1 qt. of resin in it, thought that would be big enough for a lot of stuff!

But anyways no biggie if I have to buy separate products.

Anyways finally have some good weather this week, but no time... we'll see what happens. I'll go ahead and leave this thread alone until I get you guys some more pics! Thanks again for all the help and encouragement.

Bonz, after I fix these two bottom hull issues, I'm pretty darn confident that this thing will be fine at least for 2 seasons. There's just little stuff all over that need to be done. I'd just rather have a payment with a nice new boat, on warranty that I can baby and not wonder what the previous owner did. Plus the one I want has the 4.3L Merc with MPI, I really want a fuel injected! TIRED TIRED TIRED of tuning carbs! I spent ALL last summer dialing in the motor, just to find these hull issues.

So my question is...when the h*ll do I get to play? LOL!!!

Yes, my first boat. My next one will be my last, because I intend on making it last!!

 

[bonz_d]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Yes, my first boat. My next one will be my last, because I intend on making it last!!

Right! I've heard that one before. Until the next pretty blue boat comes along or 2' idest sets in. That's a horrible dease with no known cure.

Good to see your outlook has picked up. Remember, "it's only a hobby". Not like drinkin, drugs, gamblin or chasin women, though still fun they're much more exspensive. Just ask Charlie Sheen!

 

[6meter]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Your screw hole looks like a box kit repair. Should be easy. The other....a bit more involved. As said you need to put a grinder to it to see if it is solid. Not that I want to give you more work, but if the water got through the hull, how are your stringers and foam?

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Update: So I've got the trailer converted to bunks and now I have access to the area. I still have to get under there, grind down and report back but I really wanna get some supplies ordered because once I get some free time, I'll have to hit the project hard. My schedule doesn't have a lot of free space and trying to mix that with this Seattle like weather we have in Indy...you get the idea.

Ok so lets say the area to be grinded is 4x4" or 6x6", (roughly), how many yards of glass should I buy? 36" x 3 yards should be plenty right?

Also, how will I be laying this up? I'm trying to read and find answers but it's hard to find specifics. From what I've gathered probably alternate between CSM and 1708 biax? So maybe 3 yards of each with a gallon of resin?

Now, what type of resin? Poly seems cheaper (and better from what I gather). http://www.uscomposites.com/polyesters.html (highly recommended on other sites) has a 404 Tooling Poly that is used "extensively in boat hulls" according to the website. But also their B-440 Premium Polyester gets very good reviews.

Probably need a roller, filler (advise on that too, please) and some gelcoat and that's really about it. Oh yeah, definitely a respirator...

 

[jgoeden]

Re: Houston, we have a hull of a problem

Sorry to bump, what is some good stuff for hull repair? Is poly good? What kind? 404 Tooling or B-440?

What kind of glass should I get? Some 3/4 oz. CSM and some 1708 biax? Will that be strong enough?