I found white oil in the bellows today....

[glennj3]

Thanks Don for the help on the impeller.
I could not shift the shifter today, pulled the upper part of the outdrive off, found white oily stuff in the large bellows and the shifter cable was clogged up with a cream color hardened powder. Cleaned it all out, the shifter works smooth now but thinking about taking on the larger job of changing the bellows. Not sure where the water oil came from?

I understand I need a special star shaped device to remove the housing in order to get to the bellows, can I order that from this site or do I need to find one at my mechanics place?
I plan to order everything I need from this site so if you will list for me what all I may need.
One type of adhesive or two and where do I put it on the bellows?

Thanks again,
Glenn

 

[cr2k]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Are you talking about the yoke bolts? 18-9861 is the NAPA/Sierra Supply number for this tool. If you have oil in the bellows your input seal is bad. Water would be a bad bellows.

 

[MarkSee]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

see reply below.

Mark

 

[MarkSee]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

I understand I need a special star shaped device to remove the housing in order to get to the bellows, can I order that from this site or do I need to find one at my mechanics place?
I plan to order everything I need from this site so if you will list for me what all I may need.
One type of adhesive or two and where do I put it on the bellows?

Seems like you're talking about the hinge pin removal tool to remove the bell housing.

You'll really need to have the Mercruiser service manual on hand to get the job done; 1988 alpha1 should be manual #6.

Mark

 

[FreeBeeTony]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

You can use a 1/2" allen wrench for the hinge pins.

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Yes the hinge pen is what I would need to remove, the allen wrench would be easiest.
I have a mercruiser stern drive shop manual 1964-1985, the parts look about the same.
I also have an old boat section with the bell housing attatched to the wall so I can see just how it all works inside the boat and outside i.e. the shifter and tilt limit switches etc.
Now regarding the water/ oil in the universal joint shaft bellows," input seal", is this the seal up inside the upper unit that the drive shaft goes up into when joining the lower unit up to the upper? Mine does not look smooth, is this something I can change out or should I take it to the shop?
Sure don't know where the oil came from and don't understand where the water came from to mix with it??
Thanks,
Glenn

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

If I want to replace the shift cable, bellow, the nut that holds it in place is, not sure of the size, but I read that the socket needs to be thinned down so that it will fit around the nut and not stick. Can I buy a special socket to fit this?

 

[Don S]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

I have a mercruiser stern drive shop manual 1964-1985,

You don't have a Mercruiser shop manual, aftermarket Clymers or Seloc garbage maybe, but not Merc.

THIS is a Mercruiser service manual for your sterndrive. have no idea what you have for an engine.

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

You are so right, this manual is so clear, mine is vague to say the least!
Will get back with you, can I purchase this manual or just use the downloaded version?
Got any idea where oil and or water came from that I found in my bellows>

Glenn

 

[MarkSee]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

You are so right, this manual is so clear, mine is vague to say the least!
Will get back with you, can I purchase this manual or just use the downloaded version?
Got any idea where oil and or water came from that I found in my bellows>

I would just download it and save it which makes scanning through to find a specific topic pretty easy then print out sections if needed.

Normally water in the bellows is due to a hole in the bellows which means it will need to be replaced.
You'll want to check the gimbal bearing, ujoints, yoke for excessive rust and wear if water was in there.

Oil in the bellows is normally the front shaft seal will need replacing but a pressure test of the drive should also be done. Can find instructions for the pressure test in the STICKY section at the top of the forum.

Since you'll be ordering replacement parts there are also some tools you'll need so best to figure out everything at the beginning and place 1 order.

Mark

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Front Shaft seal, not sure which one that is, everything looked and felt good inside the bellows, just white oil in there. Hope to get into replacing the bellows this weekend if it does need replacing. If I can not find a tear or hole in it I would assume the oil and water came up from the outdrive shaft seal??

 

[achris]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

That 'white oil' is an emulsion of oil and water.

How was the oil in the drive? Milky or in good condition? if it was in good condition then the water in the bellows came from somewhere. Most likely a hole or tear in the bellows. The other possibility is that it made its way into the bellows from a leaking upper shift shaft seal, in the bell-housing. You also said there was white powder on the shift cable. Another indication of a bad shift shaft seal. Although you managed to clean it up, that shift cable has been compromised and should also be replaced.

If it were mine, or I was doing the job for a customer... Replace all of the following.
All three bellows, gimbal bearing, lower shift cable and upper shift shaft bell- housing seal. I would very carefully inspect the unis, with a view to replacing them.

The oil got in there from somewhere, most likely the front seal on the drive. I'd be taking the top part of the top half of the drive apart and replacing the seal and either speedie-sleeving or replacing the yoke too.

Chris......

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

The drive oil was normal, I have the outdrive separated and replaced the water impeller. I then pulled the upper drive off to get to the shift shaft, that is when I found the white oil/water in the bellows.
I am a little confused on all the parts named and their place. i.e. the front seal on the drive (is this the seal facing down and the shaft from the water impeller comes up into the upper?
Top part of the top half of the drive apart (you are talking about the very top of the drive with 4 or 5 bolts holding it on)? If I remove it I can see down into the gears? So the seal is the "O" ring? But the oil was fine in the outdrive so I must be confused.
Don't know what the speedie-sleeve is nor the yoke?
Sorry I don't know all these terms and parts but I will learn with the help of you and this forum!
Thanks,
Glenn
PS, not sure how to find the sticky section....

 

[achris]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Click here for STICKIES

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Phoned my mechanic today, said he would let me bring everything to his shop, he will furnish all tools and advice for me to repair the boat, no labor charge. Very nice of him, then he has been my mechanic for a very long time!
Thank you all for assisting me to understand what I am doing here so much better!

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Spent 5 hours at his place yesterday, pressure test failed upper and lower at least one direction. Replaced the upper drive shaft seals, o ring and oil seals.. Then checked the impeller, it was actualy missing the smaller water seal in the bottom housing! I have no idea who did that job or when, may explain why I have had a little overheating while running fast (not bad overheat but more than it normaly runs).
Heading back now to put it back into the boat and fine tune the shifter. Can't wait!

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Just an update, spent a few more hours with it today, the upper still had a compression leak on the suction end. I replaced the lower oil seal, did not know about the one above it (upper drive shaft), don't know why he did not tell me to replace it. None the less, I did not tear it back down to replace that one, he said it should be OK, just drain the oil after several trips and check for water.
Replaced the gimble bearing, brought her home, tweeked the shifter and she cranks and changes gear great.
Plan a trip to the lake tomorrow for a good test run, after some deep cleaning!

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

Update, spent about one and a half hours on the water today, two problems, one fresh water is coming into the engine well from some place in the back, no flashlight could not see exactly. I hit the Gimbel bearing for a long time trying to replace it Saturday. Maybe that could have shook the transom area enough to brake the seal?
Then the green antifreeze is oozing from the gasket between the reservoir and what ever it is attached to so need to get on that one!

Otherwise all went very well.

 

[glennj3]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

I removed the antifreeze reservoir to replace the blown gasket. Was expecting to see the thermostat. Not. I need to clarify the engine I have, I replaced the original 170 with the 160 Mercruiser, I thought they were all the same i.e. 160,170,470, guess not.
Can someone tell me where the thermostat is on this 160 MR?
Also could not find any water interring the rear while my son sprayed a jet of water all around the back of the outdrive. Any ideas other than returning to the lake?

 

[achris]

Re: I found white oil in the bellows today....

470 and 170 ARE the same, a Mercury Marine in-line 4 cylinder 3.7L Ford based engine. A 160 was a in-line 6 cylinder engine based on the GM250 cu. in block, used from 1967 to 1969, and most definitely NOT the same....

What is the engine serial number of what YOU are working on? And if you can, post photographs.

A lot of engines that have the same basis have been through MANY variations over the years. A 1977 350GM engine is the same engine as a current 350MPI, but there is no way many of the parts are interchangeable.

Chris......