Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

[BigwayNZ]

Ok, So I have been reading so many different opinions on the noises and meanings of alarms.

I have a Johnson 175 hp 2-stroke (VRO non existent) 1988 motor.

Bfore today my rectifier was stuffed. if i knew what I knew then I would not of had my rectifier catch fire. The tach never worked from day one.
On day one the motor died in the harbour. Started every now and then and then died. thought i nriefly heard an alarm for a millasecond.

Anyway, mechanic replaced everything to do with fuel, said motor was getting too hot due to being filled up with salt. also fuel line hole was too thin.
I think i was runing out of fuel and that why motor kept dying.

Anyway, Day two and rectifier catches fire.

Day, three new rectifier put on and tach works, even though when it was put on it was also discovered that one out of the three pins in the plug running to the tach was not in its hole. So not sure if it did not work cause of rectifier or cause i plugged it in wrong or if it was always plugged in wrong.
Also at same time mechaninc unceases the timing advance.

So boat was running awesome today, amazingly fast and i am super happy with the motor. So happy i have put off buying a bigger, newer motor.

Then all the sudden i get this ALARM of a constant high pitch sound when at WOT.

I check petrol and it is more or less empty. I put more petrol in and dont hear the alarm again.


I have been reading that a constant alarm means that it is overheating. Today for me it meant low fuel.


What do all the alarms mean that i will ever be able to har come from my outboard so that I know what each one means when i hear each one.




Also, my tach is going way off the clock, it seems and my mechanic says that it is not set correctly. He saw it idling at 2000rpm, took it home and it idled at 1500 rpm and then in gear it idled at 1000rpm. I have a feeling he just saw it when it was playing up for that once. But he reackons my tach is not set properly.
My tach at WOT can go right off the clock. My clock stops at 6000, it looks lie it wants to go to 10,000.
He tells me i have a RPM limiter set for 5800. who knows if it works or not.


So my tachs are VDO, real old white ones that go up to 6000.
It has 8 dip switches on the back and a number that reads 209-B. I cant find anywhere to set this thing. the only ones on the site are 3 dip switches. I need to set it for 12 pulses so i am told. is this correct?


Anyway, that is about all of my problems i think.


I would appreciate loads of comments and stuff for me to learn from.

I have read every single thread in this forum after searching 1988 Johnson 175.

Please teach me more and please comment on my issues.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

J/E Alarms

low oil alarm is a beep every 30 seconds. beep......................beep...................

no oil alarm is a beep every 1/2 second or so.beep,beep,beep

overheat alarm is a constant beep.beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

So why was i getting a constant beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep?
When i checked the fuel it was low to empty. i filled it up and the beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepp never came back.


Actually, I was WOT when i heard it. I stopped the motor. I then started it up again to look at the temp. temp was normal. I then took off again, when i reached max speed at WOT again it went off beeeeeeeeeeeeeep.

I then stopped to look at the fuel. Fuel was more or less empty, lowest for a long time anyway. it use to cut out with more than this in it. Anyway, i filled it up and off it went again and never heard the beep again.



So is there no alarm saying that fuel is low? Or does low fuel overheat the engine?

 

[seahorse5]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

So why was i getting a constant beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep?
When i checked the fuel it was low to empty. i filled it up and the beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepp never came back.


Actually, I was WOT when i heard it. I stopped the motor. I then started it up again to look at the temp. temp was normal. I then took off again, when i reached max speed at WOT again it went off beeeeeeeeeeeeeep.


So is there no alarm saying that fuel is low? Or does low fuel overheat the engine?

There are 4 types of alarms on your motor, not 3. The 4th is a fuel restriction warning that sounds the buzzer as a constant tone if the vacuum in the fuel system gets too high. Usually it buzzes at or near full speed when the fuel used is the highest.

The difference between the fuel restriction and an overheat warning, since both are a constant tone, is that an overheat automatically slows your motor down to about 2500 rpm right away, to help protect it from "meltdown".

Make sure there are locknuts on the battery terminals and not finger-tightened wing nuts. Loose or corroded connections will damage the rectifier.

Your tach may have a selector switch on the back of it. It should be sent to 6 if it is an outboard tach. If it is not a Johnson or Evinrude tach, then contact the manufacturer for the setting.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

what i'm saying is that the alarm you heard was an over heat alarm. when was the last time the impeller has been changed, water pump rebuilt, or thermostats checked.? a worn impeller may not be able to pump enough water, to cool the engine at WOT, when you slowed the pump was able to pick back up. with vro removed there is not alarm for low fuel.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

So the guy above you says it was a fuel alarm from the vacum too high cause there was no gas and then you are saying that there is no fuel alarm....... so who is right and how come it stopped when i put fuel in?

Im not arguing, just getting told two different things and trying to find out what or who is right.


My motor has been fully serviced a month ago and just had a mechanic go all over it two days ago when he put the new rectifier on.

Rectifier was due to loose terminals from wingnuts and dirty leads.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

what i'm saying is that the alarm you heard was an over heat alarm. when was the last time the impeller has been changed, water pump rebuilt, or thermostats checked.? a worn impeller may not be able to pump enough water, to cool the engine at WOT, when you slowed the pump was able to pick back up. with vro removed there is not alarm for low fuel.

Fair enough, have you taken into consideration that i had just started at WOT after teaching someone to ski, we were taking off, about 30 seconds into our journey at WOT from stand still, it went off. I stopped. The instantly started again and straight to WOT, it went off within 10 seconds.
I stopped. Filled up 5 gallons and straight back to WOT, never heard it again.

Would seem to be a fuel alarm no?


Are you 100% positive it is not?


I am not saying i think you are wrong, im just making sure as you can imagine one would when there is contradicting posts.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

fully serviced, does not mean they did the water pump, and tstat. you need to look at your reciept, these the impeller needs to be changed every 2 years, tstat check every 2 years.

a " fuel restriction " is just that, not low fuel. a restriction is that the fuel pump is working too hard. there are only a few reasons, that would happen, vent close on fuel tank, kink in hose. blockage in fuel filter. if you were having a fuel restriction, it would have sounded several time when you were running WOT. before you were low on fuel. you also could have picked up some trash or the water intake, blocking the flow. you also could have trimmed the motor too far up, and the motor lost it's water pick up.. but i still stand that you overheated.

 

[Faztbullet]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

If some one just unplugged the harness from VRO or replaced pump with the manual style to make it premix engine, it still has the vacuum switch for fuel restriction as it is plumbed before the pump no matter what style fuel pump used(except electric)so you still could get the 4th alarm. I would tend to agree that impeller needs servicing but since the engine is a salty dog the t-stats and pressure valves may be sticking also. If it is a bubbleback exhaust you can have build up internally which will restrict water flow(to slow to exit) and trigger overheat alarms.

 

[seahorse5]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

There is no LOW FUEL alarm in the motor anywhere. There is a fuel restriction alarm as I explained earlier. Depending on what is causing the fuel restriction, it can be intermittent. It is most often noticed at high speeds due to the increased fuel consumption of the engine. A restriction may allow a small amount of fuel thru the motor, but when it needs a large volume of gas, the "suction" in the line gets too high and sets off the vacuum switch alarm, a steady buzz.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

If some one just unplugged the harness from VRO or replaced pump with the manual style to make it premix engine, it still has the vacuum switch for fuel restriction as it is plumbed before the pump no matter what style fuel pump used(except electric)so you still could get the 4th alarm. I would tend to agree that impeller needs servicing but since the engine is a salty dog the t-stats and pressure valves may be sticking also. If it is a bubbleback exhaust you can have build up internally which will restrict water flow(to slow to exit) and trigger overheat alarms.

All these blockages have been delt with. The thermo was well blocked with salt.
The impeller has also been replaced a month ago as well as all the fuel lines and entire fuel system.

So the fuel restriction alarm, can that not be caused from it having low fuel and not enough getting to the motor because it is low? IS that not classed as a restriction of fuel? When it is low it is sucking the petrol and not getting enough tricking the motor into thinking there is a blockage? Does it not work this way?>

 

[ezeke]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

The fuel restriction alarm is from a vacuum switch in the fuel line near the fuel pump.

If the gasoline flow is restricted by too small hose, blocked fuel tank vent or bad anti-siphon valve, etc., the vacuum switch closes the circuit to ground and signals a constant alarm.

On the other hand;

If the motor runs with air in the line from a nearly empty tank, quick turns, or from air leaks in the fuel system, the engine can run lean and overheat quickly, even to the point of destroying the engine. That would also trigger the constant alarm but it would be from one or both of the of the overheat switches.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

So what would you imagine ti to be if this is the case....

Fuel hose replaced so it has right size hole in it.
teaching someone to water ski, stop starting for an hour. Start the boat after they are in the boat and do a huge 270 degree turn at speed and take off on way home WOT, 10 seconds into WOT and alarm goes off., I stop engine with key. Then i think, lets see if it does again while in back of my head i think i am low on gas and remember last time just before i ran out of gas the same alarm went off. I start boat and take off at WOT after a big turn, 5-10 seconds in and alarm goes off. I stop boat with key again.

I fill up petrol, 5 minutes later and I start boat and take off at WOT for about 10 minutes, not alarm at all.


It has done this before when i ran out of gas. So it says to me that running out of gas is either having an alarm, this thread has proved that wrong, or it overheats cause i am running out of petrol. When i say low on gas i mean, it would have stopped in about a minute as there was only a couple of cms of gas in the bottom of the aluminum tank. it was empty. Or the fuel vacum is sucking out air in the fuel tank cause there is no gas for it to suck out.


I am not trying to argue at all, just get a correct diagnosis cause i have been to the mechanics so often lately and they have done everything they can for my motor.

New rectifier, new fuel lines, new water pump and it was running perfectly until i was running out of gas and an alarm sounded like it has before.
IS it just a coincidence that i am running out of gas when my alarm goes off?

 

[ezeke]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

When too much air is introduced into the fuel/air mix, the fire is much, much hotter than when correctly mixed; in fact, it is hot enough to literally melt the pistons. In short, get a bigger tank or make more pit stops.

It does not take long to do serious damage, but you should notice a rather sudden increase in power just before the overheat goes off if that is the problem.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

There was no decrease in power when the alarm went off.

However, I took it out today and ran it out of gas to see if the alarm would go off. The thing is i ran out instantly at a slow speed. No Alarm.

So what i figure is that if i am going at a fast speed and it is running out of gas the alarm may go off because it is overheating due to lack of fuel and alot of air?

Would that sound right?

My motor when i flushed it today was for about 5-10 minutes and the water from the tell tale was warm and did not taste of any salt.
I was trying to read the temperature gauge, problem is the temp gauge was not connected due to earlier on when doing some work. I then connected it 10 minutes after flushing it and the temp gauge read 160.

What should my temp gauge be reading? What are the safe temperatures at the different speeds, i.e. WOT, Flushing. idling?


As I said, last time it went in the motor was too hot to hold your hand on it, they ended up clearing the thermostat as it was blocked with salt. (i had just purchased it). The motor is not too hot to hold your hand on it but i am now worried after this alarm had gone off the other day.

What do i need to do and what do i need to say to the mechanic for him to know what to do?

What would you guys suggest doing? Seeing it isan old motor, i have already changed all fuel everything and rectifier after it caught alight. What else should i just change for the sake of changing it to be on the safe side?
Also, the things you should say i should change..... What of those can i do myself?
The reason i ask this is because mechanics here charge $70-$80 per hour for labour.
For example, I had my rectifier changed the other day, total price was $520 AUD. the part alone cost $309 AUD. He also changed a coil that had broken.



So, what are the parts of the motor i should replace rather than wait until something goes wrong. And chnging these parts you are about to advise me, what will this ensure does not happen?

I really dont want my motor to need a major rebuild anytime soon or major money spent on it so what can we change, and what does that leave unchanged and what can i do myself. I am pretty good at doing the basic things under instruction but opening up a motor is a different story.


I really appreciate the time

 

[Cricket Too]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

OK, listen, first thing you should do if you want to do any of your own work is get a factory manual for your engine, read up and use it as a guide for anything you want to fix/replace....in the future.

Secondly, listen to the guys on this board closley, and take their advise, as most of them are either profesionals or may even know more than most professionals.

From reading this whole thread, I would say that you have already gotten your answers, and don't need to replace anything else.

What your mechanic did sounds very good, replaced the T-stats and water pump, those are two key things to keeping and engine running well, and cool. Also he installed the correct fuel lines, and hopefully you have a good fuel/water separator installed as well.

Now your alarm issue, is one of two things, if not possibly both. It could very well be an overheat alarm as was described or the fuel restriction alarm. You should try as hard as you can to never run any engine out of fuel at WOT, especially a 2 stroke, as running out of fuel is also running out of lubrication, and by no means ever do it intentionally....that is not a good diagnostic technique.

It was mentioned above that if you overheated at WOT your engine would drop RPM down to 2500 automatically to prevent damage....that isn't true for your engine, that is only on on engines equipped with the S.L.O.W. feature, not sure of the years but I believe it is on engines that are also equipped with Quickstart. A motor from 1988 I doubt will have SLOW installed, I know my '97 doesn't have it.

So you are either getting and overheat or fuel restriction alarm or both. In either case, your fix is to not run it out if fuel. As was mentioned either get a bigger fuel tank or make sure you have a full tank everytime you go out, and keep an eye on it.

Keep fuel in it and good TC-W3 oil in that fuel and you will be treating it right, since you already have your cooling system taken care of, for now. Enjoy it.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

OK, listen, first thing you should do if you want to do any of your own work is get a factory manual for your engine, read up and use it as a guide for anything you want to fix/replace....in the future.

Secondly, listen to the guys on this board closley, and take their advise, as most of them are either profesionals or may even know more than most professionals.

From reading this whole thread, I would say that you have already gotten your answers, and don't need to replace anything else.

What your mechanic did sounds very good, replaced the T-stats and water pump, those are two key things to keeping and engine running well, and cool. Also he installed the correct fuel lines, and hopefully you have a good fuel/water separator installed as well.

Now your alarm issue, is one of two things, if not possibly both. It could very well be an overheat alarm as was described or the fuel restriction alarm. You should try as hard as you can to never run any engine out of fuel at WOT, especially a 2 stroke, as running out of fuel is also running out of lubrication, and by no means ever do it intentionally....that is not a good diagnostic technique.

It was mentioned above that if you overheated at WOT your engine would drop RPM down to 2500 automatically to prevent damage....that isn't true for your engine, that is only on on engines equipped with the S.L.O.W. feature, not sure of the years but I believe it is on engines that are also equipped with Quickstart. A motor from 1988 I doubt will have SLOW installed, I know my '97 doesn't have it.

So you are either getting and overheat or fuel restriction alarm or both. In either case, your fix is to not run it out if fuel. As was mentioned either get a bigger fuel tank or make sure you have a full tank everytime you go out, and keep an eye on it.

Keep fuel in it and good TC-W3 oil in that fuel and you will be treating it right, since you already have your cooling system taken care of, for now. Enjoy it.

Thanks mate.
Believe me, it may not sound like it but i am listening to everything that is said in these forums as i know my place. If it sounds like I am arguing, I am only arguing a case so that the answers that come back from my questions give me the understanding that I need. Not to say that i think what they are saying is wrong, just to 'clarify' things for my understanding.

I appreciate your reply because you have told me my motor will not SLOW and that has been bugging me because others saying that is what happens when it did not happen to me so it eliminated in my mind that it was overheating. Now I can accept it was. Especially seeing i think the Motor has the wrong pitch on it and is over revving. This would make sense.

Also, I appreciate the dont run it out of gas thing you are telling me as it did not occure to me that it is running out of lubrication as well, and it does not take a mechanic to understand how that is a bad thing.

Also, I have nearly read every single thread related to johnson motors with a horsepower of 150+ on this site as I am dead serious about learning everything I can about my motor.

Thanks for your reply, I am going to take it back to my mechanic once my new gauges arrive so i can set them myself and make sure that it is not over revving and get my mechanic to take a close look at the overheating issue in case something is standing out.

Cheers.

 

[jonesg]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

I'd put my money on overheat due to leaning out, due to running out of fuel.
They can produce gobs of extra power as they go lean, ....just before the piston melts.!

You gotta stay on top of all the systems in these engines
Good advise was to get the factory manual, go through the engine from top to bottom yourself with help from the experts here, they know their stuff.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

I have the shop manual for about 3 weeks now and have read probably 70% of it.

 

[BigwayNZ]

Re: Johnson Alarms (please feed this sponge)

What is the right temperature range this motor should be running at?

JUst went out today with brand new gauges, everything is going so damn well. Stoked to see my last gauge was set wrong and now my motor is showing me at 5200rpm mx and 60mph fully maxed out.

However, the water temp only has a black lead connected to it plus my positive and negative and it is reading 200 degrees and will not go down below that, the water is only luke warm at about 220 but at 200 it is coldish.

I thought i read somewhere it wants to run at 140??

Any advice please guys....