Legal Type Question

[Ret USN CPO]

Okay, I have a question that I'm sure someone has come across in their boating lifetime.

I have two teenagers. They have friends. Naturally, they want to invite their friends out on our boat, and naturally we want everyone to have a good time. We water ski and do some tubing.

Now the question. Should I have the parents of our kids friends sign some kind of liability waiver to protect us should something unforeseen happen? We don't take unnecessary risks, have all required protective/safety equipment, insurance, and always follow the rules, but accidents happen. I just don't want an accident to ruin my financial future because someone may take advantage of an unfortunate situation.

Any suggestions or sea stories?

Thanks.

 

[Bigprairie1]

Re: Legal Type Question

Wow, I guess this is what happens when the 'Golden Rule' comes home to roost.
I suppose the short answer is yes, you probably are liable on some level just as you are to the dinner/bbq guests you might have this summer. Or the mail man coming up the walk to your house.
Short of a major lock down on all social interaction you might want to talk with your lawyer as to drawing up a standardized release document that you could have guests fill out and sign. Perhaps a neighbour or other boater could then witness it.
Strange days.....a rather odd question but probably not of range lately.
Or...you could just 'wing it', be responsible about your activities and behavior and your life will probably unfold successfully without a lawsuit.
Other people are trying this as we speak (or post...)
Good Luck.
BP

 

[BoatBuoy]

Re: Legal Type Question

Many folks are now opting for a million dollar or mega-liability policy to cover the whatever situation. I don't think they're prohibitively expensive as many school teachers have them.

 

[tashasdaddy]

Re: Legal Type Question

that is what insurance is for. just get enough.

 

[kenmyfam]

Re: Legal Type Question

Ditto the insurance statement from T/D

 

[bjcsc]

Re: Legal Type Question

I agree with TD, that's the reason you have insurance. You can get insurance for a year cheaper than you can get your waiver written. Most liability waivers do not hold up in court if negligence is claimed/proven. You can bet any attorney that would take a case like that would know exactly how to get right through any type of waiver you could come up with...

 

[Drowned Rat]

Re: Legal Type Question

Agree that insurance is your only route. A liability waiver would mean absolutely nothing if a minor was hurt while under your supervision. It is sad people need to worry about stuff like this.

 

[arks]

Re: Legal Type Question

Ask your agent for an "umbrella" liability policy. I've had one for over 20 years ($1M).
It provides liability coverage for all owned property (real estate, cars, boats, motorcycles, etc). If you own a lot of "things", a single umbrella is more cost-effective than separate liability coverage on each item. Once you have the umbrella policy, make sure your agent removes liability coverage from all your other policies- it's not needed!

 

[Don S]

Re: Legal Type Question

While having insurance is manditory if want to take someone elses kids out on your boat, I would at least contact the parents in a friendly manner, and ask their permission to take their kids out. That would eliminate any problems of the kids saying "mom says it's ok" when in fact they weren't even asked.

 

[Ret USN CPO]

Re: Legal Type Question

Yeah, I think it sux that I even have to broach this question. But with the sue happy society we live in...

Anyway...I will check into the umbrella policy. Sounds like it might be a good idea. And NO WAY do I let ANY kids on the boat without a face to face with mom and/or dad first.

Thanks for all the advice.

 

[WizeOne]

Re: Legal Type Question

Ask your agent for an "umbrella" liability policy. I've had one for over 20 years ($1M).
It provides liability coverage for all owned property (real estate, cars, boats, motorcycles, etc). If you own a lot of "things", a single umbrella is more cost-effective than separate liability coverage on each item. Once you have the umbrella policy, make sure your agent removes liability coverage from all your other policies- it's not needed!

I would make sure that you understand 'umbrella' very closely. In my experience they do not act as a stand alone liability policy for things that insurance companies have specific coverages for. In other words if you do not have a home liability policy and you have a claim, an 'umbrella' will not kick in. It will only kick in when the limits of your primary policy top out. Same goes for car policies and I am sure boat, motorcyle, etc.

Just do your due diligence. Different insurance companies may due things differently.

 

[External Combustion]

Re: Legal Type Question

Never mention your insurance coverage to anyone outside of the family and younger children need not know either. Unfortunately I personally know of a couple that I would call "incident shoppers" that seem to have accidents only in the homes of those well off or adequately insured. My agent tells me this is not uncommon these days. "Jackpot justice" I think it is called.

The phrase used to be out of sight out of mind; now I think we should add out of mind, out of court.

 

[bjcsc]

Re: Legal Type Question

I would make sure that you understand 'umbrella' very closely. In my experience they do not act as a stand alone liability policy for things that insurance companies have specific coverages for. In other words if you do not have a home liability policy and you have a claim, an 'umbrella' will not kick in. It will only kick in when the limits of your primary policy top out. Same goes for car policies and I am sure boat, motorcyle, etc.

Just do your due diligence. Different insurance companies may due things differently.

That's exactly how they work...if you don't have a primary policy the umbrella policy does not apply...they are supplemental. Most do not pay for punitive damages, either...

arks: you better check to see if you have any insurance...

 

[arks]

Re: Legal Type Question

You guys are correct- I should've said "make sure your agent removes ANY EXCESS liability coverage from all your other policies".....my state (and I'm sure a lot of others) require a certain minimum liability value to be written into the policies. The umbrella kicks in after the policy is exhausted.

Sorry to misinform- I got that insurance a loooong time ago and my memory isn't what it was.

 

[kenmyfam]

Re: Legal Type Question

Ask your agent for an "umbrella" liability policy. I've had one for over 20 years ($1M).
It provides liability coverage for all owned property (real estate, cars, boats, motorcycles, etc). If you own a lot of "things", a single umbrella is more cost-effective than separate liability coverage on each item. Once you have the umbrella policy, make sure your agent removes liability coverage from all your other policies- it's not needed!

We have a similar thing. One policy covers all. I have to inform them what I have though and when i get it.

 

[Nandy]

Re: Legal Type Question

I rather just not take kids other than mine. I know I am not too popular when I say no, but I just dont want the responsability. If something happened, no mater how much insurance I have, I could not live with it.

 

[jay_merrill]

Re: Legal Type Question

I'm not an attorney, nor do I play one on TV, but I think I remember something about a parent not being able to sign away the rights of a minor. And, as mentioned by someone else, there is also the issue of "gross negligence." That is not to say that you would be grossly negligent, but you can bet that an attorney, who might be looking for a nice paycheck from an award against you, will try very hard to suggest that you were.

The best that you can do is to insure yourself properly and make whatever decision seems prudent about taking other people's kids for a day in the boat.

 

[SgtMaj]

Re: Legal Type Question

As stated before... a mil or two umbrella policy is a good idea... they are pretty cheap anyway.

You could also have both the parents and kids sign a waiver to discourage them from suing, but it wouldn't stand up if challenged in court. Although you could turn it into more of a contract and having it stipulate the specific safety measures you expect them to take, which would give you some protection in court if they were injured as a direct result of not doing one or more of those things they agreed to do.

But it's better to just get the insurance.

 

[Bondo]

Re: Legal Type Question

Should I have the parents of our kids friends sign some kind of liability waiver to protect us should something unforeseen happen? We don't take unnecessary risks,

Ayuh,....

as noted above,....
That piece of paper will mean Absolutely Nothing in a court of Law.......