Looking to buy, need some advice

[Trim]

I am planning to buy a boat in the coming months, will be my first. I have talked to a few people and done some research on my own but would like some input from some more experienced boaters. I want a used bowrider and would like to stay below 15k, have a 4.3 and somewhere between 18-21 foot, longer if feasible. I was told not to go anything older than a 04-05 just because of the problems you might face with an older boat. I've heard Bayliners are made cheap but Ive also read they are made better these days. I know the Sea Rays, Four Winns, Crownlines, ect...are good boats just want some suggestions. Thanks for any help!!

 

[DBreskin]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

The condition of a boat more than 5 years old is as much dependent on the owner as the manufacturer. A well cared for 2000 Bayliner may be in better shape than a neglected 2008 Sea Ray.

If you go bigger than 21 feet, a 4.3L engine will be too weak.

I bought my well cared for 1992 Four Winns in 2009 and it looks like it's only 3 years old. Good luck!

 

[southkogs]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Hey Trim, welcome aboard!

Breskin is right - more about condition than brand most of the time. All things being equal, you named some good names - but it also depends on what you want to do with it. If you're a "park n' play" type - get something with a great swim platform & sun deck; if you like to fish a little more - a more "utility" type of deck; if ... then ... if ... then ... rinse and repeat.

Some guys post links to boats they're lookin' at too. If you want about 1,000,000 opinions ... go for it

 

[roscoe]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Not knowing your location (because new members seem to be reluctant to post such "personal information'), Its hard to tell what you could buy in that price range.

But, in most of the US, you could buy just about anything you want.

Personally, I would drop the price range down to $10,000, and save the cash for the extras you will want, and the INEVITABLE repairs and maintenance that you will have to perform.

Hire a surveyor or competent mechanic to check it out for you. Not the mechanic at the dealership selling the boat.

10k buys a lot of boat in todays market after 4 years of bad economy.


These samples are overpriced in my opinion, but would give you an idea.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Clea..._Motorboats&hash=item35b8ac6238#ht_500wt_1182


http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003..._Motorboats&hash=item41617314f5#ht_500wt_1182



I really like this one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Chap..._Motorboats&hash=item3f12a1d094#ht_500wt_1182

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

You can't count Bayliner out anymore, they build a nice boat and their quality is fine. They may not have the fit and finish of a Crownline(sorry I'm biased) but a fine boat none the less.

I agree that 15K for your first boat is a huge amount of money to pay for a a boat your likely to ding up and I would suggest cutting that number to 10K as suggested(depending on where you are) and you should find good boats. Chapparral is another good boat.

Please remember that as far as used boats are concerned your looking for a great previous owner more then a great boat, great boats with POS owners are POS boats make sense? Great owners can have a 15 yr old boat that is in better shape then 2 yr old boats with POS owners, so while your friends advise to stay away from older boats understand that you can likely find more boat in your price range that had a great owner and make your friends drool but as I said earlier I think your better off waiting a couple years and get your sea legs under you.

For your first boat your looking for a boat that you can purchase at a good price that will allow you to sell it after a couple years and get your money out of it. If Boating anchors itself into you and your family then you will get twofootitis, very common,, so common in fact that I would say its just the way it is, but you need to realize that you and your family need to learn a few things about boating and learning these things on a gem of a boat hurts more then it will a boat that has a little more "character" to it, its a fine line to draw when you consider your price point and goals were setting for you.

We would also like to know more about you though, your family, what your likely to use the boat on and where, give us some info and you will get more information then you will believe.

For instance, if you have small children you may want to look at small cuddy's as they give your children a place to nap. You may have considered this but we don't know that. You say your looking at Bow riders so a majority of us are thinking your looking at a lake boat, we don't know so whats the scoop?

 

[Trim]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Thanks for all the advice guys. I live on Grand Lake in Oklahoma. The boat will mainly be used for tubing and skiing, maybe some fishing here and there. I dont have any kids so it will be just myself and some friends using the boat. 10K sounds nicer than 15K if I can get a good quality boat. I had been told that the Bayliners were made with more wood than other boats and that was a concern with durability and lasting power?

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Wood in boats is the way it is, so long as the boat is cared for properly wood shouldn't be an issue, when they find a good product that performs as wood does it will take over the industry, but that's not now. You can find bashers of nearly every make of boat out there, its a Ford vs. Chevy debate that will just cause you to waste time, focus on the owners maintenance habits of the boat your interested in purchasing the overall condition of the boat and then the manufacturer and you will find a good boat for you.

How old are you? Married? Grand Lake is on my Bucket list, If you have friends with boats you could knock some time off the curve by getting seat time in a friends boat, the reason why I am asking is women like sundecks, just the way it is, a flat comfortable place to sunbathe on the water. something to think about if that's in the mix. Problem is Sundecks are on bigger boats....

Typically I suggest at least a V8 for watersports as its my opinion that you will be happier with the performance of a V8 pulling a tube then you will be a 4.3L if your into aggressive tubing, the benefits of a 4.3L gas savings will be thrown out the window if you have it floored constantly. But I can't argue with the fuel economy of a 4.3L they just sip gas compared to my 7.4L.

 

[Trim]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

You definitely need to visit Grand Lake sometime, it is extremely nice. I have been out many times on my friends boat just want the liberty to go out whenever I want. I'm 30 and single but do have a girlfriend. Thanks for the help!

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

ok stop saying thanks, you will be cursing us in a year LOL!!

I think your on the right track, next step I would suggest is post some ads of boats your interested in and we can pick them apart or give you our opinion on the boat/boats specifically, any known issues etc.

There is an old saying that boat owners have two great days, when the first buy their boat and when they sell it, another is BOAT Stands for Break Out Another Thousand, they go on and on but understand that these are typically owners/former owners that just flat got taken, people don't realize how much care a boat needs to last, personal pride in a boat is huge so finding an owner that has the pride in his boat is the owner your looking for, I hate to say it but taking advantage of someones personal financial issues is a very real possibility for you in your situation, guy has his pride and joy, has to sell it or lose his house since he just lost his job, the economy is bad so we see this all the time now but this is clearly a great time for you to be a buyer!

 

[halfmoa]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Personally, I would drop the price range down to $10,000, and save the cash for the extras you will want, and the INEVITABLE repairs and maintenance that you will have to perform.

Probably the best advice so far!

I also heard a piece of advice about buying a boat that I'll pass on to you. If the boat is out of the water ask to hear the boat fire up and idle for a minute or so. If the owner doesn't put flush muffs on the boat when they start it, walk away. It's pretty indicative of how much respect/knowledge they've got of their boat if they don't run water to it when they start it up...

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

To be completely honest for every 1 story we get here, where a buyer got a good deal on a quality used boat there are 5 or 6 that the buyer got taken, TO THE CLEANERS!! To those of us that have boating blood or are lifetime boaters seeing people get taken just tarnishes the experience and gives boating a bad slant, we take it personally. So, helping a new owner get off on the right track is something we take very seriously, of course as I stated earlier you will always get the Ford vs Chevy debate its the nature of us, I think My Crownline is the greatest boat of all time, I love it and highly suggest everyone in North America get one.... But reality is New boat owners have to get past the I want this manufacturer of boat and more into I have been advised to look for this, and this, and this. Once you have narrowed your search down to a couple boats your really "into" then things get good, A Marine Surveyor, or a well educated Boater should go with you, a lake test is a must, then the personal side, which one has your heart. Money is simple at this point, leaving the Lady at home is my opinion when negotiating price since women have a hard time controlling their emotions, good if they hate the boat but horrible if they love it(ask me how I know).

 

[halfmoa]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Since Lipp is recommending Crownline....15K would buy a really nice Starcraft.


Just sayin...

 

[wgl333]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

I think Lipp touched on a very good point....outside of sea trials and surveys.....pay attention to the owner's pride. How much does he rave about the boat, how much work he has done himself or had done and has all the paperwork kept NEATLY in a file folder. If you go to look at a boat at a residence, what shape are all his other "toys" in? His garage...neat, organized? These can be tell tale (but not tell all) signs. I bought my boat (my first) in Upstate NY in January so obviously sea-trial wasn't an option....but, we were on the phone for about 25 minutes (he was talking, almost bragging) and I was listening. Took the drive to his home and it was in great shape, garage was embarrassingly clean and organized...the boat, even though it was a '95 was well covered and clean....everything he said it was! Those things went a long way towards me being comfortable enough to buy the boat at his price (with some extras included)....I got lucky! Try to avoid short cuts in your search, but, your eyes and instincts can help shave time off of your search and hopefully save you some money and headaches later, too! Good luck!

 

[Trim]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Lots of advice I would have never even thought of. I've had a good friend introduce me to a man that owns a boat retail store in town and I got a pretty good feeling from him. He seemed pretty genuine and is helping me find a boat that fits my needs. At this point that is about the best way I know how to go about it.

I've also been looking on ebay and craigslist but I'm a little worried buying from someone I don't know. Like you guys said you could get taken.

 

[BRICH1260]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

I agree with scaling back on the purchase price. You will be able to find a nice first boat with what you have to spend. Use the rest of the money for the sales taxes,registration, new tires, and add ons and accessories that you will inevitabely want to buy to make their boat, your boat.

 

[tpenfield]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Here are some web sites, if have not looked at them already . . .

www.boats.com

www.boattraderonline.com

Use the search feature and see what $15 - $20K will buy you in the intended size range, then figure that you can get those boats for $10 -$15K. 5-7 year old boat is basically still 'new' IMHO. 10+ years is getting to be 'used' and then possibly old at 15+ years. Many folks on this forum have some 'old' boats that are still in great condition.

I'll sell you my boat for $15K, but it is a bit out of your intended range for age, and is a bit bigger than you indicated as your preference.

The more boats that you can look at the better. This time of year is may be difficult to do that in the colder climates. Just be patient, don't try to satisfy this urge too quickly, as the other have said, you may get stuck with something.

You will learn with each boat that you look at, and the various brand names will start to fall into order as far as fair, good, better, best, and "bestest".

 

[jkust]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

My take on the age is that I would only buy one that is in top condition so to me the age is more about the style of the boat. 1990's boats look like, well, 1990's boats while early 2000's boats can pass as late 2000's boats given how slow manufacturers are to change hulls. In other words with some manufacturers, a early to mid 2000's boat is maybe 90-95% the same as a 2008 or 2009 but a lot cheaper. In the last couple years some of the manufacturer boats have taken that leap to looking even more contemporary. The engines have changed very little in that time frame with the exception of the introduction of MPI in 02ish. I will parrot what some said above that a 21 foot boat will need more than a 4.3 but likely wouldn't have a v6 anyway. The beauty of the v6 is it is a really nice mid point between the 3.0 with its very low power and torque and even a 5.0 with its slightly more hp (carbed not mpi) and additional torque. The beauty is that the 4.3 gets phenominal mileage, generally as good as a 3.0 in the same boat while the 5.0, or 5.7 really start to ding your fuel efficiency. My last comment is in regard to wood construction. The properties that wood provide in a boat are actually good not bad. It is only foolish owners that suffer the effects of the negatives of wood. If you buy a well maintained boat, and you plan to be a responsible owner, then wood is actually beneficial. I've got a 1984, crappy wood constructed bayliner we bought new and it is still solid as the day we bought it from the boat show. Again there have been a million that have rotted to our one that hasn't and every one rotted because of some sort of neglect however slight or egregious later blamed on the wood construction and brand.

 

[Trim]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Guys, here is a link for a boat I found. It's a little more than I had originally thought about spending but it seems like a very clean boat and a good price. Let me know what you all think.

http://www.arrowheadok.com/Page.asp...w/Details/2008-Crownline-Bowrider-180-BR.aspx

 

[LippCJ7]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Ok I called them because of 2 specific issues I saw,

First it listed hours at 0 and that's not right, they don't know the hours and that's an issue

Second is it does not come with a trailer so your looking at another $2000(There about) for a trailer

SO,
you have some things on your side to negotiate, it looks super clean by the pictures but pictures lie, they can be touched up you know the story, if its close to you I think its worth going and having a look and get a read on the customer and see how he is on price. This boat is on multiple listings which is another item in your favor as it would give me the feeling this owner wants it gone.

I think you can have this boat for around $13k-$14k without the trailer so I would offer about $11k and see where it goes but that is after I have had either a lake test and or Marine Survey and the hours are in the 200-300 or less range

 

[Trim]

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

Re: Lookiing to buy, need some advice

I emailed a guy yesterday about the boat, he thought the boat had less than 50 hours but didn't know for sure because he wasn't there to look. I would be very hesitant buying a boat that didn't have an hour gauge just because you never know. The boat is fairly close to me. I'm not in a big hurry but am going to try to go out within a month or so to take a look at it.

I know it all depends on how well the boat was taken care of but how much is too much when you are talking hours on a boat?