Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

[t_money662]

Hello All,

I bought a boat (my first) from a friend of mine, engine is a outboard Mercury 1400, S/N 6263573. I looked it up online using the links in the sticky thread above and it is 1980-81 I believe..First off, are there pdf manuals online somewhere for it? I found a few manuals on a link on this site for mercury, close but not my model.

Secondly, and most importantly, there are some issues with this boat-- It was serviced in the beginning of the year, plugs, oils , impeller was changed in this service. Turns out when my friend got it back, forward and reverse were switched. He ended up "living with it" for awhile, just pulling back on the throttle control for forward, and vice versa for reverse-- probably doing damage in the process, I'm assuming, because we took it out last weekend and the prop would not turn in the water. Out of the water it spun, however.

Long story short, he called his boat mechanic over to fix the forward/reverse problem, which we thought was the reason the prop wouldn't spin in the water. He ended up adjusting the shift shaft and switched the f/r back to normal, but the prop still could be stopped with your foot while in forward full throttle. Mechanic said it was probably needed a clutch, something about the clutch dogs worn out and slipping.

He recommended we change the clutch, and while we are at it we might as well change all the seals in the lower unit. He's a pretty knowledgeable guy, and he's doing the work basically for free (we are doing some paint work for him), only charging me for the parts which he said would be around $200.

Hopefully this will fix the problem, I was just wondering if the forward/reverse switch could cause the clutch to go like this?

Also, could this be the only problem, or are there other issues that could cause the prop to spin, but be able to be stopped with a foot?? PS we changed the shear hub in the prop before this problem (cracked), so it is not a spun hub. I'm just trying to narrow down our efforts.

Thanks in advance for any help/advice..love the site!

 

[dwco5051]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

Hello All,

I Long story short, he called his boat mechanic over to fix the forward/reverse problem, which we thought was the reason the prop wouldn't spin in the water. He ended up adjusting the shift shaft and switched the f/r back to normal, but the prop still could be stopped with your foot while in forward full throttle. Mechanic said it was probably needed a clutch, something about the clutch dogs worn out and slipping.

Does this mechanic also play Captain Ahab in little theater productions of Moby **** ? Hope he doesn't work on airplanes too.

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

Did I mention my mechanic was Chuck Norris...he doesn't cheat death, he wins fair and square.

Actually, he didn't stick his foot in the prop blades, he did something more on the lines of putting the bottom of his shoe against the back of the prop and it slowed/stopped. Might not of been 100% throttle, but it was spinning.Guess he heard something clicking or grinding or something and had knew the prop would stop with resistance (like it did in the water).

 

[Dave1027]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

Sure sounds like a spun hub. How was it checked for that?

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

It is the type of prop with the hard plastic hub, like this one:
http://www.tampabayboat.com/spunhub.htm

There is a brand new one installed.

 

[chum1]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

I doubt if there is any damage to the lower end if it ran with reverse controls in the water as long as it wasnt slipping in gear rounding out the square dogs (you would hear it)

If it worked before it was taken apart and then it didn't i would suspect a linkage problem, unhook shift/throttle linkage with boat still on the trailer in the lake/river/ocean, manually put it in gear and see if it moves water.

It should grind/shift equally on both sides of neutral, could be splined up wrong, shift shaft splines could be wore out and slipping......check that first before tearing into lower end.

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

I doubt if there is any damage to the lower end if it ran with reverse controls in the water as long as it wasnt slipping in gear rounding out the square dogs (you would hear it)

Is there always tell-tale signs that the clutch is about to go out?
I was told that sometimes "it just happens"..It sounded to me like there was grinding going on, but I am not used to how that motor "normally" sounds when changing gears.

 

[chum1]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

my experience is they always grind a little going into gear from neutral, once engaged they should not disengage and grind, unless of course its an old johnson i once had

 

[CharlieB]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

It may be a misadjusted or stretched shift cable.

Test on the trailer with the motor OFF, shift into forward gear, try to turn the prop by hand, it should lock on direction and ratchet in the other.

Test again shifted into Reverse, it should lock both directions of rotation.

Now, disconnect the shift cable at the motor, manually shift the linkage and repeat both tests.

Does it shift correctly and lock into gear correctly?

A worn/stretched shift cable will not pull the shift linkage fully into gear and can cause your problem yet still 'push' enough to shift into Reverse.

You may be able to readjust the trunnion on the shift cable to shift into both gears but the better solution is to replace the cable, then you will not have to worry about premature wear on the shift engagement dogs on the gears.

 

[CharlieB]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

I should have asked if this problem existed prior to having someone servicing the water pump.

It is possible that the shift shaft spline is assembled one spline off, biased towards Reverse, which would not allow the shaft to turn and fully engage Forward gear.

Shift the control into Reverse, drop the lower unit, turn the shift shaft on the lower counterclockwise until it sticks into one of the detents and stays there. Turn the prop counterclockwise, you are either in Reverse and the prop locks both directions or you are in Neutral and the prop turns freely. If Neutral continue turning the shift shaft to the next detent (Reverse).

While you have the lower off you can shift it off of both detents and it should be locked into Forward gear. The prop should lock one direction and ratchet the other.

With the shift shaft turned to the Reverse detent and the control shifted into Reverse, reinstall the lower unit taking care to ensure the water transfer tube slides into the water pump and that the shift shaft slides into the splined coupler in the motor leg. You may have to turn the vertical shaft by turning the prop to get the vertical shaft splines to align with the motor.

Once assembled recheck shifting turning the prop by hand and shifting the control.

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

CharlieB-
Before the water pump service, I was told the forward and reverse were correct, so the person who serviced it probably caused the switch. The mechanic that last looked at it switched it back by making the counterclockwise adjustments you recommended.. After that, forward/reverse were fixed, but then the "new" issue of the prop turning, but stopping when resistance (ie a foot on the end of the prop) was applied. Tomorrow I will try the tests you described at post the results.
As for the shift cable, would the fact that the prop spins count that out as the culprit? I've never done it, but I'm sure I could readjust the trunnion on the shift cable if that would help (I'm sure I can look it up or someone can post a link or instructions). The mechanic plans to put a clutch dog this weekend, but I would hate if he got it all back together and it is still not functioning properly..

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

Well, my boat failed the "prop turn test"..In forward, reverse, and neutral the prop "ratcheted" clockwise, and could be turned counter-clockwise if pushed enough (not quite "locked" in my opinion).
So after a check of the shift cable connection at the motor, I think I might have found the culprit:

I don't know how I didn't notice this before!
First thing tomorrow I am going to my local boat shop and see if I can get a shift cable. Should be an easy install, right? Anyone have any tips? I do not know much about these, and how "standard" they are or if I need a specific style, etc..
The other cable I am assuming is the throttle cable, gonna try and get one of those as well--obviously. In this picture, the shift cable is on the bottom and the throttle cable on top, right?:

Could someone tell me exactly how these two cable "should" be normally reacting to the throttle/shift lever?

Hopefully once I change these two cable out the problem will be solved, and I might even need a clutch dog. Fingers crossed.

 

[chum1]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

That sure looks like a possibility to me

 

[t_money662]

Re: Merc 140 -Forward/Reverse switch = Clutch Dog toast?

Just a little update...I put in the new cables and even bought a new aftermarket Control Lever (Teleflex) and put them in, cost me about $200.
Everything looked great, shifted fine to F/R/N (prop spun/racheted/locked correctly as well), throttle worked fine. I started it up and checked everything out, seemed fine....
HOWEVER, Put it in the water and the same original problem!!: Boat would not go forward!
Reverse worked, but in forward it did not go anywhere. There was the original grinding noise again...
So cables were not the problem. I give up...I dropped it off today at a local shop to see what they say. Let's hope it doesn't take too many of those $75 hours to fix it!!

I will update when I get the final prognosis.