New 1st time boat owner

[ssgsquint]

Hello! I just bought my first boat this weekend, a 1996 Maxum 1700 with a FORCE 120 (same yr) O/B.<br /><br />The boat is in nice shape, and the engine is very clean. Took it out 2x this weekend and it ran very well.<br /><br />I've read all the "nightmare" stories people have posted about FORCE engines, etc. The last owner has changed the plus, fuel filter, lower unit oil. Is there anything else I should do? I live in San Diego, so no winterization here.<br /><br />Also, I noticed that there was a vibration in-between 2K & 3K RPMS, but no vibration under or over that range. Could this be the prop? The prop is dinged a bit.<br /><br />Finally, any recommendations on the best prop size?<br /><br />Thanks so much!!<br /><br />Greg

 

[SpinnerBait_Nut]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Hey Greg, welcome to iboats.<br />Let's get this over to the Force forum to get you some answers.

 

[steelespike]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

I won't bash the Force.And if given proper care it should perform well for you.The facts are <br />Mercury ceased production of Force specific parts in 2002.Fortunately your motor does use some Mercury parts.And if you look hard enough<br />there are Force parts out there.To compare; the NAPA Marine Products catalog has about 13 pages<br />of Chrysler/Force parts and something like 60 pages of Evinrude/Johnson parts back to the 50s.<br /> Resale is lower compared to major brands.<br /> The up side is they are a little easier to work on than newer motors.The technology is a little more amateur friendly.The trade off is a little <br />cruder operation.Fuel consumption is a little higher than more sofisticated motors.

 

[ssgsquint]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Spike, thanks for the information. Do you have any input on some of the other questions I had? Such as correct prop size/pitch for that motor? Or the vibration btwn 2-3K rpm's?<br /><br />Thanks again,<br />Greg

 

[roscoe]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Hey there squint, should not be any vibration, hopefully it is the prop as that is cheap and easy to fix/replace.<br /><br />As for prop size, that would be determined by the rpm your motor is turning at wide open throttle - WOT. A different pitch prop is used to gain or lose rpm, to put them back into the recommended range.<br /><br />So, what were the rpm's at when you ran her at WOT ?<br />And what is the size of the current prop?<br /><br />You may have to remove the prop to find the size/part number.<br /><br />"Winterizing" is misleading.<br />It should be called long term storage, anything longer than 3 months of non-use. The engine should be fogged to prevent internal corrosion. With todays cheap gasoline, you should always add fuel stabilizer to the gas. A good one is Seafoam, fuel stabilizer and cleaner.<br /><br />What else should you do to the motor?<br />Rebuild the fuel pump, $10 for parts, 20 minutes time.<br />Replace the water pump impeller. VITAL !!<br />Decarb the engine every year.<br />Use a tc-w3 rated 2 cycle oil in the gas, 2.6 ounces per gallon of gas.<br />Spending the bit extra for synthetic is well worth it for the normally dirty and smokey Force motors.<br /><br />Go to the FAQ forum and read a little about decarbing your motor:<br /> http://forums.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000016 <br /><br />And about WOT rpm range: http://forums.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000015 <br /><br />Don't assume anything, ask questions first.<br /><br />Congrats on the purchase and happy boating.

 

[ssgsquint]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Roscoe,<br /><br />Wow, thanks so much for the detailed post. I really appreciate that.<br /><br />I'll try to answer your questions, but I may have to add more information after this weekend when I take her out again. <br /><br />You asked "So, what were the rpm's at when you ran her at WOT ?"<br /><br />To be honest with you, I don't know exactly, but I recall the TAC reading in the high 4K to low 5K range at WOT.<br /><br />You asked "what is the size of the current prop?"<br /><br />I have to double check on the prop sizes, but I think the one one there now is a 13 by 17, and I have the origional prop too ... that's 13 by 19.<br /><br />I LOL when you mentioned the impeller. I have read that everywhere. It was last replaced 2004, so I already called a local marine shop and made an appointment for next week to do that and run a check on it. I never thought of the fuel pump. OK, that sounds good. I do know that the engine has never been decarbed ... has around 200 hrs on it.<br /><br />Like I mentioned, it runs great, idles great, and the last owner took good care of it (did most of the work himself). Just concerned with that vibration ... we'll see if changing the prop will fix it.<br /><br />I know nothing about this stuff ... but do want to learn. I'll read that link on decarbing and do that myself.<br /><br />Again, thanks so much Roscoe.<br /><br />Greg

 

[roscoe]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

If you are hitting 5000 rpm with that prop, keep that 17 pitch prop size. Recommended range is 4750-5250 for that motor. <br /><br />If you are not quite getting to 5000rpm, you could go with a 16 pitch prop.<br /><br />Good Luck.

 

[RRitt]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

roscoe ... may I ask your respected opinion please?<br /><br />21ft, 2350lbs, vhull. 2x85hp<br />original props cavitate badly above idle with single engine. the engines already have the big wing looking things. I had props cupped and it doubled my single engine limping speed. but WOT dropped to 4500rpm in dual engine mode and top speed fell by 5mph. does this mean one or the other but not both? Is there something else to do that can push boat faster on single engine without loosing WOT rpms? what would you do?

 

[roscoe]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Thats a bit beyond me, RRitt. <br />I know little about props.<br />Could be you need to raise the engines, drop prop pitch, remove the foil, or some combination of these.<br /><br />I guess I would direct you to the "prop forum" and ask for help from DHadley or others there that specialize in boat setup.<br /><br />sorry.

 

[ssgsquint]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Originally posted by roscoe:<br /> Hey there squint, should not be any vibration, hopefully it is the prop as that is cheap and easy to fix/replace.<br /><br />As for prop size, that would be determined by the rpm your motor is turning at wide open throttle - WOT. A different pitch prop is used to gain or lose rpm, to put them back into the recommended range.<br /><br />So, what were the rpm's at when you ran her at WOT ?<br />And what is the size of the current prop?<br /><br />You may have to remove the prop to find the size/part number.<br /><br />"Winterizing" is misleading.<br />It should be called long term storage, anything longer than 3 months of non-use. The engine should be fogged to prevent internal corrosion. With todays cheap gasoline, you should always add fuel stabilizer to the gas. A good one is Seafoam, fuel stabilizer and cleaner.<br /><br />What else should you do to the motor?<br />Rebuild the fuel pump, $10 for parts, 20 minutes time.<br />Replace the water pump impeller. VITAL !!<br />Decarb the engine every year.<br />Use a tc-w3 rated 2 cycle oil in the gas, 2.6 ounces per gallon of gas.<br />Spending the bit extra for synthetic is well worth it for the normally dirty and smokey Force motors.<br /><br />Go to the FAQ forum and read a little about decarbing your motor:<br /> http://forums.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000016 <br /><br />And about WOT rpm range: http://forums.iboats.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000015 <br /><br />Don't assume anything, ask questions first.<br /><br />Congrats on the purchase and happy boating.

 

[ssgsquint]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Hi Roscoe,<br /><br />OK, I took the boat out this Saturday and I have some additional information for you.<br /><br />The vibration was still there (2-3K rpm range), but went away at WOT. My WOT is 5,100 RPMs and speed was only 38 mph. I thought this made sense with what I thought was a 13/17 prop ... but it's actually a 13/19 prop! I "should" be getting 42 mph with my 120 HP, shouldn't I?<br /><br />I have yet to ski behind it, so I'm not sure if the 19 pitch will be enough of a hole-shot for me, or if I should get a 17 pitch prop. I know I'll loose some top end speed, but I don't want to "drown" people behind the boat either! Ha.<br /><br />I bring it in tomorrow to get a benchmark on the engine (water pump, impeller, fuel pump, etc.) per your suggestions.<br /><br />Thanks!<br /><br />Greg

 

[roscoe]

Re: New 1st time boat owner

Originally posted by ssgsquint:<br /> I "should" be getting 42 mph with my 120 HP, shouldn't I?<br /><br />

Maybe, maybe not. Why be concerned over 2-4 mph?<br />Depends on weight distribution, fuel load, gear and passenger weight, engine setup, trim setting. hull efficiency, prop efficiency, speedometer accuracy, etc.<br /><br />If you drop down to a 17 pitch, you will likely raise the rpm just out of the recommended range, to something like 5400+.<br /><br />If you need a little extra pulling power for skiing, get a 17p.<br />Better to run a little high in the rpm range, than to make the motor and skier struggle.<br /><br />The increased rpm afforded by the 17p will make up for the speed loss, resulting in no significant net speed loss.<br /><br />Enjoy.