New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

[CaptainPointless]

Hey, everyone, I'm new to the forums here, but most everyone seems to have really good information thus far. So I thought I'd finally join and get some advice from the guru's out there.

I have an opportunity to buy a 17' VIP Vision 1700, in need of some heavy TLC. My friend is selling it, and is only looking for about $400 for the boat as is. Before we begin, I have not had much chance to go through the boat and evaluate the condition, but I know for sure it will need a full interior restoration, including deck, transom, and more than likely, stringers. The hull itself seems to be in excellent shape, however. There's even some shine to the paint still. The fiberglass appears to be in excellent shape, except for a few small nicks here and there.

Now, I don't have a whole lot of experience working with watercraft, especially not anything like this. So this will be a learning experience for me. I do have the necessary skills to redesign various elements...I did all of the CAD design for these boats in my last job (Due to the terms of my agreement, I am not disclosing the name of the company I worked for):

I am very mechanically adept, and always willing to learn more about anything to do with repair or restoration. So, onto the details about my plans!


Details:
1. Tear out existing deck, inspect stringers for rot, replace stringers and re-glass inside of hull. Re-foam (amount depends on flotation with weight of replacement powertrain.

2. Inspect OMC 2.3L and hopefully sell as a working unit with the OMC outdrive. Mildly build a Chevy 350 to around 275HP @ 2500RPM, pair with Alpha I outdrive unit and redesign transom to fit. Relocate motor mounts to fit. Re-glass transom and motor mounts. Build new doghouse for motor.

3. Design custom fuel tank to be built, and locate farther forward in the hull, in order to relocate the COG and offset the added weight of the 350 motor and Alpha outdrive system.

4. Source a replacement windshield, possibly from a newer Bayliner Bowrider (I like the curved style of these) and retrofit.

5. Re-paint the hull, unsure what color at this stage.

6. Redesign seating to fit around new doghouse, build new seats to fit. Add storage compartments on both sides of doghouse, where there will no longer be seating. Potentially just add removable sun-deck.

7. Build custom wakeboard tower and add marine sound system.


Now, I'm open to any and all suggestions and advice that anyone may have. As I said, I've very mechanically adept, but this will be my first resto/build. Like my dad always says, there's no replacement for experience. Flame on!

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

And here are some pictures of the boat as it sits currently:

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Bump

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Bump TTT

Can I get SOMEONE'S opinion? Pretty please? lol

EDIT: After doing a decent amount of research, one more plan added. Use 4-blade instead of a 3-blade prop, to help get up to plane more quickly with the added weight of the driveline.

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

I love the shape and the look of that boat, but man do you have your work cut out for you. I know you can do it man, so just jump in and just started taking things out.

 

[ezmobee]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

I have an opportunity to buy a 17' VIP Vision 1700, in need of some heavy TLC. My friend is selling it, and is only looking for about $400 for the boat as is.

The trailer looks to be in great condition. That could be worth a couple hundred if he has the proper paperwork on it. That boat, as it sits with the OMC has no value. I would offer your friend $200. I doubt he'd have much of a chance of getting any more than that.

Details:
1. Tear out existing deck, inspect stringers for rot, replace stringers and re-glass inside of hull. Re-foam (amount depends on flotation with weight of replacement powertrain.

Pretty low chance of the stringers being solid. I'd plan on gutting it down to the bare hull and rebuilding. Done properly it will outlive you. Fill all available voids below deck with the pink or blue sheet foam from Lowes/HD. Less fuss and mess and it will NOT absorb water.

2. Inspect OMC 2.3L and hopefully sell as a working unit with the OMC outdrive. Mildly build a Chevy 350 to around 275HP @ 2500RPM, pair with Alpha I outdrive unit and redesign transom to fit. Relocate motor mounts to fit. Re-glass transom and motor mounts. Build new doghouse for motor.

Sounds like a good plan to me.

3. Design custom fuel tank to be built, and locate farther forward in the hull, in order to relocate the COG and offset the added weight of the 350 motor and Alpha outdrive system.

I bet you could find an off the shelf tank that would work just fine. I don't think you'd have much in the way of COG issues because that boat probably came with other (heavier) engine options from the factory.

4. Source a replacement windshield, possibly from a newer Bayliner Bowrider (I like the curved style of these) and retrofit.

That windshield looks really nice. I would keep it. However, if you want to sell it, I know someone on here that would absolutely buy it in a HEARTBEAT! (Rickairmedic)

5. Re-paint the hull, unsure what color at this stage.

What you don't like red faded to pink?

6. Redesign seating to fit around new doghouse, build new seats to fit. Add storage compartments on both sides of doghouse, where there will no longer be seating. Potentially just add removable sun-deck.

Sounds awesome. It's a really nicely shaped, modern looking hull. Done right it will look like a new boat. There's plenty of info here to help you with the glass work and all the other aspects of rebuilding it. Good luck with your project.

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Thanks for the responses! Good to finally have someone else's opinion about my project. So I will officially own the boat tomorrow, since all I was waiting on to be able to purchase the boat was my lovely Kansas Unemployment debit card, and that will be here in the morning.

I'm going to give my friend $475 for the boat and trailer, but before you flame me, please understand this has to do not only with the value of the boat and trailer, but also with some personal financial help HE has provided to ME in the recent past. So I am returning the favor, since he's in a financial crisis of his own at the moment. Also, I want to snap this project boat up quickly, as there are some other people interested that are willing to trade some items that he's been wanting (dirtbike, etc). Lastly, there really aren't any other boats that I've been able to find anywhere near me that are worth their current asking prices, or even worth haggling for. Plus, this one happens to be about 100ft from where I live, haha.

So a few thoughts and questions:

@ ezmobee - I assume you're talking about the high-density Dow insulation foam that comes in sheet sizes ranging from 1/4" thick to +1" thick. If I did use that, are you saying that I should layer it to fill the hull under the deck? Or are you suggesting that I use it as a base moisture-sealing layer, and pouring the expanded foam in after? As far as the windshield is concerned, it doesn't sit quite right, and the latches for the walk-through don't hold it shut the way they should. But I'd be glad to remove it if someone is wanting it. Once I get a chance to pay for the boat and get it to its restoration location, I'll send Rick a PM and let him know that I have it ready to go. Paint? Yeahhhh, not really a big fan of the red-fade-to-pink look. Even if it is shiny. I'm thinking more along the lines of gloss black for the majority of the hull, with white striping and dark metallic blue with flake where the red/pink currently is, with interior coloring to match. What do you think about blue faux vinyl snakeskin on black pleather with white piping? I love the shape of the hull -- it looks very modern to me, definitely not like something that came out in the same era as some ridiculously UGLY cars. That's one of the main reasons that I really like this boat.

As a general question for anyone with significant expertise in this area, does anyone see ANY issues whatsoever with the weight of the 350ci motor? If so, PLEASE tell me before I bite the bullet and start building one. My best guess so far is that the 350 will probably weigh in somewhere in the realm of 250 lbs more than the OMC Cobra motor. This is the main reason that I am no longer putting seating in the rear. I figure that two people sitting in the rear is approximately equivalent to the ~250 lb weight difference. Thus, remove the ability for people to sit in the rear while the boat is moving, and convince the boat it's moving the same load.

I also have been doing some research on the various products available for controlling trim. I am very familiar with hydraulic trim tabs, as I fully designed the one that is used on those 22ft aluminum airboats pictured in my initial post. Those boats weigh in around the realm of 5000lbs, and the 18" wide trim tab can lift the entire rear end of the boat (and 6.2L L92 motor) off the ground without breaking a sweat. However, I don't want to go full hydro, as this is more weight I don't want. I saw the Smart-Tabs, and I'll be honest, they look cheap and flimsy to me, as well as downright unattractive. I do, however, like the way they work, and I have some ideas on what I'd like to do to design something similar, but hopefully better-performing and more attractive. Thoughts?

 

[ezmobee]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

For the foam, yes I meant stacking and layering it to fill the whole void. A number of members here are going that. Here's a link to a masterful usage of it http://picasaweb.google.com/pacerdude/EntireDeckReplacement89Celebrity224se# from iboats member Paul Bell.

Again, I don't know that I'd worry too much about the weight of the 350. I think lots of similar sized I/O boats had a V8 as an option. Certainly a 4.3 V6 and how much lighter could that be? But I'm certainly bo expert in that area.

 

[mddubya]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Welcome aboard Captain Pointless!

The 1st thing you need to do is whip your friends ***** for letting that great looking boat get in that condition,

Then roll your sleeves up and get to work on her. Looks like you're going to have a busy winter, but you'll have a great looking boat come summer. Best of luck to you!

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Welcome aboard Captain Pointless!

The 1st thing you need to do is whip your friends ***** for letting that great looking boat get in that condition,

Then roll your sleeves up and get to work on her. Looks like you're going to have a busy winter, but you'll have a great looking boat come summer. Best of luck to you!

Thanks for the warm welcome!

Haha, I never can figure out why people that own a machine costing thousands of dollars let it turn into little more than a pile of scrap. Be it cars, trucks, boats, tools, whatever! I'm pretty meticulous when it comes to my possessions remaining in good condition. My winter looks to be pretty full with this project, but it should be fun. and hopefully I'll have even more of the engine-building and tuning tools available to me, come spring, since I've decided to go back to school for automotive technology and fabrication.

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

So I've been doing some thinking, and I was wondering, first, what the simplest way to remove the cap WITHOUT damaging anything would be. Secondly, has anyone powdercoated their boats (instead of gel-coat or paint)? I did some research and found places that do it. I just was curious what others' first-hand experience looks like one, two, five or more years down the line. Any color fade? Chipping?

Also, I have been thinking about the drive combination. I know this is sort of a hot topic, and I'm definitely not looking to turn my thread into a debate, but what is the maximum horsepower that can be run through an Alpha 1 drive before lifespan really starts to be affected?

 

[ezmobee]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

If you remove the rub rail that should expose whatever the manufacturer used to attach the cap to the rest of the hull. It may be screws, staples, rivets etc. Hopefully no adhesive. After removing the fasteners....theoretically it should lift right off.

I would think powder coat would be too brittle for a boat.

The guys in the I/O section can answer all your drive questions the best.

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Ok, so I haven't been very active on the forums much recently. Mainly because I was in the process of moving, and getting settled into my new place (on my own, no roommates, FINALLY!). But I actually got up off my butt yesterday and spent the day tearing apart the majority of the interior of the boat. So now with the exception of the bow section, the carpet is gone, as is all of the existing cushioning. As of this point, I'm waiting to have a little extra money to afford an engine lift and an engine stand. Once I get those, I'm going to pull the existing OMC Cobra 2.3L motor, and hopefully start building a 350 (potentially a 383 stroker).

Speaking of motors and outdrives, does anyone want the whole OMC unit once I pull it? I am well aware that OMC only produced the 2.3L for 3 years, and the parts are becoming more and more scarce. I have no use for the combination, because I'm repowering.

Out of curiosity, does anyone have experience with deep cryogenic treatment? The process makes a lot of sense to me, and seems worth the added cost if the benefit is legitimate. There is a place in Kansas City, MO (near me) that performs this service on an array of different items, including engine components. So my thought is (once I find out the pricing), I want to cryo-treat not only all the load- and strength-bearing components of the new engine, but also all of the outdrive components, casing included.

By the way, new pics will be posted tomorrow, assuming the weather is ok.

 

[45Auto]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Just found your thread here after I saw your other one asking about the cryo treatment. Good luck with your boat, it'll be nice if you stick with it.

Secondly, has anyone powdercoated their boats (instead of gel-coat or paint)?

Powdercoating requires elevated temperature curing, about 400 degrees F for 10 minutes or so. I would guess that your plastic boat hull would look more like a pancake than a boat when it came out of the oven (if you can find a place with an oven big enough to do it).

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Powdercoating requires elevated temperature curing, about 400 degrees F for 10 minutes or so. I would guess that your plastic boat hull would look more like a pancake than a boat when it came out of the oven (if you can find a place with an oven big enough to do it).

I'll have to check with the powdercoater near me and see what they say about powdercoating fiberglass. Believe me, before I put my prize hull in ANYONE'S oven, you can bet there'd be some test pieces used beforehand to ensure the safety of said hull. I don't think size would be an issue though, I know of several powdercoating operations that use ovens in the realm of 20' or larger.

 

[madgadget]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Powder coating a boat is a pointless exercise. It will not look great. Will not be durable, peals off etc etc.. Totally not suitable for fibreglass either.

Spray it, DIY it. Then YOU can make the repairs to keep it looking new. Its not had and it can look brilliant if done well.

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

I think I've settled on doing paint, not powdercoating. Seems that for the price, the benefits aren't the same as they would be on a road vehicle. On a different note, I acquired a new member to my little family. My dog, Panzer, has been lonely ever since my roommate left and took his dog with him. So to help alleviate the loneliness, I adopted another dog (her name is Roxy) from Animal Control in Leavenworth. She's a great dog (albeit a little spunkier than I'm used to), and she seems to get along great with Panzer. I'll post some pictures of the two of them when I get an opportunity.

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Hey y'all. Got all the rub rail taken off the boat. Surprisingly enough, the rivets were pretty easy to take out. Just drilled with a 3/16" through the head, and punched them through the other side. Going to drill out the rest of the rivets that are connecting the cap to the hull later today, and hopefully disconnect all of the gauges and stuff if I have time. I will say though, that the way the rub rail was attached was pretty shoddy. some of the rivets were actually put through other rivets. My plan is to fill all the holes with epoxy, fiberglass over them, and then drill new ones to use machine screws to reattach the cap, sealed with 5200. I don't like rivets, so anything I can do to avoid using them is a good option to me. What do all of you recommend for methods of reattaching the cap to the hull?

 

[Matt86K5]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Any Updates?

 

[CaptainPointless]

Re: New member! 1989 VIP Vision 1700 - Resto, repower, wakeboard boat?

Hey, so far as of yet, I don't really have any updates. Unfortunately, my finances were not where I expected them to be at this point in time. Girlfriend moved in with me, truck stopped working, so I'm currently having to search for a new vehicle, my battle with the Kansas Unemployment office has been an ongoing headache, all at the same time as I'm going back to school.

Bright side, though, is that I'm doing fantastic in school. I'm a Metal Fabrication & Welding Technology major, and I'm going to be getting my 1G and 2G MIG certs after the class I'm in finishes. I'm aiming to have the rest of my MIG certs done by the end of the fall, and the first level of my TIG certs. Once I finish up my degree and all of my certs here at my college, I'm planning to head to South Dakota to the Hot Rod Institute, to get an educated background in building hot rods, as that is what I wish to pursue with my life.

The nice thing about the whole school deal is that we have a pretty nice machine shop with all sorts of equipment including the typical metalworking tools, plus things like tubing benders and sheet metal brakes. I'm contemplating the viability of designing and building my own custom aluminum speedboat. Anywho, if anyone has anything to say, I welcome any advice concerning anything at all. Thanks!

~Pointless