Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

[2005bay]

Hey guys-

I had this post over on another forum, but this seems a more appropriate place for this type of question given the repair/restoration and hull-specific expertise here.

Skip over this part if you're only interested in relavent info to the question. Here's the backstory: Found it on craigslist. Guy's wife was losing her job and he need to off it. Well manicured property, clean boat, winterized properly, hull and interior clean (the visible parts). I put a deposit on it. Two days later I come to pick it up, he's got all the seats in it, shows me how to work it. Insists on starting it before I go with the boat, hooks up the flusher and fires it up. Dies after about 2-5 seconds every time. Hits the throttle it goes.... and dies. I'm relatively handy. Told him I'll figure it out, probably just needs a carb rebuild and for the price we settled on I was ok with that. Simple carb anyway and I like a little project here and there.

Get it home, have the same problems. Buy a carb rebuild kit and take it apart. Incidentally carb cleaner is not what it used to be, man is that stuff weak. may as well soak it in maple syrup. I go on to pull the fuel filter, add water remover and carb cleaner to the fuel, and clean the flame arrestor. Who knows how the carb got gummed up in the first place, not going to take any chances.


Start here for relavent information:
I'm out there today familiarizing myself with the motor, thinking about getting an igintion tune up to put on it. Looking for grease points and my bilge pumps. I notice under the motor a small, convex area of fiberglass. Hmm, that's not good. I hop down and look under the boat. about a 6x6" patch of poorly smeared putty with no gel coat on it. Great. Closer inspection reveals a similar repair by the bow, although there's no way to check the inside there.

Below you can find some pictures of what I'm talking about. I guess I'd like suggestions about repair, how serious is this? I'm pretty handy and I have painted cars before. My thought was that I would get on it with a mud hog or a DA and knock all the crap repair work off and get some fiberglass on the inside and outside where I could, then gel coat it over as best I could and feather it in. I guess I could just leave it but I'm not sure I feel comforable about that. I don't want to go to my slip one day and see just a bimini top sticking out of the water...

Thanks in advance for your replies!

Here are some pictures for illustration:
Aft damage, outside:

Aft damage, inside, under motor:

 

[Friscoboater]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

Welcome to iboats. If you can get to both sides, it is a easy repair. I have never done this, so I will let the experts chime in.

 

[Ironpig]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

On the bright side you're about to learn some new carpentry and fibreglassing skills. I think you've got some major issues here. The fibreglass looks as if its delaminating in the engine compartment due to water issues. I bet that there are some soft spots in the floor and transom at this point, you need to investigate a little further and see what you got. The repairs arent particularly hard just time consuming and itchy. The hull can be repaired easily after grinding out whatever mess is in there. Does the damage go right through the hull is my first question?

 

[2005bay]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

continued...

Toward bow, outside:

This is what the rest of the hull looks like, probably why I didn't inspect as closely as I should have:

 

[2005bay]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

On the bright side you're about to learn some new carpentry and fibreglassing skills. I think you've got some major issues here. The fibreglass looks as if its delaminating in the engine compartment due to water issues. I bet that there are some soft spots in the floor and transom at this point, you need to investigate a little further and see what you got. The repairs arent particularly hard just time consuming and itchy. The hull can be repaired easily after grinding out whatever mess is in there. Does the damage go right through the hull is my first question?

Thank you for the reply. So my first order of business will be to grind off what is there with the DA. I also have an angle grinder, how deep do I go?

 

[tpenfield]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

Welcome to iboats . . .

You must have made that guy's day when you bought this boat?

From the pictures it looks like there are actually a couple of holes drilled in the hull . . . is that correct, or is it just how it looks in the pictures. This could be a bit tricky to repair, but do-able.

I am wondering what sort of event caused this damage. . . it would be good to know, so that you can repair accordingly.

You should get the gelcoat off in the damage area on the outside of the hull. Don't go too far into the fiberglass at this point.

I could not tell if there was damage on the inside from the pictures . . .

 

[2005bay]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

Welcome to iboats . . .

You must have made that guy's day when you bought this boat?

From the pictures it looks like there are actually a couple of holes drilled in the hull . . . is that correct, or is it just how it looks in the pictures. This could be a bit tricky to repair, but do-able.

I am wondering what sort of event caused this damage. . . it would be good to know, so that you can repair accordingly.

You should get the gelcoat off in the damage area on the outside of the hull. Don't go too far into the fiberglass at this point.

I could not tell if there was damage on the inside from the pictures . . .

Nope, nothing drilled through, just tough to take decent pictures. I followed your suggestion and hit the hull with my DA and an 80 grit pad. Wow, he had a lot of crap smeared all over the hull. The damaged portion in the aft is about 1 inch by 2 inches, right in the V. I don't see any flaking or delamination. I don't think the fiberglass has been exposed to water, I think he smeared enough of that junk on there to keep water away, and the gel coat was probably still there until I ground it off.

I called the previous owner this morning and he said he had it out one of the first times it was in the water in 2006, and they hit a tree stump with it and bumped in the glass. He used the putty to try to reform the V and sand it flat, but he said he could never get it looking right so he just left it. There weren't any leaks at any point, apparently. The front he couldn't comment on at all, but that spot looks even more minor.

I guess what I would like to do is glass it until its the right shape again, and I'll shoot it with Gel coat with my touch up gun. What do you guys think the appropriate repair is?

Please find pictures below, and thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Some pictures of the back:

 

[2005bay]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

and near the bow:

 

[oops!]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

hi....welcome to iboats.

that problem with hull repairs.....is that if they are not done with the correct materials.....they will look like carp !

post 7 pics one and 2 show that the glass needs to be repaired....not just gell coat.

i can tell you have auto body experience....it will come in handy....especially with the fairing...but i must caution you....boats are not cars. the material is totally different, and in just about every instance...the materials used on cars will not work on boats.
auto material repairs on boats look good for a while......but they just cannot take the punishment...and soon they totally deteriorate.

you will need to do a little research here....you will need to look up peanut butter (a thickened polyester resin, click the link in my sig and use the index) and how to properly apply gellcoat. your touch up gun will not work......the tip is too small, gellcoat is very very thick....i shoot with a 3.5 tip.
if you thin the gellcoat more than 10% you will cause it to deteriorate, and the molecular composition will not be any where near spec.

ok......start by cleaning the area with acetone.....

the repair should be done with unwaxed poly resin.

now use the thickened structural fiberglass filler....(peanut butter) and lightly fill the area....make sure you get it into any spaces or voids.
use the filler to make the shape you need.
then when the stuff is still wet......add one layer of 1.5 csm, the size of the repair over the filler and bond it with the surrounding glass.
then add another layer...larger than the last, and bond it to the glass on the hull......not the gellcoat....the glass.

make sure that the whole repair is lower than the existing gellcoat or you will have a hump in the area.

after that is cured or semi cured....mix up some gellcoat with a cat rate of 1.5% and cabosil or micro bubbles.
apply the thickened gellcoat to the area....make sure that you again fill any void areas left by the rough surface of the new glass matt.
i use a bondo spreader for that.

now you can spray your gellcoat over the repair....add wax to the gellcoat at 3% and cat at 2% mekp.

build the area.....dont just make it white.....gellcoat is applied at 55 thou thickness....and sanded to 35 thou.
spray a little more than 55 on the sharp v so when you sand it...you wont sand through.

gellcoat orange peels very heavy. its not your gun or settings......that is gellcoat....and how it comes out. dont panic.

let full cure.....two hours.

start your sanding at 320 grit with a block or board.
sand till most of the orange is out.....
move to 400 grit. sand till you have all the 320 scratches out.
go 600.....sand out the 400 scratches. .at this stage.....all of the orange peel will be gone.
now progressively move thru 800 all the way up to 1500 dry. (wet sanding scratches wont come out).

when you are done with the 1500 dry......then polish.....

the next step is really important.......drink beer !

as far as the stuff in the motor compartment......we need to know the year of the boat and the size.
that is a far more involved repair.
there is a good chance it will require the motor to be pulled to fix any rot under the glass.

if you need more info, just pm me with the link to this thread.....ill be happy to jump in.

cheers and welcome to iboats
oops

 

[2005bay]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

hi....welcome to iboats.

that problem with hull repairs.....is that if they are not done with the correct materials.....they will look like carp !

post 7 pics one and 2 show that the glass needs to be repaired....not just gell coat.

i can tell you have auto body experience....it will come in handy....especially with the fairing...but i must caution you....boats are not cars. the material is totally different, and in just about every instance...the materials used on cars will not work on boats.
auto material repairs on boats look good for a while......but they just cannot take the punishment...and soon they totally deteriorate.

you will need to do a little research here....you will need to look up peanut butter (a thickened polyester resin, click the link in my sig and use the index) and how to properly apply gellcoat. your touch up gun will not work......the tip is too small, gellcoat is very very thick....i shoot with a 3.5 tip.
if you thin the gellcoat more than 10% you will cause it to deteriorate, and the molecular composition will not be any where near spec.

ok......start by cleaning the area with acetone.....

the repair should be done with unwaxed poly resin.

now use the thickened structural fiberglass filler....(peanut butter) and lightly fill the area....make sure you get it into any spaces or voids.
use the filler to make the shape you need.
then when the stuff is still wet......add one layer of 1.5 csm, the size of the repair over the filler and bond it with the surrounding glass.
then add another layer...larger than the last, and bond it to the glass on the hull......not the gellcoat....the glass.

make sure that the whole repair is lower than the existing gellcoat or you will have a hump in the area.

after that is cured or semi cured....mix up some gellcoat with a cat rate of 1.5% and cabosil or micro bubbles.
apply the thickened gellcoat to the area....make sure that you again fill any void areas left by the rough surface of the new glass matt.
i use a bondo spreader for that.

now you can spray your gellcoat over the repair....add wax to the gellcoat at 3% and cat at 2% mekp.

build the area.....dont just make it white.....gellcoat is applied at 55 thou thickness....and sanded to 35 thou.
spray a little more than 55 on the sharp v so when you sand it...you wont sand through.

gellcoat orange peels very heavy. its not your gun or settings......that is gellcoat....and how it comes out. dont panic.

let full cure.....two hours.

start your sanding at 320 grit with a block or board.
sand till most of the orange is out.....
move to 400 grit. sand till you have all the 320 scratches out.
go 600.....sand out the 400 scratches. .at this stage.....all of the orange peel will be gone.
now progressively move thru 800 all the way up to 1500 dry. (wet sanding scratches wont come out).

when you are done with the 1500 dry......then polish.....

the next step is really important.......drink beer !

as far as the stuff in the motor compartment......we need to know the year of the boat and the size.
that is a far more involved repair.
there is a good chance it will require the motor to be pulled to fix any rot under the glass.

if you need more info, just pm me with the link to this thread.....ill be happy to jump in.

cheers and welcome to iboats
oops

Thanks oops. I will go ahead and get started on the exterior. The boat is a 2005 bayliner. The hull is solid fiberglass as far as I understand, 18 foot. The motor is a 3.0 if that matters. The aft exterior damage is the same as the damage under the motor, inside vs out.

I'm going to get some gel coat and some bigger tips for one of my guns....

 

[adelle]

Re: Newly purchased bayliner apparently has hull issues... repair options?

I have used the Whaley welding to repair a cracked boat and used power drill with small drill bit, a spoon, a hair dryer, a small piece of sandpaper. We have to stop the crack and to heat the patch area and then should start whaleywhelding process.

boat repair